GEC Glow Bullnose problems

[richstag]

Thanks gentleman. If they say it right there then is should come as no surprise.

[Modoc ED]

If when GEC included the phrase; "We did so by utilizing innovative processes, less expensive materials and far fewer labor operations" about their Field & Farm line then we can't expect to return our Farm & Field economy knives and expect GEC to bring then up to the specs of a first rate GEC knife.

There's a thread floating around somewhere generally titled "What to Expect from the New GEC Farm & Field Line". It's about two maybe three months old. We all should know what to expect by now. It was discussed to death in that thread that the Farm & Field line most likely would not meet the same standards as GEC's top of the line knives.

[richstag]

If when GEC included the phrase; "We did so by utilizing innovative processes, less expensive materials and far fewer labor operations" about their Field & Farm line then we can't expect to return our Farm & Field economy knives and expect GEC to bring then up to the specs of a first rate GEC knife.

There's a thread floating around somewhere generally titled "What to Expect from the New GEC Farm & Field Line". It's about two maybe three months old. We all should know what to expect by now. It was discussed to death in that thread that the Farm & Field line most likely would not meet the same standards as GEC's top of the line knives.

Next time I will study more for the test

Again, thanks Jake and Ed for setting the record straight.

It is appreciated.

[Modoc ED]

Well, "far fewer labor operations" has gotta add up to a far less appealing knife appearance wise to some degree.

[rockgolfer]

I remember reading how hard it was to get GEC to make these in the first place. I am sure quality expectations from the consumer played a roll in this. Now I can see where GEC is coming from. They put out a knife for 50 bucks thats close to about half the cost of most of their knives. It is not meant to be a collectible but a pocketed user. The plastic scales show scratches after just a few days carry. These knives are not intended to be pretty. You get what you pay for and though its double the price of other soddies from other companies well thats ok to. Those other brands knives usually sell for that same 50% less. You have to look at the big picture. I know what I get from GEC for that extra cost, it is worth it for me. It may not be worth it to you.

If you are unhappy with it then thats fine. By all means return it but I would caution about buying another, you may just get more of the same. Quality in form and function is what I expect from a working mans knife. If I want the fit and finish to stun, well I am stepping up to a Northfield. I can understand your frustration due to your previous experience with the Redneck. I would add that at least publicly, it was looked at as a one time offering. Not as something that would be released in a series now known as the Farm & Field tool line. Bumping it from special addition to a regularly produced knife changes things. They need to make 300 now instead of 30. We have been spoiled, a budget line can not be perfect. Heck nothing is perfect, compromises are a reality.

[Dan57]

Nvr mind...

[Currahee]

I'm just curious about how the OP would regard this pivot area?

When I look at this picture I can see the grind marks quite clearly. Even a little separation between the delrin and the pivot in the 6 to 7 o'clock position.

In my hand this area feels perfectly flush and smooth. My fingers cannot detect the grind marks on the pivot area. Until I read the comments in this thread I regarded my F&F Bullnose to be absolutely perfect. Now, after carefully scrutinizing my knife, I will acknowledge that, yes, there are some very subtle flaws that are obvious when placed under a magnifying glass. I will concede that my economy class Bullnose is not a flawless diamond. But, for the money I paid for this working knife, I will continue to regard it as absolute perfection. I guess we all have different expectations? I will also add that this comment is in no way an attempt to invalidate the OP's feelings about his particular knife. Those are his feelings and they are indeed valid. I'm just saying that I am quite happy with my F&F Bullnose and will probably go on to buy another one in black. 'Nuff said.

[supratentorial]

Currahee, Nice photo! (puts my photo to shame ) I would say that mine are very similar.

[midnight flyer]

Corndog... if you don't like the knife, send it back. Pretty simple, really. Like many folks that buy CASE products, you get spoiled when you get a good one and you think the will all be nice knives. Not so, as you have seen. If you bought from a reputable dealer and haven't done anything to the knife there shouldn't be any problems.

