Practical "Club" For Concealed Urban Carry

[mwerner]

The reason that police departments have (almost...) universally prohibited saps, coshs, "sap gloves", and similar items is large lawsuits arising from claims of brain damage from blows to the head.
These have typically resulted in very large settlements even if the officer's actions were found to be justified; that did not remove the department and it's policies from civil liability.
Now, most "use of force" policies specifically prohibit blows to the head unless deadly force is justified.

The civilian should bear this in mind as well; you might well be held justified in your actions from a criminal standpoint, only to find that civil litigation has been filed.

[mossyhorn]

Here's another alternative. It's called the Bust A Cap. It's made to fit on the end of certain model fllashlights and ASP batons. I know they make them for AA,C and D cell Maglites and Streamlight Stingers. You can find them on flashilght sites as well as law enforcement sites.

[ednemo]

+1 hammer. Where I live a weighted monkeys fist knot is considered a slungshot and is prohibited from being carried concealed. I have a maglite that I love, but once again, it is known to be used as a weapon. In my opinion you just can't beat a hammer. Otherwise I would say my Canemasters hickory Street Cane.

[will_1400]

+1 hammer. Where I live a weighted monkeys fist knot is considered a slungshot and is prohibited from being carried concealed. I have a maglite that I love, but once again, it is known to be used as a weapon. In my opinion you just can't beat a hammer. Otherwise I would say my Canemasters hickory Street Cane.

Except that hammers are known tools for break-ins in many areas and appear out of place on the average person. If it's all you've got, then by all means go for it, but it's not what I would consider ideal.

[CWL]

Hammers kept in bags seem pretty useless if you need instant access to a defensive weapon.

Canes, umbrellas, flashlights, even a stainless water bottle with a web strap seem more available as an improvised impact weapon.

[Chris Pierce]

Yeah, canes, big flashlights, umbrellas. Everything else seems (to me) either too ineffective or obviously illegal.
I do like the idea of a small ball peen hammer. Of course that's a weapon too, just ask any of The Hells Angles.

The best thing of course is to know how to defend yourself using nothing at all, and not to look like prey. Also stay out of high crime areas. That being said, any one can be targeted, and it can happen anywhere.

As for me, I generally have a pistol and a rifle close by. I also have fencing pliers or lineman's pliers in my pocket or a shovel or a 16 pound digging bar close by.

[sumtinfancy]

I'd say umbrella seems like a good choice, you could maybe modify the tip by sharpening it somewhat so that it can be used for thrusting at a distance.The great thing about the umbrella is that you've got it in your hand ready to be used in an instant and no jury in the world would question why you were carrying it, even on clear sunny days it can and does start to rain with very little notice in many parts of the E.U.

[killgar]

Here's a question to ask oneself- If you have to use your "weapon", and wind up in court, are you concerned what a prosecuter or jury might think of your "weapon"?

If you use a hammer on another person, will you be able to explain that you had a reasonable reason for carrying it around. If you can't, then I can assure you that the prosecuter will portray you as someone "walking around with a hammer, up to no good, looking to use it on someone". To the average juror, the idea of walking around with a hammer is going to sound CRAZY. Remember, the jury doesn't know you or what a nice, decent person you are. And the prosecuter is going to do all they can to convince the jury that you're not a nice, decent person. And if you used that hammer to bash someones skull in, the jury will see pictures of it, BIG, bloody pictures, in bright vivid color.

And if you are planning on using a story like "I was on my way to a friends house to help him build a deck", then you'd better be prepared to tell the cops your friends name, his address, and you better hope he backs up your story when the go talk to him, and there better be a pile of fresh lumber there. Because they WILL talk to him, they will investigate, and if your story doesn't check-out, then the prosecuter will have a field-day telling the jury that you LIED to the cops. Then get ready for prison.

A flashlight on the other hand can always be of practical use and seems a lot less "menacing" than a hammer. For one thing, you never know if the power will go out at the building you're in and leave you in the dark, happens all the time. When I recommend that people carry a big D-cell Maglight I usually suggest that they paint it blue. Once agin, a prosecuter would have a harder time scaring a jury with a pretty blue flashlight than a black one. Believe it or not, such things can make a difference. I would also advise against the pointy flashlight ends. Why? They're really not necessary for self-defense, they make the flashlight look more menacing to a jury, and they're specifically designed for breaking windows. Imagine what a prosecuter would have to say about you carring around a tool specifically designed for breaking windows. What would the jury think?

[will_1400]

Here's a question to ask oneself- If you have to use your "weapon", and wind up in court, are you concerned what a prosecuter or jury might think of your "weapon"?

If you use a hammer on another person, will you be able to explain that you had a reasonable reason for carrying it around. If you can't, then I can assure you that the prosecuter will portray you as someone "walking around with a hammer, up to no good, looking to use it on someone". To the average juror, the idea of walking around with a hammer is going to sound CRAZY. Remember, the jury doesn't know you or what a nice, decent person you are. And the prosecuter is going to do all they can to convince the jury that you're not a nice, decent person. And if you used that hammer to bash someones skull in, the jury will see pictures of it, BIG, bloody pictures, in bright vivid color.

