Thanks Sal: me & spyderco vs 2 pit bulls

[dark impaler]

To the op, great post. Good to know how you handled the situation and made it out alright.

[jvarn81]

My $0.02:
Personally, I don't like being around Pittbulls (or some other breeds including Rottweilers, Dobermanns, Cane Corsos, Akitas, Neapolitan Mastiffs and German Sheperds. These are the first breeds that come to my mind) at all.
Why? I know that they are capable of inflicting severe damage and have done so in the past (no one can deny it, just google it. PS: I was attacked by a German Sheperd, my mother and sister by a Neapolitan Mastiff).
I certainly know that how a dog was raised is a major, major factor in how said dog will interact with a person. However, I still just don't trust these dogs at 100% (even worse the scenario of meeting an unsupervised dog out on the loose: who knows who raised it, how it was raised and what are its intentions...) and therefore I just prefer to err on the side of caution and just avoid them at all cost.
And that's my right as a citizen of this free nation. Now I understand that people who love these type of breeds and are responsible owners won't be pleased by someone like me completely rejecting the breed of their beloved pooch but that's simply my choice. At the end, I respect their choice of breed and they must respect mine (and please keep your dog away from me, thanks!).

A dog of any breed can be made vicious by systematic abuse, a dog of any breed can turn vicious due to injury or disease, but dogs of some breeds are better equipped than others to do damage IF they attack. Daschunds may be responsible for more bites, but anyone who says they'd rather be attacked by a crazed daschund than by a crazed pit bull has the potential to become Darwin award recipient. And anyone who thinks their dog, regardless of breed, could never snap is deluding himself.

Honestly, I really dont know what it is about pit's i've seen both sides my buddy had a great one that would never harm a soul, but I have seen the other side as well, ran a call about 4 months ago where a pit killed a 16 month old girl, that he had been raised with since he was a puppy supposedly this was a wondeful dog that had had no problems beforehand, I'm not really gonna go into graphic detail, but you cant possibly imagine what that dog did to that kid, before we got there the first arriving truck a very seasoned medic got on the radio and said"the patient is beyond help" The cops had to shoot the damn thing because it wouldnt let em near her. Now please dont mistake this post to bash pits, because it's not. I am a huge animal lover, I have 2 dogs and a cat and rescue all I can find, but after that day I will be damned if I ever let one of my babies near one. regardless of reported temperament.
YMMV.

You all posted my thoughts.....I don't trust some dogs. I won't let them near my 2 yr old son, better safe than sorry. That why I own this dog, she is more concerned about getting a belly scratch than killing anything. And even if she did, I could spike her like a football. I would also add, I don't trust horses.....any animal that big and powerful can just smash you if they are having a bad day. To the guy that posted the pictures of his kids with the dogs, more power to you, hopefully the dogs never have a bad day.

[bammann45]

Jvarn81 exactly. Justified caution does not equal ignorance. And while I am a softie for cute kid pics those little boys with those dogs scare the hell out of me. I pray I continue to he wrong in that case. I will walk away from the dead horse and wish everyone well

[Buffalohump]

You misinterpreted my comment. When I said 'pure mean' I was referring to their physical make-up, not their temperament. Let's look at the facts: they were bred for dogfighting and have extremely high pain thresholds, and an incredibly powerful bite force. They are also very muscular and compact. And they don't quit. In other words, if one WAS to launch an attack against you, you would be in deep shit!

I dont judge dogs as a group, I judge them individually, and yes I look at the owners first. Unfortunately, it appears that this particular breed has been adopted as the official mascot of dubious characters like drug dealers and gangbangers, so yeah, it gets painted with that brush a lot of the time and its not the dog's fault, I understand that. I think ALL animals that can outrun and outfight me and have a set of sharp teeth need to be treated with a degree of caution. But I am not biased against any particular breeds. I have a healthy respect for their abilities as fighters, you bet!

Your comment is an ignorant one. The issue with "pit type dogs" is the crowd they attract due to perpetuated myths about how "mean" they are. Many people who own pit bulls are responsible and keep track of them, and with that type of owner, they become kind, gentle animals. Many people who get pit bulls are attracted to their aggressive look and previously perpetuated myths about how "bad ass" the dogs are. Any dog can be a dick if raised by a dick. The same could be said for rottweilers. Many people operated under the assumption that rotts were "known to kill their own masters". Dogs are individuals that are just as impressionable as humans. There is no genetic trait for "mean".

