Food Stamps And The Politics Of Entitlements

[quietmike]

You mean some of those thousands of wealthy people who pay no income taxes on their millions of income and get pork barrel favors?

Millions in capital gains, not income.

[Codger_64]

Call it gifts, the money still came in. It was still income, from whatever source. Tax laws written to exempt their income from taxes are no different from tax laws written to exempt the poor and lower middle class from taxes.

[quietmike]

Call it gifts, the money still came in. It was still income, from whatever source. Tax laws written to exempt their income from taxes are no different from tax laws written to exempt the poor and lower middle class from taxes.

Of course it is. The millions invested in vehicles that produce capital gains help the economy grow and produce jobs.

[Codger_64]

The millions invested in properties, stocks and bonds produce more wealth for the wealthy. Government bailouts produce vehicles silly!

[timcsaw]

The millions invested in properties, stocks and bonds produce more wealth for the wealthy. Government bailouts produce vehicles silly!

GM!! (Government Motors)

[Codger_64]

GM!! (Government Motors)

And Cry...sler.

[Codger_64]

In fact, it is the dimes and dollars spent by the poor, lower middle class, middle class and upper middle class that drives the economy and creates jobs. Wealthy business owners would have to bark at the moon for their profits and CEOs would not get obscene salaries if their products had no market. Only by putting money in the hands of potential buyers can businesses hope to make money. This is one big problem with exporting jobs. Richey Rich and his daddy can only use so many servants on their estate. And even those servants, if paid low wages, will not be able to buy the widgets Mr. Rich's business imports from China and India. Look at the WalMart business model. Always falling wages. They have broken Sears, J.C. Penny, K-Mart/Kresge and others by targeting people who earn low wages as their customers. The less people earn, the more likely they are to look for the cheapest food, clothing and toys for their kids.

[jdm61]

Lest you forget, Sam Walton was initially a Ben Franklin 5&10 franchisee. He started his own store because he thought that he had a better idea of how to run such a discount retailer. Turns out he was right. Isn't that the American dream or is their a point where you get big enough and successful enough that you turn into some kind of evil entity? As for Sears and K-Mart, they dug their own graves. Target, on the other hand learned and thrived. Home Depot did the same thing that Wal Mart did and the other companies like Scotty's failed to keep up. Lowe's, on the other hand, learned and thrived. J.C. Penney does not compete directly with Wal Mart. I would say that the runaway success of Dillards had as much to do with their decline in many markets as Wal Mart or Target. Hell, they couldn't even contain Dillards in their home market of north Texas!! Dillards was kicking their ass in Dallas early on.

In fact, it is the dimes and dollars spent by the poor, lower middle class, middle class and upper middle class that drives the economy and creates jobs. Wealthy business owners would have to bark at the moon for their profits and CEOs would not get obscene salaries if their products had no market. Only by putting money in the hands of potential buyers can businesses hope to make money. This is one big problem with exporting jobs. Richey Rich and his daddy can only use so many servants on their estate. And even those servants, if paid low wages, will not be able to buy the widgets Mr. Rich's business imports from China and India. Look at the WalMart business model. Always falling wages. They have broken Sears, J.C. Penny, K-Mart/Kresge and others by targeting people who earn low wages as their customers. The less people earn, the more likely they are to look for the cheapest food, clothing and toys for their kids.

[Codger_64]

I have no problem with what Sam did. I knew Sam. I grew up in Arkansas and was a customer at one of his first stores before they expanded out of the state. I'm not too sure he would be pleased at the direction his heirs have taken the business though. WalMart employees (not executives) take home an average of $250 per week. That puts them in the class we refer to as the "working poor". I would be interested in seeing just how many of WalMart's employees were actually receiving some form of assistance. Can American garment factories compete with WalMart's .28 cents an hour that is paid to the workers in it's Chinese factories? Trying to meet Walmart's supply, pricing and delivery structure has driven many U.S. companies out of business. That does not even take into acount the small local businesses that have closed their doors forever because they could not compete with Walmart prices. As surely as Sears was, for many years, the World's Largest Store, and now is struggling to stay solvent, WalMart will one day face it's own decline for a number of reasons. Chief among those will be inability to continue being China's largest trading partner, ahead of many nations, if/when U.S./China trade relations come to a head over any number of issues.