And if you are planning on using a story like "I was on my way to a friends house to help him build a deck", then you'd better be prepared to tell the cops your friends name, his address, and you better hope he backs up your story when the go talk to him, and there better be a pile of fresh lumber there. Because they WILL talk to him, they will investigate, and if your story doesn't check-out, then the prosecuter will have a field-day telling the jury that you LIED to the cops. Then get ready for prison.

A flashlight on the other hand can always be of practical use and seems a lot less "menacing" than a hammer. For one thing, you never know if the power will go out at the building you're in and leave you in the dark, happens all the time. When I recommend that people carry a big D-cell Maglight I usually suggest that they paint it blue. Once agin, a prosecuter would have a harder time scaring a jury with a pretty blue flashlight than a black one. Believe it or not, such things can make a difference. I would also advise against the pointy flashlight ends. Why? They're really not necessary for self-defense, they make the flashlight look more menacing to a jury, and they're specifically designed for breaking windows. Imagine what a prosecuter would have to say about you carring around a tool specifically designed for breaking windows. What would the jury think?

Very good points here. The "menacing" appearance is a reason I recommend against using a D-cell Maglight but it's still a valid choice. I say the D-cell is menacing because any person who's seen some older police videos/movies probably saw the cops using their maglights to give someone a beatdown. Not to mention they're on the bulky side, hence my recommendation of a smaller flashlight. YMMV of course and both work, just offering my opinion.

[Colinz]

A pair of pliers, geisha balls (and other stuff in from the erotic toy category), a belt that will work like a flail. Just a few ideas that have been mentioned before.

/C.

[Daniel L]

In the movie Lock Stock and Two Smoking Barrels, someone got beat with 15" solid rubber dildo. I guess you could carry that in your back pocket and say its for recreational purposes

I remember the Cold Steel Koga SD1 did have that sex-toy kinda look to it.

[Jeff Venture]

Flashlights. From, use i can say they can take a lot of pounding. Went to town on a pile of dirt and rocks one night as an experiment. It would have really screwed someone up. Ditto on the Koga stick. The guy who sold me one at a gunshow says if hes ever questioned he tells the officer his 'wife is of a particular nature ' lol

[Maniacal Pete]

Edwood FTW.
Just remember to wash the hot sauce off your hands before you go pee.

This is a very discreet self-defense tool. Aside from the fact that I can be an impact weapon, you can rub some of it on your hands and smear it all over an attackers face; he will be blind and helpless. Combine the bottle with a bandana or napkin and start swinging.

Or carry this.

[stabman]

Giant double ended dildo.
Legal to carry, and who wants to get hit with that?

[Colinz]

Well, I blame myself for opening the floodgates on that one... Huge double-ended... wtf...

/C.

[mercop]

I am currently working at a well known punk concert venue/bar, there is nothing in this thread that would not immediately attract the immediate attention of any bouncer I work with.- George

[Uath]

Sure, you have to be very careful about what you bring into any venue like a concert or whatever. Any hammer would be out of the question obviously. I'm almost going back to the heavy belt buckle. I think the market would be ripe for a specially designed buckle (say made of tempered 1095, 1/4 in steel). I'm working on a design right now:

I don't think the standard "biker" type buckle is strong enough. For one thing, they weld the bar that holds the leather belt and it's usually pretty thin. The main problem with using a belt buckle as a flail is that the buckle might break away from the belt and fly away.

I think the standard buckle (with a cross-bar) would be stronger. The problem with them is they're not weighted well. I wish I had a scanner here so I could illustrate what I'm thinking of. You guys might take a stab at designing one also.

Remember, the buckle MUST stay on the belt and it MUST be weighted for a good swing. I'm thinking the buckle needs to be cast, or forged, from a single piece of metal.

[stabman]

I am currently working at a well known punk concert venue/bar, there is nothing in this thread that would not immediately attract the immediate attention of any bouncer I work with.- George

So what, the bouncers aren't going to let someone in with a cane?
Seems to me that would be discriminatory, not letting someone listen to music because they have a bum knee and need a cane.

[TyMathews]

If it were me and I wanted to be non-descript, I'd join the SCA, make a suit of armor and a shield and then fabricate a spiked mace. No one will say anything if I'm walking down the street in armor and carrying a mace. They'll think I'm on my way to a Ren fair(e) or something.

-Tye

[Colinz]

George wrote:

I am currently working at a well known punk concert venue/bar, there is nothing in this thread that would not immediately attract the immediate attention of any bouncer I work with.

A place with alcohol in an environment with loud noise. Two factors impeding communication and increase the risk for violence. Crowded? Up one more factor which increase the risk further. A mix of guests that is there for different reasons (hardcore punk vs. "regular guest")? Up one more factor due to cultural clashes.

Going armed to a venue like this will create unnecessary problems, before and after, a situation would occur where the weapon was used. I am not sure that the initial poster was thinking of attending a punk concert.

Then maybe he was.

/C.