View Poll Results: Small Sebenza vs Sage II

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  • Small Sebenza

    58 25.44%
  • Sage II

    80 35.09%
  • These two knives aren't even in the same class and shouldn't be directly compared.

    90 39.47%
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Thread: Small Sebenza vs Spyderco Sage II

  1. #21

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    And oh, the Bradley would be a better knife to compare the Sage II to.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by freq18hz View Post
    To use your analogy though:

    Your Omega automatic cost 10x the price of your average Timex hiking watch, yet the Timex keeps superior time, has more functions, and will perform longer without servicing.
    Obviously it's an imperfect analogy. I'm simply trying to say that, for me, there is more spirit in both the Omega and the Sebenza, not just better manufacturing tolerances and longer support lifetime; every time I use either, I feel delight. I don't think it's that one is for collecting, just as a Mercedes isn't more of a collector's piece than a much cheaper Toyota — they're simply aimed at a different set of customers. Both sets will use the thing. The Toyota is probably more reliable!

    (Another imperfect analogy: cars are often status symbols. My Sebenza lives in my pocket, and it's surely not the best way to show off disposable income!)

    Quote Originally Posted by freq18hz View Post
    I think the reason why these two knives can't really be compared, is that one is a collectors piece, the other is intended to use. Why buy a 350 knife to use, when you could buy 3 of the other? If EDC is your main goal, losing a 350 dollar knife isn't impossible, or unlikely.

    A Sebenza in my opinion is just like an Omega watch. It's a jewelry item. You can buy it and appreciate the attention to detail and craftsmanship that went into it. At the end of the day though , it doesn't perform any better. It's just a luxury jewelry item.
    I don't agree.

    I've been carrying my Sebenza almost every day for about two and a half years; coincidentally, about as long as my Aqua Terra. Neither is jewelry to me; they're not fancy, and I don't baby them… the scratches attest to that!

    I'd be unhappy if I lost either, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to use them. Having three $100 knives doesn't bring me the pleasure that I get from the right $350 knife… and my Sebenza has certainly seen more work than any four of my other knives! There are plenty of people on this forum who put their Sebenzas to good use… even ones with damascus blades and wood inlays.

    I think the two knives are incomparable because they don't target the same consumers. You're an example: there are people out there who think it's ridiculous to spend more than $150 on a knife, when a cheaper one will do the job just as well. (There are plenty who think it's ridiculous to spend more than $15, of course…).

    Conversely, there are people who think it absolutely makes sense to get the best, and have the money to do so. Trying to compare the two ultimately comes down to two perspectives:

    • "The Sebenza has unparalleled fit and finish, decades of expertise behind it, is easily maintained in the field, and Chris Reeve will always service it for you; it's absolutely worth the money."

    • "The Sage II is such great value: a Ti framelock with superb ergos for half the price of a Sebenza! Why would you spend more? After all, I'm never going to send it in for refinishing, or give it to my kids…"

    Sitting outside is the ordinary Joe with a cheap Buck or Gerber from Home Depot, looking at all of us like we're crazy

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by freq18hz View Post
    To use your analogy though:

    Your Omega automatic cost 10x the price of your average Timex hiking watch, yet the Timex keeps superior time, has more functions, and will perform longer without servicing.

    I think the reason why these two knives can't really be compared, is that one is a collectors piece, the other is intended to use. Why buy a 350 knife to use, when you could buy 3 of the other? If EDC is your main goal, losing a 350 dollar knife isn't impossible, or unlikely.

    A Sebenza in my opinion is just like an Omega watch. It's a jewelry item. You can buy it and appreciate the attention to detail and craftsmanship that went into it. At the end of the day though , it doesn't perform any better. It's just a luxury jewelry item.

    -Freq
    you may be able to buy 3 $100 dollar knives instead of 1 $300 dollar knife
    but you can only use one knife at a time, why not make it a good one

  4. #24
    I prefer the Sage II because the Sebenza has always come across to me as a metal block waiting for finishing rather than something I'd ever want to own. I fully respect the Sebenza for all the reasons others mention, but aesthetically it comes across as a prototype rather than a shape meant to be used by the human hand. (Plus, I wish it had ambidextrous thumb studs.)

