What if "running" is your worse option?

[KennyB]

I see a lot of guys here saying that the best thing to do in a situation is to try to run, to get away. Likely that these are all young, in shape guys that are fast runners.

Well, I have experience trying to run away from conflict. I have been overweight my whole life and still am ( though doing more these days to changes that ) and there were a few times I tried to run away. Not because I thought it was the best option, because I was scared and out of "fight or flight" my brain chose flight. I'll tell you in few words, it didn't work out for me. For one thing, you're pretty easily caught if you're not fast, and then if you have no where to run to that doesn't help either. I got soccer tripped and then mounted and beaten on someone's front yard trying to make it to their front door. No point wondering if they were home or would have helped since I didn't even make it...

So once again years later when presented with that "fight or flight" moment, my brain remembers what happened when it chose flight. A big 300 pound man has no chance unless he's a linebacker... On the other hand, being 300 pounds always means you're slower, but sometimes it means you're stronger and that's what I found. Soon when in a physical encounter, I never considered "flight" again. Why would I? "Flight" for me always lead to disaster, "fight" always lead to success--for lack of a better term.

So now days I'm trying to lose weight, cause it would be nice to just be able to run away rather than resort to physical means. However, you can't just change in a day, it will probably be quite a long time before I can think of out running a person, and even then I bet it won't be as instinctive as standing my ground as that's all I've ever known.

It makes me think though... They say there's an obesity epidemic in the country so I very much doubt I'm alone in not being able to run. Meanwhile there's also people with injuries, elderly, and all sorts of other groups of people with reasons why they wouldn't be able to run away.

So I say, if you are healthy enough to run, know where to run to and won't get caught, THEN it is the best option. However I think there's more of us for whom it might be a bad mistake when we would have been better off defending ourselves through physical means, and THEN taking off when the attacker can no longer pursue.

Just something I think of whenever anyone suggests running. For me I feel like it's the stupidest thing I could do. Turn my back to the attacker, and then put myself at great risk of being tripped and taken to the ground, and I'll let you use your imagination from there. I have actually been through it, so "running" to me just means "volunteering for an ass whooping".

P.S.
I've lost 50 pounds in the last 6 months. So I am getting in shape... Slowly

[killgar]

Excellent post and an important topic.

It's common in many discussions on self-defense for people to promote "running away". And it's the best option IF it is a viable option, but that's not always the case.

People will promote "running away" for various reasons. Some people consider themselves ABOVE using violence, they promote running instead of fighting as the "civilized" thing to do. Some consider "fighting" to be the response of juveniles, and promote running as the "mature, adult" thing to do. Some are afraid of the possible legal consequences of fighting, they consider "running away" to be the "legally safe" thing to do. Many will simply parrot what they have heard others say regarding "You should always run. Running is ALWAYS the best thing to do".

Me, I advise running when running is the right thing to do. Contrary to what many believe (like those I've mentioned above), running is NOT always the right thing to do. I consider it the WRONG thing to do when you decide that it has a clear likelyhood of failure and good chance of getting you killed. As far as "when is running the right thing to do?", that's something that can only be determined by an individual, at any given time, in any given situation. And there's really no way of knowing in advance, with certainty, if it will be the right choice.

For the sake of discussion, I can think of numerous very real reasons why running would be either impossible, or dangerous.

What if you are incapable of running? Sick, asthmatic, elderly, handicapped, injured, overweight.

What if you aren't a track star? Who's to say that the criminal isn't a faster runner than you. I did time with a lot of criminals who put a lot of effort into keeping themselves in TOP physical shape. I watched a lot of inmates run A LOT of miles inside. Believe me, unless you are in GREAT running shape, there are MANY criminals who could catch you.

What if you are wearing dress shoes or other footwear not well designed for running at full speed?

What if you are with companions who can't run? Elderly, handicapped, overweight, not in great running shape, etc. Would you just say "Tough luck, you're on your own, I'm outa here".

What if you are with your wife or girlfriend or children or a combination of such?

What if you are walking your dog?

What if you don't know the area? It could be very easy to run yourself into a dead-end. It could be very easy to box yourself in. Then what?

What if you are attacked indoors or in a confined space? Like perhaps when you open your car door to get out, or after you've just gotten in.

Did I miss any?

Like I said, running is an excellent option, WHEN it's an option. But that's not always the case.

Congratulations Kenny on losing the weight. Good luck in your continued efforts.

[The Logical One]

I'll break it to you harsh, don't take this personally as I'm just trying to give you sound advice. Whether you run or fight, if you're not in shape you're screwed either way. I'm assuming you have never been in an actual fight, but if you have you'll know that 1-2 minutes on the ground with a guy feels like eternity.

After you get popped in the jaw and your head is spinning, that exhaustion feels 100x's worse. Even for a guy who is in decent shape will struggle, that's why fighters emphasize so much on cardio/circuit training.

I have been taught that in an actual street fight, losing could mean death. In competition you have a referee to stop a fight, but if you're getting attacked the guy(s) won't stop until they feel like it, or until you stop moving.

So IMO for guys who are serious about "self-defense", first need to get themselves to be in top physical condition. If you're saying you NEED a weapon because you're overweight or old, that's not a good enough reason. If you're overweight, get in shape. If you're old, get in shape. I've known 50 yr old guys who could kick my a**. A knife won't do you any good if you swing it a couple of times and you're out of breath.

It's good that you're trying to lose weight and get in shape. An attacker is less likely to try to prey on a guy who's muscular and looks like he can whoop their ass, but would rather prey on someone they look like they can take advantage of. Just by looking in shape you already lessened your chances of becoming a victim.