I also find it interesting that people assume the owners "let these dogs run loose". While they are clearly piss poor dog owners, simply judging based on the actions of the dogs, that doesn't imply that they simply let their dogs meander about the neighborhood.

I am glad to hear you and your dogs are safe, OP. My grandfather carries a collapsable baton when he walks. He was a mail carrier for decades, and prior to the introduction of the collapsable baton, he carried a capped length of PVC pipe loaded with some type of material that made the pipe extremely heavy. Apparently it worked well.

[Irezumi]

Cro91 thanks for sharing the pics, they are awesome.

I am surprised to find so many Americans against American Pitbull Terriors, especially on a knife forum filled with people who face the sideways glances of an anti knife and anti gun society.

No dog can be trusted around children, pitbull, rotty, or even golden retriever, without adult supervision.

The breed is never the fault, neither is the gun, or the knife. It is always the owner. Shame on everyone here who has stated otherwise.

I will go and give my highly trained and peaceful pitbull x a big rubdown.

[uyotg]

I am surprised to find so many Americans against American Pitbull Terriors, especially on a knife forum filled with people who face the sideways glances of an anti knife and anti gun society.

I didn't want to say it, but I'm glad someone did
Malcolm Gladwell compared racial profiling to the plight of the pit bull's image in this world, obviously arguing against both. I think it's been subconsciously ingrained in our heads from all the exposure to anti-pit bull media. For example, why title this thread "me & spyderco vs 2 pit bulls" instead of simply "vs 2 dogs"? If any dog attacked me or my dog, I'd go all out on it. Sure, some dogs are more equipped to harm, and you can never be sure what they're thinking or how they're raised--as is a very valid opinion stated in the later posts in this thread--but, then again, can't the same be said of people? Saying that it's easier to read a dog's aggression and capabilities based on his breed is akin to saying you're more likely to get mugged by a specific race.

But, who knows, maybe it's valid even if not so politically correct. I used to live in a ghetto and had a hard time trusting anybody, what with all the shootings and drug-dealing going on. One of these families treated their pit bull in the worst way possible, leaving him locked up in their backyard, adjacent to ours, but I'd go right up to the fence, pet him, and he was the sweetest dog ever who just wasn't lucky enough to get caring owners. My own late pit bull didn't want anything to do with other people, leaving all strangers alone and greeting any guests we had; he was content at home getting his belly rubbed. In fact, he was the one getting bullied by the pomeranian we had in the house.

Pit bulls come in all flavors, but perhaps it's easier to generalize and assess by capability to harm, especially when it comes to your own safety. And it's all right--the world is not going to cry because you don't want to befriend all of its pit bulls.

I don't know, hard to pick sides with this one.

[Ken44]

It is always the owner. Shame on everyone here who has stated otherwise.
.

Can not believe anyone would not know better than this, unless they have lived under a rock for the past 40 years, or are just to young to know better.
Shame on you for not knowing better by now

[jvarn81]

.

I am surprised to find so many Americans against American Pitbull Terriors, especially on a knife forum filled with people who face the sideways glances of an anti knife and anti gun society.

The breed is never the fault, neither is the gun, or the knife.

No I think someone should be allowed to own ANY dog they want to, and be held accountable for any attacks. I know most pits/shepards/Rots are very nice, its just the trust factor with me. The farm we deer hunt in Missouri had 2 Rots, a younger one that was very nice, and her mother who growled at me coming in from a hunt every night. She developed this behavior at her older age. A one time surprise attack and you could have a dead child or an adult lawsuit on your hands. Just my preference. I don't dislike owners of these dogs. And as far as guns and knives, you can't be surprise attacked by a knife or gun alone, the human hand must be wrapped around it. I am very pro knife/gun. Even the most rabbid dog lover can't argue a dog COULD lose its mind and attack at some point.