[jdm61]

If you new Sam, then you also know that even when Sam was alive, vendors had to come to Bentonville with hat in hand, sit on hard plastic chairs and give price concessions. The major difference now from why I can tell is the stock option plan. Early employees like truck drivers sometimes retired with in excess of $500,000 in Wal Mart stock. The company is arguably to big and the stock is not rising at incredible rates anymore for that to be sustained. My single for life 55 year old cousin has been with Wal Mart for a fair number of years. She is, putting it as kindly as possible because she is my cousin, not the brightest girl. As a matter of fact, not even close and I'll leave it at that. Yet she makes enough to support herself and is quite happy working there. She has, by all accounts been treated quite well by the company.

I have no problem with what Sam did. I knew Sam. I grew up in Arkansas and was a customer at one of his first stores before they expanded out of the state. I'm not too sure he would be pleased at the direction his heirs have taken the business though. WalMart employees (not executives) take home an average of $250 per week. That puts them in the class we refer to as the "working poor". I would be interested in seeing just how many of WalMart's employees were actually receiving some form of assistance. Can American garment factories compete with WalMart's .28 cents an hour that is paid to the workers in it's Chinese factories? Trying to meet Walmart's supply, pricing and delivery structure has driven many U.S. companies out of business. That does not even take into acount the small local businesses that have closed their doors forever because they could not compete with Walmart prices. As surely as Sears was, for many years, the World's Largest Store, and now is struggling to stay solvent, WalMart will one day face it's own decline for a number of reasons. Chief among those will be inability to continue being China's largest trading partner, ahead of many nations, if/when U.S./China trade relations come to a head over any number of issues.

[Triton]

The way it was explained to me, welfare and food stamps is sorta like foreign aid for the ghetto. You keep the ghetto dwellers housed and fed, they are less likely to swarm the suburbs kicking in doors.

Bread and circuses my friend, bread and circuses. This has been done before after all.

[Triton]

You mean some of those thousands of wealthy people who pay no income taxes on their millions of income and get pork barrel favors? I am sure some of them are Dems. And some are Repubs too.

Are you suggesting that wealthy people don't pay taxes?

[Triton]

In fact, it is the dimes and dollars spent by the poor, lower middle class, middle class and upper middle class that drives the economy and creates jobs.

Really? So by golly let's just take all the money away from those evil rich people and give it to the deserving poor. The economy will be in great shape soon thereafter right?

[Noctis3880]

The way it was explained to me, welfare and food stamps is sorta like foreign aid for the ghetto. You keep the ghetto dwellers housed and fed, they are less likely to swarm the suburbs kicking in doors. Personally, I think they should just cut off all EBT funding completely. Within 48 hours the streets of some cities would be ankle deep in blood . . . but a week or so later, the welfare roles will be cut in half and most of the troublemakers will be eliminated from society. Then maybe we can start a revised EBT program with more oversight. Right now, those cards are being passed back and forth quite a bit, and a lot of people have several.

I brought this point up to a coworker, but he countered by saying that, "those people will b**ch and moan, but at the end of the day that's all they'll do".

Which is a fair point. But even if they wanted to, these people are so well spoon fed that I wouldn't feel that threatened if they had a tire iron and I had a knife, mostly because I would be able to reach their morbidly obese belly before that tire iron reaches me. But in all seriousness, a lot of these people are in much worse physical shape than me because of their lifestyle and would literally be pigs to slaughter if they ever tried anything. And while they can afford a flat screen TV, alcohol, and cigarettes, guns don't come cheap. At least not the $1,300 1911 handgun I was looking at. I suppose a shotgun or hunting rifle would be cheaper, though I sincerely hope the folks running the gunshops aren't THAT braindead to not notice the entitled little s**ts and what they intend to do with it.

Really? So by golly let's just take all the money away from those evil rich people and give it to the deserving poor. The economy will be in great shape soon thereafter right?