    Ask me again in 30 years, for with time I may change my mind.

  5. #25
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    As a lefty, I have to choose the seb (unless I have missed the lh sage).

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenericJohn View Post
    (Plus, I wish it had ambidextrous thumb studs.)
    Ambi studs are a very common option. I went for non-blued backspacer, ambi studs, and polished blade when I got mine.

    I almost never use the other stud, but it's nice to have it.

  7. #27
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    We are comparing strawberries vs cantalopes here. Unless youve used and

    carried a small seb there isnt much of a comparision IMO. They are both

    small ti knives with small blades.... thats where the comparision ends.

    I think a lot of folks who say the seb isnt worth the $$ dont understand and

    wont understand until they have Used and Carried a seb. The old saying

    You get what you pay for is very true in this "comparision".

  8. #28
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    Difficult question. Both are very good knives, great materials, neat manufacturing, backup by distinguished companies. The Sage, despite his better ergos, is a newcomer, while the Sebbie already has the cult status.. This and for this reason only I tend to say that we are comparing apples with oranges.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by holygoat View Post
    Obviously it's an imperfect analogy. I'm simply trying to say that, for me, there is more spirit in both the Omega and the Sebenza, not just better manufacturing tolerances and longer support lifetime; every time I use either, I feel delight. I don't think it's that one is for collecting, just as a Mercedes isn't more of a collector's piece than a much cheaper Toyota — they're simply aimed at a different set of customers. Both sets will use the thing. The Toyota is probably more reliable!

    (Another imperfect analogy: cars are often status symbols. My Sebenza lives in my pocket, and it's surely not the best way to show off disposable income!)



    I don't agree.

    I've been carrying my Sebenza almost every day for about two and a half years; coincidentally, about as long as my Aqua Terra. Neither is jewelry to me; they're not fancy, and I don't baby them… the scratches attest to that!

    I'd be unhappy if I lost either, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to use them. Having three $100 knives doesn't bring me the pleasure that I get from the right $350 knife… and my Sebenza has certainly seen more work than any four of my other knives! There are plenty of people on this forum who put their Sebenzas to good use… even ones with damascus blades and wood inlays.

    I think the two knives are incomparable because they don't target the same consumers. You're an example: there are people out there who think it's ridiculous to spend more than $150 on a knife, when a cheaper one will do the job just as well. (There are plenty who think it's ridiculous to spend more than $15, of course…).

    Conversely, there are people who think it absolutely makes sense to get the best, and have the money to do so. Trying to compare the two ultimately comes down to two perspectives:

    • "The Sebenza has unparalleled fit and finish, decades of expertise behind it, is easily maintained in the field, and Chris Reeve will always service it for you; it's absolutely worth the money."

    • "The Sage II is such great value: a Ti framelock with superb ergos for half the price of a Sebenza! Why would you spend more? After all, I'm never going to send it in for refinishing, or give it to my kids…"

    Sitting outside is the ordinary Joe with a cheap Buck or Gerber from Home Depot, looking at all of us like we're crazy

    Not to be argumentative, because I sincerely respect your opinion but:

    You have a $3,000 watch, and a $350 dollar knife, and you don't think they are fancy?

    I guess it really just depends on your perspective.


    -Freq

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by freq18hz View Post
    Not to be argumentative, because I sincerely respect your opinion but:

    You have a $3,000 watch, and a $350 dollar knife, and you don't think they are fancy?

    I guess it really just depends on your perspective.
    Absolutely! You've hit the nail on the head. Perspective is everything.

    I'm sure that when I was a student, and my EDC was a little SS Dragonfly, I wouldn't have spent the money on even a $160 knife like the Sage, let alone a Sebenza. Ten years later, I've spent way more than that on a bottle of wine. (Only once, I'll grant.)

    When you compare a plain Sebenza ($350) to:

    • A damascus + mammoth ivory Sebenza (~$1000)
    • Your average Strider custom (~$1200)
    • Any of the knives on KnifeArt.com that retail for $2000–$4000

    it certainly doesn't seem so fancy!