[Texaspridejb]

No I think someone should be allowed to own ANY dog they want to, and be held accountable for any attacks. I know most pits/shepards/Rots are very nice, its just the trust factor with me. The farm we deer hunt in Missouri had 2 Rots, a younger one that was very nice, and her mother who growled at me coming in from a hunt every night. She developed this behavior at her older age. A one time surprise attack and you could have a dead child or an adult lawsuit on your hands. Just my preference. I don't dislike owners of these dogs. And as far as guns and knives, you can't be surprise attacked by a knife or gun alone, the human hand must be wrapped around it. I am very pro knife/gun. Even the most rabbid dog lover can't argue a dog COULD loose its mind and attack at some point.

this+1000!!!!

[schoolbus]

Woah. Sounds serious. Good to hear that your Spidey worked for you in a time of need!

[generallobster]

I don't think you can equate a dog with an inanimate object like a knife or gun. Saying its never the dogs fault, only the owner is denying that the animal has any free will or choice in what actions it takes. Sometimes a dog makes a choice and it's the wrong one. It might have a lifetime of good. Behavior but we are all one step away from making a mistake at some point.

[legion681]

I am surprised to find so many Americans against American Pitbull Terriors, especially on a knife forum filled with people who face the sideways glances of an anti knife and anti gun society.

Like others already pointed out, the problem with this phrase is that a knife or a gun by itself can't attack anyone. A dog can.

[brownshoe]

A dog "can't attack anyone" if it's well trained, trained properly and under human supervision.

My pit will quiver with anticipation when he sees a possum, but he won't leave my side w/o a command, even when off-leash. He's been attacked by a variety of dogs, while on leash. I allow him to defend himself and me, but he disengages upon my command. He's a rescue dog too, raised on the street, but trained with care by a loving family.

[pmbspyder]

Own 2 pits and volunteer at a shelter for homeless, abused, and neglected pits. Unfortunately it is a kill shelter, but we place all the ones we can. I see this argument every time there is an article about pits in the news, forums, etc. There is so much ignorance and seeming hatred for a breed in these usually that it makes me sad. Not angry, just sad. Everyone has different experiences, opinions and such, but please, some of you need to stop speaking in absolutes. To say that every pit is "bad" or aggressive is just plain shortsighted. We all can respect the fact that you will never own one or like them, but to spout them as an evil breed and say it is gospel is funny. Some may even argue it could be analogous in microcosm to human forms of profiling. Take a step back and breathe. Do you really think an entire breed of dog is bad? How about an entire race of people? In all my time working with pits, I have NEVER seen one grow from a puppy to a vicious dog without the help of it's owner or handler. Can one snap? Sure. Can a person snap? Hell yes. Do you stay away from all people? Additionally, to referr to a previous poster, a lot of these media stories that involve "pitlike" dogs are not even pit mixes. I know, I have dealt with many when they are quranteened at our shelter.

To the OP, I'm glad you and yours are ok. You did what you had to and I can appreciate and respect that. To the anti-pit fellows: who seems more ravenously angry and biased in this thread? You, or us "PETA" nut jobs and pit owners? Think about it.

[legion681]

A dog "can't attack anyone" if it's well trained, trained properly and under human supervision.

My pit will quiver with anticipation when he sees a possum, but he won't leave my side w/o a command, even when off-leash. He's been attacked by a variety of dogs, while on leash. I allow him to defend himself and me, but he disengages upon my command. He's a rescue dog too, raised on the street, but trained with care by a loving family.

Re. bolded part: if a dog, any dog, REALLY wants to attack someone/something, it will attack someone/something, unless it's in some way physically restrained from doing so. Surely proper training and human supervision ought to eliminate most problems, but it can't be a 100% guarantee like you make it out to be.
Good that your pitbull is so well trained, great job. Still, if I was in your shoes, I would think it would be healthy to be aware of what I just wrote. You know, it might save you a nasty surprise one day...

You know what happened to me today? Dressed as usual, I was doing my daily 4 mile walk, going my usual way (I am a creature of habit, yes...almost OCD, I'd say), I happened to walk near the property of a good friend of mine. As it happened at least 10 times in the past 2 weeks, she was just relaxing outside the house, with her pittbull laying down to the right of her chair. Now, the way I arrive to her property is always the same: a straight road, no trees or shrubs to obstruct the view, from at least a quarter mile away. Like every other time her pittbull saw me from quite far away (you know, I keep a watchful eye. I am always very aware of my surroundings and, as usual, I saw it looking at me). I expected the same behavior of the past 10 times: just a glance at me and nothing else. Instead this time it stood up, started GROWLING at me and came towards me not running, but not exactly walking either. I thought I was gonna have a problem (instinctively I put my hand in my pocket and held my ZT0560 in my hand, didn't pull it out though). What finally happened is that she yelled its name, the thing stood for a sec and she just took the leash.
Would it have attacked me if the owner didn't get its attention? I don't know. What I know for sure is that it didn't seem to have a tremendously nice disposition towards me.
I repeat: nothing was changed from the usual (I even had the same exact clothes of the day before when I saw it). Think about it...