Actually when you consider what precisely the "poor" buy(chips, alcohol, soda, cigarettes), it all becomes too clear that it is the few among the rich stealing from everybody else. Not all of them mind you, as I doubt I can blame Apple for the current situation, but a certain few among them would have motives to make the situation worse.

[Codger_64]

I brought this point up to a coworker, but he countered by saying that, "those people will b**ch and moan, but at the end of the day that's all they'll do".

Which is a fair point. But even if they wanted to, these people are so well spoon fed that I wouldn't feel that threatened if they had a tire iron and I had a knife, mostly because I would be able to reach their morbidly obese belly before that tire iron reaches me. But in all seriousness, a lot of these people are in much worse physical shape than me because of their lifestyle and would literally be pigs to slaughter if they ever tried anything. And while they can afford a flat screen TV, alcohol, and cigarettes, guns don't come cheap. At least not the $1,300 1911 handgun I was looking at. I suppose a shotgun or hunting rifle would be cheaper, though I sincerely hope the folks running the gunshops aren't THAT braindead to not notice the entitled little s**ts and what they intend to do with it.


Actually when you consider what precisely the "poor" buy(chips, alcohol, soda, cigarettes), it all becomes too clear that it is the few among the rich stealing from everybody else. Not all of them mind you, as I doubt I can blame Apple for the current situation, but a certain few among them would have motives to make the situation worse.

Stereotype much?

[Noctis3880]

Stereotype much?

Tell them not to fit the stereotype then. Not that I'm a fan of setting things in stone, but when you can identify a person's form of payment based on what they buy with better than 50% accuracy, you know it's more than just a crapshoot.

[Codger_64]

There are plenty of not-poor people who fit your description. There are plenty of poor who do not.

[Trent Rock]

Now you have a map to target the hatred of the "moochers with cell phones and shrimp"...

The Geography of Government Benefits

Conejos County,CO=35.45% Total
$9,379 per capita
1.9% "income support"
That seems alright
Some of you would like to lower it to 0.0%??

Post your county #'s
Let's see who lives in the biggest mooch county!!

[BlackKnight86]

[bold and underline mine]

Enforcement and overall oversight falls to the government, which, like in most other areas, does a very poor job of monitoring and enforcing the programs. We actually administer the work component, where recipients (able-bodied) must work a certain number of hours per month to remain eligible for their benefits. It's a great concept, but there are rarely any consequences when work assignments are not completed...or just blown off altogether. Today was the sixth day of the month, and as predictible, we had but a handful of workers show up. It still amazes me the number of folks we'll have show up for the first time on the last week of the month only to find out they've got 75 hours they have to get in by the end of the month. Even more amazing...they often get mad at us when told that even if they worked 24 hours a day the math will not allow them to get their required hours when there'sonly two days left in the month. Most of the ones that get mad are newcomers who think there will actually be some repercussions for not meeting their requirements. Our theft numbers correlate with the calendar date to an amazing degree. When I first started,folks would literally showup with multiple duffle bags and/or backpacks. When confronted with bulging bags of merchandise at the end of the day, the response was usually that they had brought all that stuff with them that morning. Except, for one gentleman I confronted who simply responded "Nobody told me we couldn't take stuff" and another who simply said "yeah, stole it...do I have to come back tomorrow?".

Still, I can honestly say that the most rewarding part of my job is seeing the folks who truly need help and watching their lives change as they get it. The most frustrating part is seeing the folks that we can't help because resources have been exhausted through fraud and abuse. I have story after story of individuals whose lives were in the toilet and are now caring for themselves and their families. Even individuals who had never lived outside of a group home. The folks I deal with on a daily basis certainly put things into perspective for me. It would take an aweful lot to get me to feel sorry for myself after seeing what others have had to overcome. That's probably also one of the primary reasons that I'm so critical of how the programs are run and how the money is wasted.

I'm sorry....perhaps I'm missing the point here; but are you trying to sell the whole concept of goverment running things like this?

[tvranesic]

I'm sorry....perhaps I'm missing the point here; but are you trying to sell the whole concept of goverment running things like this?

No, I'm of the opinion that the government does a lot more RUINING of these programs than it does running.