Question for the whittlers: Should my arm hurt this bad the day after?

[KennyB]

Well yesterday I decided I would whittle a little heart ( girlfriend's idea lol ) out of a 1.5"x1.5" piece of douglas fur. I know that's not really whittling wood but it's all I had.

Anyway, I got the basic shape of the heart done, but it took literally all day. Was probably whittling for 12 hours straight... Used my Kershaw "Needs Work"

This morning my knife hand's forearm is ON FIRE. The whole side of it is just burnin' up. Very surprising as the grip on the knife was very comfortable the whole time. I'm wondering if maybe I shouldn't use that particular knife again, maybe it put my muscles in a strange way--ergonomics and all that. It's really odd though 'cause my hand never felt tired once holding the thing.

[oldschool45]

Kenny couple of things; 1) I doubt you've ever used the NeedsWork for extended period of time for precision work, 2) having owned a NeedsWork(gave it to my neighbor) it has a very thick profile and you were probably fighting the knife more than the block of fir. Thinner blades tend to work better which is why I prefer my little Boker Stockman for whittling over any of my larger folders. Even with the thinner blade when I first started whittling my forearms hurt and would even spasm the next day. So yeah its normal
Stay safe and make sure you know where your other hand is...a few of my pieces have blood on them from learning that the hardway

[KennyB]

Kenny couple of things; 1) I doubt you've ever used the NeedsWork for extended period of time for precision work, 2) having owned a NeedsWork(gave it to my neighbor) it has a very thick profile and you were probably fighting the knife more than the block of fir. Thinner blades tend to work better which is why I prefer my little Boker Stockman for whittling over any of my larger folders. Even with the thinner blade when I first started whittling my forearms hurt and would even spasm the next day. So yeah its normal
Stay safe and make sure you know where your other hand is...a few of my pieces have blood on them from learning that the hardway

Yep, that was the longest and most detailed use I've ever had for it. Kind of surprised you'd say it has as thick profile though, it's one of the thinnest profiled knives I have--at the tip anyway. I tried switching to case trapper mid-way through because I know I put a really thin edge on the spey blade, but it didn't seem to offer any improvement.

Anyway, guess I better try a different knife. I can't really think of a lot of knives that are thinner than my Needs Work though. Is there like, a thickness at the spine or just behind the edge to aim for?

Also, yeah, learning to watch where my fingers are. Only cut myself twice yesterday! :P

Edit:

Now that I think about it, I have a little gas-station-special congress pattern that has a pen, sheeps-foot, coping and clip blade that are all 1" long and .050" thick at the spine. Think this would work better? Not sure of what kind of steel it is... Chinese variety 440 I guess. Seems like this might make a better whittler.

[yablanowitz]

It probably will make a better whittler than that Kershaw. Maybe I got a lemon, but my Needs Work was appropriately named. It needed a lot of work on the edge, and even then it would be like trying to whittle with a hatchet. It is thicker at the back of the edge bevel than a good whittler is at the spine. No wonder you are sore today.

[oldschool45]

Kenny if all I had was a NeedsWork I wouldn't even think of doing a chain or ball &cage type project. I bought mine as a Blem off of Kershawguy when I decided that there might be times when I'd like to have a good knife that I didn't mind loosing or permanently loaning out. Kershaw wise my Zing might do a passable job or maybe a Nerve if you wanted to something to do double duty.
You can find carbon steel Boker's a few dollars more than the Chinese Congress in 440? or in that price range RoughRider's have been getting good reviews over in the Traditional sub-forum.
Personally I just ordered a GEC/Northfield #62 Easy Pocket Congress for myself for Christmas

[thatotherguy]

My knife arm has never hurt after whittling, even after 14-16 hours straight. Given, I was using a razor sharp Case peanut or a razor knife, but it never has. My arm that held the wood has been pained after whittling, then again it might just be my elbow working up again (broke it 4 years ago, tells me of a storm a day in advance by aching.)

[KennyB]

It probably will make a better whittler than that Kershaw. Maybe I got a lemon, but my Needs Work was appropriately named. It needed a lot of work on the edge, and even then it would be like trying to whittle with a hatchet. It is thicker at the back of the edge bevel than a good whittler is at the spine. No wonder you are sore today.