And the guys have done a good turn by helping you manage your expectations. Expect a lot less and you will be fine. BUT, I must say if you are going to expect less then you could easily fill the bill of a great workman's knife in this design by purchasing the Queen or CASE equivalent. You would be surprised at how good the quality is on some of the competition for that model of knife. I had a CASE myself that was so/so for appearance, excellent for work, and a Queen that is fit and finished quite well and comes in D2. SHIPPED, the Queen was less than half the price of the GEC. Now there is a traditional working man's knife at working man's price.

The best thing about the CASE and Queen offerings is that unlike the GECs, you can find them at different places and actually pick the very knife you buy. Hard to screw that up.

If you want a worker, there are a lot of very serviceable sodbuster offerings out there from around the globe. It seems that if you have your heart set on a GEC work knife, you pay your money and take your chances in this line, just like most makers these days. Who knows, if you buy another one when the wheel spins you might get another one as nice as the first GEC worker you purchased. On the other hand, you could wind up with what you have. Certainly not bad fit an finish for a real working knife. I know most GEC folks are collectors, but this isn't the collector line.

Robert

[pinnah]

Well, "far fewer labor operations" has gotta add up to a far less appealing knife appearance wise to some degree.

In my experience, it depends on whether or not you're talking about simple designs or designs that emphasize artistic flurish.

If we're talking about the former, then I think automated processes tend to hit more consistently high levels of quality, provided the tooling is recent and the QC processes are well monitored. I think economy of scale tends to kick in at this point, favoring larger companies who can invest and (more importantly) continually re-invest in their tooling. I would think that Buck and Victorinox are examples of companies who show how good this can be. My last 3 Bucks aren't elegant knives by any stretch but they've been excellent.

Looking at some of pictures i this thread, I see a mixture of things I would and would NOT expect from my Bucks. That lanyard hole just looks sloppy - the sort of thing I would expect if I purchased a "factory reject" Buck, but not a standard Buck. Ditto those pivot grind marks.

On the other hand, the Buck lockbacks I own typically don't have flush backsprings. This doesn't bother me in the slightest. But the knives are Bucks, not Tony Bose customs, so in this sense, yes, I expect less.

The line from GEC continues to confuse me. Are these real working knives or homage knives? If it's the latter then they need to really focus on fit and finish. But even if it's the former, I would expect at least a Buck or Victorinox level of fit of finish. Not sure those pictures are at that level.

[richstag]

Corndog... if you don't like the knife, send it back. Pretty simple, really. Like many folks that buy CASE products, you get spoiled when you get a good one and you think the will all be nice knives. Not so, as you have seen. If you bought from a reputable dealer and haven't done anything to the knife there shouldn't be any problems.

And the guys have done a good turn by helping you manage your expectations. Expect a lot less and you will be fine. BUT, I must say if you are going to expect less then you could easily fill the bill of a great workman's knife in this design by purchasing the Queen or CASE equivalent. You would be surprised at how good the quality is on some of the competition for that model of knife. I had a CASE myself that was so/so for appearance, excellent for work, and a Queen that is fit and finished quite well and comes in D2. SHIPPED, the Queen was less than half the price of the GEC. Now there is a traditional working man's knife at working man's price.

The best thing about the CASE and Queen offerings is that unlike the GECs, you can find them at different places and actually pick the very knife you buy. Hard to screw that up.

If you want a worker, there are a lot of very serviceable sodbuster offerings out there from around the globe. It seems that if you have your heart set on a GEC work knife, you pay your money and take your chances in this line, just like most makers these days. Who knows, if you buy another one when the wheel spins you might get another one as nice as the first GEC worker you purchased. On the other hand, you could wind up with what you have. Certainly not bad fit an finish for a real working knife. I know most GEC folks are collectors, but this isn't the collector line.

Robert

Robert,

This is kind of what I am leaning towards. I highlighted some of your points in red. D2 is a tremendous steel for a thin blade you will slice and cut abrasive materials with a lot. It was the whole package that got me with the original test run GEC Bullnose.

