Is precision ground stainlesss steel worth the extra cost? Your opinions please!

[LARRYZ10]

Hi, I like to design my blades ,profile them, grind them and filework them but I hate to flatten them. Am I the only one? Is it worth the money to buy the barstock precision ground? Your opinions would be appreciated. I have been flattening them by using a 4 x 36 belt sander and also by holding them to my platen with a block of wood with several rare earth magnets in it. Is there a better way that a normal guy can afford? Thanks for you help. Larry Lehman Bakersfield, Ca

[thartman]

I recently started buying precision ground stainless steel just for the reason you mentioned. As well as cutting out the the added wear on belts and the time it takes to flatten out a blank I find it useful where having an exact thickness makes a difference. For me that difference is when I'm working on a folder or a knife that requires a double guard that slides over the blade. My next steel purchase will not be precision ground because I'm going to check out Aldos ground steel and see if that will meet my needs.

[mete]

What you don't want is decarburization. If you could just get decarb free steel that would be nice . The precision ground is decarb free but you don't need the precision part ! Have you asked the NJ Steel Baron ??

[TooQuiet]

Where do you get precision ground stainless from?

[Mudbug007]

If you ever grind CPM 154 with the scale on, you'll answer your own question very quickly. Yes, precision ground stainless is worth the extra cost and then some.

I think Aldo at the New Jersey Steel Baron is offering PG stainless now.

[Daniel Fairly Knives]

I think having the steel ground in advance is economically sound, I haven't done the math but it will probably save you money in the long run.

I always get ground steel if I can.

[SBuzek]

YES

Stan

[rustyrazor]

...one step further. how about water jet/laser cutting the blanks??? while we're on the topic. the way i see it, it takes me about an hour to an hour and a half to copy the profile, drill the entire way around it with 1/8 drill bits, hacksaw out the blank then belt sand and grind it to match my design. that being the case, it must be a huge time/cost saver to have them pre cut as well. is anyone doing this and how do you find it (pros and cons)

thanks

Royce

[Bill DeShivs]

A $250 bandsaw would make your life much easier. If you are duplicating patterns, waterjet is the way to go.

[rustyrazor]

A $250 bandsaw would make your life much easier. If you are duplicating patterns, waterjet is the way to go.

i have a bandsaw, but don't you find that the blades wear out very fast on those? i find, hacksaw and tricep give me better results on blade steels. I am using cheap "metal" bandsaw blades, but is their a brand that is recommended? I'm looking into waterjet and PG steel at the moment for my "production" types, but i would love a bandsaw to profile my one-offs.

[Mitchell Knives]

PG steel is the way to go.

The added cost of the steel is made up in belt savings.

[Robert Dark]

PG is the way to go, however, just remember that you still have a fair amount of hand sanding to do on the flats (depending on the final finish you want on your blades).

Most of the PG I have received over the years had what I would call a 60 to 80 grit finish. It still beats eating your belts and trying to keep everything nice and even.

Robert

[Bill DeShivs]

A metal-cutting bandsaw with a good 24 TPI bi-metal blade wears very well.
I think you must be using a saw designed for cutting wood. These won't work for cutting metal.

[thartman]

Where do you get precision ground stainless from?

I have been buying from Jantz.

[medicevans]

Awesome! Now I know where to get PG stainless. I still will buy all my non-Stainless PG from Aldo though. I don't think he has pg stainless yet.

As far as Waterjet, I sent a bunch of patterns to Aldo's guy in NJ over a month ago. I've gotten the "you'll have the quotes tomorrow" line from the Waterjet guy three times now. I'm done messing with him. Apparently he doesn't want my money. Anyone know where else is good?

Eta:
A $90 harbor freight portaband and 24 tpi Milwalkee brand blades are a wonderful thing! Best money I've ever spent. Saves a lot of time!

[fumbler]

Just a note, not all ground steel is precision ground. What Aldo sells is ground but not precision ground. The thickness can sometimes vary more than precision ground but it is consistent enough for what we do. However, the big part is on the edges. Every piece of ground steel I've gotten from Aldo is thinner than the rest of the stock at about 0.2-0.3" from the edges. That means if you buy 0.172" thick steel the edge can be as thin as 0.155" (on the pieces I've bought). This can be a major pain in the butt if you design a 1.25" wide knife to fit onto 1.5" stock because you'll end up having to grind it into thinner stock.

Having said that, it's still worth buying Aldo's ground steel, just buy it an extra 0.5" wider than you need. You'll spend more but it's still cheaper than buying true precision ground steel and cheaper than spending time and money on belts to decarb the stock.

True precision ground steel is great to work with as you can utilize every bit of it without having to grind/sand the flats too much.

[rustyrazor]

Yeah, Good to know... ive been talking to Aldo myself on this matter and am looking into getting some "PG" steel myself (as well as some of the waterjet for a run of knives) this is some good info. And i guess it's time to get better blades for the bandsaw.

[medicevans]

Never skimp on anything that cuts. Knives, saw blades, abrasives. It's just a false economy.

As far as PG steel vs ground steel:
Ground steel will definitely save belts. 100% worth it. I use PG for folders, where .001" will cause a big gap. I really need a surface grinder soon.

[LARRYZ10]

I can get it from Jantz knife supply in Oklahoma. Larry . they will get you a catalog.

[fumbler]

...one step further. how about water jet/laser cutting the blanks??? while we're on the topic. the way i see it, it takes me about an hour to an hour and a half to copy the profile, drill the entire way around it with 1/8 drill bits, hacksaw out the blank then belt sand and grind it to match my design. that being the case, it must be a huge time/cost saver to have them pre cut as well. is anyone doing this and how do you find it (pros and cons)

Tons of knifemakers have their stuff waterjet cut. The waterjet cutting price per piece varies depending on quantity, steel type, thickness, cut finish, etc. Overall if you plan on making more than a few knives it's well worth the price. As an example, I have my blanks waterjet cut locally and it cost me about $10.50 each if I want twelve 9" blanks (it can be much cheaper at higher volumes). Doing it myself would take probably 30-45 minutes a piece. When you factor in my time it is cheaper to use a waterjet but an even bigger bonus is I really hate drilling holes. It's a pain in the butt to consistently locate and drill a ton of holes and while I'm drilling all I can think is "I'd rather be grinding..."

The only downside is you either have to digitize your blank into a cad file that the waterjet can use or you have to pay someone to do it for you. That's just a single startup thing though and once that file is created it's easy to make tweaks for future batches.