I dunno about that, my NeedsWork is less than .030" behind the edge. Not really sure what kind of knife I could use that would get that thin... The Congress pattern I was talking about is probably thicker than the NeedsWork right behind the edge

[yablanowitz]

My GEC Northfield Courthouse Whittler measures 0.020" at the back of the edge bevel on the main blade, 0.017" on the pen and 0.015" on the coping blade, all with edge angles well under 30° included. The part of the main blade that I use the most measures 0.032" at the spine, the pen is 0.025" at the spine on the tip, and the coping is 0.020" at the tip, that being the part I use most.

Personally, I find the blade angle and handle shape of the Needs Work close to unusable in my hands, but ergonomics are very personal.

[KennyB]

My GEC Northfield Courthouse Whittler measures 0.020" at the back of the edge bevel on the main blade, 0.017" on the pen and 0.015" on the coping blade, all with edge angles well under 30° included. The part of the main blade that I use the most measures 0.032" at the spine, the pen is 0.025" at the spine on the tip, and the coping is 0.020" at the tip, that being the part I use most.

Personally, I find the blade angle and handle shape of the Needs Work close to unusable in my hands, but ergonomics are very personal.

Yeah, it's gotta be the handle, because I busted out the calipers... Mine has a 34 degree inclusive angle, and the thickness behind the edge is actually .025"... And actually from the tip, extending 1/4" up, the entire blade is under .020"... Which explains why I found the tip most useful.

So I dunno, I've always found the handle comfortable before, but it must put undo stress on the muscles, kind of how they warn you office equipment does :P

Edit:

Do you guys think a Case Swayback Jack would be a good choice? I want something with a wharncliffe. Otherwise I think I'm going to go with the Congress pattern... Maybe try to find a better one.

[aarya]

If you sit with your muscles tensed up, like you would if you were whittling with a knife that wasn't really meant for it, in regards to thin blades and bevels, it's probable that you've gotten yourself a mild muscle inflammation or some other suchlike. It's basically your body telling you that you've used your muscles a bit too much.
Just as important as perseverance when it comes to whittling, is knowing when to take a break. Generally, i think it's wise to put down your knife, maybe once every 30 minutes. Just put it down, relax your muscles, take a sip or two of water, give your knife a lick or two on a strop, and yawn. Then you're about set to continue.
As for a choice of knife, there are several brands available, for not much cost. Case, Rough Rider, Boker, and probably a bunch more.
I'd suggest going for a knife around 3-1/2 to 4-1/2 inches long, with atleast two blades, one longer and one shorter.
Other than that, i can only suggest you keep on practicing.

[sappyg]

I've never been sore from whittling but then again I've never whittled for 12 hours straight. The more I whittle the less time I actually spend making a cut. IDK if that makes any sense but I probably strop as much as I cut and spend a good deal of time thinking about the cut. That said I rarely whittle more than 15 minutes straight. Also, have more than one project to work on at a given time. ATM I have about 6, or so, going on and it helps to relieve the urgency. It's not a race after all.

One thing of note is that early on I notice that I was afraid to take enough wood on a cut. This can cause a struggle especially with a poor edge and or difficult wood. With time you will learn to be more aggressive and deliberate.

None of this matters if you have a poor edge however.

[mrjed]

Try a Flexcut carving knife. You can get most any shape you want. Thin blade, long wooden handle. Yes, I started with a regular pocket knife. Still use one (especially a Queen Oar Carver) a bunch, but the Flexcuts are easier on an aging bod.

[timbit]

+1 on the blood. I was at the beach recently whittling a spiral on a stick. Knife slipped. Didn't feel the blade cut me, noticed the blood first when I heard it dripping on my shoe! I don't actually know how it happened, because my hand that got cut was spine side. lolol. I cut my middle finge at a sharp angle, so I could just hold the flap shut. Dropped an Eff bomb and then closed it with some crazy glue and electrical tape. OF course, the wife was like "OMG WE NEED TO GO TO THE HOSPITAL". Obviously not, it wasn't too deep. It popped open when I was changing some bearings on a large blower motor at work. This promptly filled it with grease and grit, so now its going to leave a scar . I ruined the piece I was carving too. No one wants a piece of wood with someone elses blood on it!

Also, get a small traditional folder. The thin blades are a joy to carve with!