Lastly...this lady and her husband are friends of mine. I know them well, I have seen them interact with their dogs for many, many years and I am persuaded they're close to being the perfect dog owners, FYI.

[brownshoe]

Legion681, the dog was doing its job, protecting its pack, particularly a female. It could have growled at you because its mistress was not paying attention. It could have not recognized you if you were down wind from the animal(dogs are nearsighted).

Or the dog may have recognized you, but doesn't believe you are trustworthy. You sound like you have an inate fear of powerful dogs (above you called the dog "the thing"), this in itself makes any protective dog believe you may not be trustworthy. Do you know it's name? Do you use it? Did you greet the dog in a positive manner?

When you first met the dog, did you acknowledge it, pet it, did you accept the dog as an entity and not a "thing"? If not, the dog may distrust you for good reason, the owner did not signal to them that you are "cool". A good dog owner always makes sure that people are properly introduced and accepted, so the dog won't see them as intruders.

[legion681]

Legion681, the dog was doing its job, protecting its pack, particularly a female. It could have growled at you because its mistress was not paying attention. It could have not recognized you if you were down wind from the animal(dogs are nearsighted).

Or the dog may have recognized you, but doesn't believe you are trustworthy. You sound like you have an inate fear of powerful dogs (above you called the dog "the thing"), this in itself makes any protective dog believe you may not be trustworthy. Do you know it's name? Do you use it? Did you greet the dog in a positive manner?

When you first met the dog, did you acknowledge it, pet it, did you accept the dog as an entity and not a "thing"? If not, the dog may distrust you for good reason, the owner did not signal to them that you are "cool". A good dog owner always makes sure that people are properly introduced and accepted, so the dog won't see them as intruders.

Well, I understand the dog was doing its job.
However my problem with this is that I don't understand how this dog behaves one way (=just barely looks at me, doesn't even get up) for 10 straight times in the past couple of weeks and then for the 11th time it actually does what it did (=he came straight at me like a laser beam). All of this with no difference from situations 1-10 vs. 11. No difference whatsoever. Even the owner seemed very surprised that it approached me this way this time.

To answer your questions/conjectures: I don't have a fear of powerful dogs - I don't trust certain breeds, including pitbulls - but I have absolutely zero fear of them. I do know its name (it's "Tonka"...). I do use it fairly often (let's say 75% of the times I meet it). I don't greet in an overtly ultra friendly way dogs that I don't innately trust at 100%, but I do not shy away either and make sure that I am very calm, zen-like, at all times. When I first met the dog (this dog has seen me at minimum on a weekly basis since it was a puppy, my guess is about 3 months of age...) I acknowledged it, did pet it. I have spoken and interacted with its owners (=the couple that owns it and their adult son) a trillion times, always in extremely pleasant ways (I like those folks a lot, they're great people and I get the feeling they think the same of me and my wife) and most of the times, the dog was present. And this dog NEVER showed any inkling of threatening behaviors until yesterday.

When you say that "the dog may distrust you for good reasons", I hope you're speaking in terms of canine psychology. If not, you need to explain this comment of yours because I don't see how me walking on the public streets constitutes good reason for being distrusted.

[NightMare Silverado]

Ok I'm gonna wade into the "large dangerous dog" thing. I have friends with Pitt's that are super gental I've never do much as herd them bark. And I've seen serious ***hole pits that I wouldn't get near.

I'm cautious on ANY animal capable of causing serious bodily harm you just encounter more dogs than deer, raccoons, bears, horses ect.

Now as an example I have my rescued husky/wolf mix(vet and breeder agree there is maby 20% wolf in him). My 5 year old has probably stepped on his tail a dozen times and he just let's out a light woof however if out walking this dog showed up he'd scare the shit outta me.

I'm 6ft 265lb. This dogs pretty big