Age and actual place of manufacture of J. RUSSELL & CO GREEN RIVER WORKS cutlery

[Ishrub]

Can anyone provide age and actual place of manufacture of this J RUSSELL & CO GREEN RIVER WORKS BONE cutlery

[Fixed Blade]

Russell was started in Greenfield,Ma in 1834 and was there until 1870, when they moved to nearby Turners Falls,Ma. It would be my guess that your forks were made prior to their move to Turners Falls. BRL will know for sure.

FB in Vt.

[bernard_levine]

Almost certainly pre-1860. Likely pre-1850.

I hardly never see US made forks marked STEEL, only English. So it is POSSIBLE Russell bought in the fork blanks from Sheffield.

Then again, a lot of their workmen came from Sheffield, so maybe the guy who forged these forks marked them the way he had done back home.

I have seen a very few c1840s American MARKED table cutlery items with English construction (e.g. iron bolsters on the knives);
I have no way to tell if these were contract blades, or just made here "the old country way."

BRL...

[Ishrub]

Thanks for that BRL. So the seller was much closer than I expected to his claim of 'provenance' in the listing description http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/110850695...84.m1497.l2649

"ANTIQUE J RUSSELL & CO GREEN RIVER WORKS BONE KNIFE FORK SET OVER 200 YEARS OLD. THE BOX THEY CAME IN STATES ON THE FRONT:

OLD STEEL & BONE KNIVES & FORKS GREAT GRANDMOTHER'S WEDDING BREAKFAST SET - 200 YEARS OLD" AND THAT WAS WRITTEN OVER 20 YEARS AGO ON THE BOX. MAKES A GREAT HISTORY MARKER FOR THIS ITEM. VERY OLD!!!"

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/110850695...84.m1497.l2649

[TicketMan4u]

I saw the set also and worried the metal looked too good for a set of tableware supposedly "OVER 200 YEARS OLD". Especially since Russell didn't start making knives at Green River until the mid-1830's. Then the thing about them being in the box they came in puzzled me too since Fannie Farmer's Candies company didn't get started until 1919. Maybe he meant the box great-grandmother stored them in. I don't know very much about knives yet so I didn't bid on these.

[Ishrub]

Yes, I was too, but I must say I ignored what I thought was the BS re Grandma's Grandma - the blushing bride and the chocolate box was always just that to me. I thought they must be at least 120 years old and to use that common nonsensical adage, were 'very good for their age'. A set of six pairs of antique knives and forks (with a spare) and the idea of my own bone handled EDE (Every Day Eaters) appealed. I think my $77.77 was good value and if I ever get sick of them there is no shortage of re-enactors etc to move them onto for possibly a tidy profit if sold as pairs (not that I have ever sold a knife yet! LOL).

[bernard_levine]

Re-enactors would not want them because they don't look pree-mutt-iv.

I know a Russell collector who would give them a good home, if you get tired of them.

BRL...

[Ishrub]

Here is another pair with a simpler and different pattern but also with 'Steel' mark on fork. These dont have the earlier forged bolsters - any idea of the age of these. Listing descripion below.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Antique-J...item43a7782f65
[QUOTE "This beautifully wrought table knife and fork were made in Massachusetts by Russell with carbon steel blade and tines with gorgeous cocobolo rosewood handle sclaes pinned over the full and tapered tangs using a 3-pin pattern and reinforced at the boslter using a flat brass ferrule. THESE are the true period cutlery pieces, NOT the inlaid pewter bolstered ones so often misrepresented here on ebay as actually having been made during the Civil War (the patents for pewter bolstered cutlery didn't start appearing until the 1870's.) The set is perfect for collectors or re-enactors of living history of the Old American West or Civil War. Russell has been in business since the 1830's and quality like this is the reason why. Each piece is beautifully wrought and finished, and though there is a hairline on one side of the fork, as you can see in the photos, each piece remains solid as can be, and you could use them without any problems. Price has also been reduced SUBSTANTIALLY because of it (we've sold this pattern before for $100/pair when unflawed). Knife is 9-5/8" long w/ a 6" blade that's stamped, "J. RUSSELL & CO., GREEN RIVER WORKS." The fork is 7.25" long with very sharp tines, marked "STEEL," as you can see. "

[/QUOTE]

[bernard_levine]

Here is a good chance to learn to open your eyes.

These are similar to the earlier ones the same way an elephant is similar to a Jack Russell terrier.

List the differences.

And put the ebay seller descriptions

in quote tags

so we can tell it is they who are insane, and not you.

BRL...

[Bigfattyt]

Shoot, for $77 I say you did great. I have no idea what they are actually "worth" but I would have no hesitation in paying that much for that set.

Go and try to buy that much "cool" for $77. Shoot, I spent $100+ the last time I went and ate sushi, and it was over in a snap.

Enjoy them!