    The same goes for watches: an Aqua Terra looks both simple and relatively inexpensive next to a Breitling, Panerai, or a Jaeger LeCoultre. I would feel foolish walking around with one of those gold Rolexes encrusted with diamonds — I'm willing to spend for elegance, function, and engineering, not ostentation, and I definitely have a limit.

    Similarly, most decent Spydercos look pretty fancy and expensive next to a $13 Buck Bantam, which does the job for a whole lot of people.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by JNewell View Post
    Both are fabulous, but they aren't comparable and IMHO it's unfair to do so.

    The Seb is a near-custom quality knife that has incredible quality and design, and it is an icon of American knifemaking. It is expensive, and doesn't really IMO qualify as a "value."

    The Sage is a great production knife and a very good value.

    You could easily justify having both and would enjoy using both, budget concerns aside.
    This seems to be the fairest and truest judgement on the subject and you can see where my vote is cast. If I had to keep one or the other and couldn't replace it, I'd keep the small Sebenza. I like the Caly3 better than the Sage and use it more often. Possibly the most often out of dozens of Spyderco's.

  12. #32
    thecajunblaze did a nice side by side on these two if anyone is considering one or both and would like to see them side by side:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6uEa8sK95k

  13. #33
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    I very much disagree about the Sebenza being jewelry and have a very beaten-up small Seb to prove it.

    BTW, my Rolex GMT II keeps better time than my Timex (which I admit is actually miraculous as well as probably only temporary) and has quite a few battlescars as well.

  14. #34
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    I had a talk today with Chris's son at Blade - and got to handle some of his knives for the first time. I really like spyderco, and have plenty of them (not a sage II), but the Sebs are far more appealing, perhaps its the fit and finish, perhaps its the mystique, but Wow, those are nice knives. At that price, however, I wouldn't want to use it!

    - Charles

  15. #35
    I voted not in the same class. The Sage2 is a great little knife, but the design philosophy, tolerances, and build quality of the Sebenza is another thing entirely. I love the idea that you can strip the Sebenza down to it's parts, clean it, and reassemble without any adjusting or tweaking. Unscrew it, rescrew it. That's it. Doesn't get much better than that. Could use a spydie hole though.

  16. #36
    Does anybody actually dislike the Sage II? I own a Small 21 and used to own a Sage II, but could never like it, though I recognize it is very well made, very high quality, etc, the clacky framelock and pivot that refused to get smooth got to me and I sold it. My Sebenza is in my pocket multiple times a week, is always smooth, sharp and has really nice lines too it.

    Just my take, most of my collection is Spyderco (I actually have a Sage I right now) but I did not like the Sage II and think the Sebenza is leaps and bounds above it... hollow grinds are underrated

  17. #37
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    I voted for the Sage 2. I've played with a number of Ti framelocks and this knife is a VERY good deal. Actually I traded my Benchmade 760BKLFTi for it this past Sunday and have absolutely no regrets. I like my Benchmades and have other mfr's as well but the edge on the Sage 2 is among the best I've seen - razor/scary sharp right out of the box.

    After a few hundred cycles of the lock it's begun to 'smooth in' and I'm happy to have it - so much so I just bought a Sage 1 so I can own both.
    Benchmade fan - too many to list.

  18. #38
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    I voted no comparison. Yes, the Sage II's a very good knife for the $, no doubt, but even in the Sage II's maker's words, there's really no comparison.

    I've had both & prefer the small Seb to the Sage II. Other than the Seb's incredible quality, I like how it's narrower in the pocket.
    Robb
    "Use human means as though divine ones didn't exist, & divine means as if there were no human ones." Baltasar Gracian
    Integrated Close Combat

  19. #39
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    so far, Sage 2 wins for me.
    WTB/WTT for Hinderer XM18 3.5 POND SCUM scale...help me out please

  20. #40
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    I own both and absolutely LOVE both!

    Sebenza: Overall tolerances F&F is better and is just as Sal said "in a class of their own".
    Sage 2: Ergo Heaven, F&F is GREAT, and Price is unbeatable for the quality put into it.

    In the end I love BOTH knives and both see carry!


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