[will_1400]

My thoughts on self defense: do whatever keeps you in one piece. I'm all for diplomacy and running away; means I don't have to heal and a bruised ego isn't fatal unless I get silicate vaginitis over it. But I also prepare for situations where violence is the most efficient solution to the problem, the situations where running or trying to talk will likely get me killed. Use whatever's available to you to stay in one piece and remember the following: he who attacks must conquer while he who defends needs only to survive.

[KennyB]

I think what you're saying is probably true, but I've never been in an altercation that lasted that long. I have been in a number of fights actually, but I don't recall many ending up on the ground and none ever lasted long. My guess is I was facing rather unmotivated attackers who didn't expect me to be as capable as I was.

Funny you should mention people not wanting to pick on a muscular looking person. Can't comment on that, but as a tall and fat guy I have ran into my fair share of guys wanting to start something with me to prove a point or to test themselves or something. It's an interesting thing, and I think it's a matter of them picking a target who is large, but also dumpy looking so they think they can take them.

I agree with the "get in shape" part. There's no excuse not to, but I'm talking about in the meantime, and as killgar pointed out there could be other limiting factors that one cannot change.

[SeaxyBeast]

Following up on what The Logical One says. I'm in decent shape - in my 40s but I can run a 10k at an 8:00 pace without a struggle. I've been feeling pretty good about this and the fact that I no longer get gassed at escrima very often.

Then the other night the guro stuck us all in a confined space and made us fight off an attacker with a knife in a situation where we couldn't leave. We had to do this with three different attackers before we rotated out to be an attacker and if we tired and lost we had to do it over. I was sucking wind and slow footed before I hit attacker #3.

It's not about running OR fighting, it's about surviving. If you try to get away you might still have to fight, or you might have to fight a bit to get the chance to get away. And whether you decide to try to get away or to make the attacker unable to continue the attack: if you are doing it with muscle power you will probably end up sucking wind and wanting to puke by the time it's over even if you have the good fortune to come out relatively unhurt.

[mwerner]

It would be most amusing for my attackers to watch me attempt to run away. The laughter might disable them....

[killgar]

So IMO for guys who are serious about "self-defense", first need to get themselves to be in top physical condition. If you're saying you NEED a weapon because you're overweight or old, that's not a good enough reason. If you're overweight, get in shape. If you're old, get in shape. I've known 50 yr old guys who could kick my a**. A knife won't do you any good if you swing it a couple of times and you're out of breath.

While I agree that people should make an effort to get and stay in shape, I wouldn't judge how serious a person is about self-defense based on their physical condition. How many personal trainers do we have here? How many olympic athletes? Exactly what constitutes "top physical condition"? Does one need to be in the same shape as a proffesional boxer to be serious about self-defense and have the right to carry a weapon?

I can think of MANY reasons why a person might not be in top physical condition, bad knees, bad back, arthritis, asthma, heart condition, etc, etc. Like I said, I wouldn't judge how serious a person is about self-defense based on the shape they are in. And I wouldn't suggest that they deny themselves the use of a weapon because they're not in top physical condition.

It's good that you're trying to lose weight and get in shape. An attacker is less likely to try to prey on a guy who's muscular and looks like he can whoop their ass, but would rather prey on someone they look like they can take advantage of. Just by looking in shape you already lessened your chances of becoming a victim.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Being big, or muscular, or in great fighting shape, are no garuntees that you won't be attacked. And they are certainly no garuntee that you will survive. Not every criminal cares how big a guy is, and if the criminal is armed, they might care even less.

As far as a persons ability to physically persevere in a fight, there are several factors to consider- physical condition is one, but adrenaline and the sheer will to live are others. Those last two can be extremely powerful things. Ordinary people have performed incredible feats with nothing more.

[will_1400]

While I agree that people should make an effort to get and stay in shape, I wouldn't judge how serious a person is about self-defense based on their physical condition. How many personal trainers do we have here? How many olympic athletes? Exactly what constitutes "top physical condition"? Does one need to be in the same shape as a proffesional boxer to be serious about self-defense and have the right to carry a weapon?

I can think of MANY reasons why a person might not be in top physical condition, bad knees, bad back, arthritis, asthma, heart condition, etc, etc. Like I said, I wouldn't judge how serious a person is about self-defense based on the shape they are in. And I wouldn't suggest that they deny themselves the use of a weapon because they're not in top physical condition.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Being big, or muscular, or in great fighting shape, are no garuntees that you won't be attacked. And they are certainly no garuntee that you will survive. Not every criminal cares how big a guy is, and if the criminal is armed, they might care even less.

As far as a persons ability to physically persevere in a fight, there are several factors to consider- physical condition is one, but adrenaline and the sheer will to live are others. Those last two can be extremely powerful things. Ordinary people have performed incredible feats with nothing more.

Sheer viciousness and ferocity will go far in a self defense scenario. I hate to quote Hollywood, but as Ra's al-Guhl said in Batman Begins: "Skill means nothing without the will to use it."

[Goosey]

Funny you should mention people not wanting to pick on a muscular looking person. Can't comment on that, but as a tall and fat guy I have ran into my fair share of guys wanting to start something with me to prove a point or to test themselves or something.

This happens with dogs as well. I've heard that was the reason why spiked collars are sometimes used to protect tough looking dog's necks...

[CWL]

Run or not, in shape or not, even more important is that one must have awareness of his/her surroundings and be able to not get into a bad situation in the first place. Usually called "situational awareness", this can also be called "gut instincts". Do what your gut tells you, if that means to not take that shortcut into a dark alley, call a cab instead of walking, going the other direction when something doesn't feel right, etc. etc.

Sure it's great to be fit and well-trained, but there are plenty of fit people who get beaten, maimed or killed every day. Don't forget that your brains also need exercise.