Im reserving any further speculation on what will be until we actually see what happens, but I could just as easily go for the Queen if the fit and finish end up on the same level. I wonder how Queen's sodbuster will turn out with the new ownership. More speculation, I guess its better just to wait and see.

Kevin

[supratentorial]

I opened my other "glow-nose" and found some other flaws that haven't been mentioned yet. It has a slightly off center blade and some grind markers on the bare head on the mark side.

Since Queen is mentioned here I'll also mention that the problem that I have with Queen is the grind. For me it's not an alternative. I hope Queen addresses this problem under the new ownership. I do see Case as an alternative.

Here's a photo of a reprofiled Queen. That's a mighty big edge bevel and very thick steel behind it.

More examples...

My problem with Queen's edges in the recent past is that either the blades are being blanked much narrower from spine to edge than the same models from the past, and being left much thicker on the primary grind, or the factory "sharpening" is grinding away an amount of steel equivalent to ten years worth of normal sharpening, or maybe more. Judging by the "tooth" that was left next to the choil on the blades of my Queen made forum Moose, I'd say it was the latter. I'd much rather receive a knife with no secondary bevel at all and a flat edge than having to do a primary regrind to get the edge down to a reasonable thickness. After all, I'm shopping for a pocketknife, not a battleaxe.

To illustrate, here is a comparison of a 1978 Queen #49 and a 2011 Queen #49. Both are sharpened at 30° included. The '78 measures 0.017" thick at the back of the edge bevel. The '11 measures 0.048" at the back of the edge bevel. Which do you suppose cuts better?

[richstag]

I hear you Jake, but at half the price of a GEC I would toss that D2 up against my grinding belts and a few minutes later have a knife that will outslice any factory GEC Sodbuster.

[supratentorial]

Kevin, But you've got skills. I suspect lots of folks will be in the same boat as me and only be able to reprofile, not regrind the entire blade. Someday it might be fun to try though.

[richstag]

You could do just what I do if I showed you how and let you use my grinder. I did notice you said its why it wasn't an option for you. I was validating your point by adding I would have to work on it. But, for me, I would probably opt for the D2 all else equal. Some of my absolute favorite blades are cheap low finished from the factory that I spiced up

[supratentorial]

If I'm in your area sometime, I'll hold you to that. I do have to say that I also opt for Queen's D2 if the blades were ground the same. I have some other patterns from Queen with better grinds that I do use and it's very high quality steel.

[richstag]

Sounds good Jake

Yeah, but the grind on the GEC is probably its highest selling point.

[midnight flyer]

I hear you Jake, but at half the price of a GEC I would toss that D2 up against my grinding belts and a few minutes later have a knife that will outslice any factory GEC Sodbuster.

Or on the old Lansky. I have several reprofiled blades in D2 that are excellent slicers, including some Queens. I don't know that they will outslice the GEC offering, but I would be willing to be they could hold their own.

I eased back the edge on the Country Cousin to 25 degrees and polish it up a bit with the white ceramic stone. Unless something bad happens when using it, it is easy to bring back to arm hair shaving sharp with some green compound on the strop.

Did the same thing with my Dan Burke Barlow. Shaving sharp is good enough for me and I use knives frequently that don't meet that test.

But, for me, I would probably opt for the D2 all else equal. Some of my absolute favorite blades are cheap low finished from the factory that I spiced up

I have D2 bladed knives from Queen, Ontario and Kershaw. Love them all. Easy to sharpen and maintain, and they hold their edge well while having some rust/stain resistance.

And I must admit Kevin, that I have a couple of cheapies that I get a real charge out of using after a good sharpening. I don't enjoy tuning up an expensive knife, but a cheapie that just didn't have the attention put to the edge or mechanism coming out of the operating room a fine knife is pretty nice.

Robert

[supratentorial]

...Did the same thing with my Dan Burke Barlow...

I don't know if I just received a Burke Barlow with an unusually thick blade but I really can't understand why people like the knife. I had mine sharpened by one of the pros here on Bladeforums and it was razor sharp after he was done with it... but it was a razor sharp crowbar.

[trevytrev]

That's my biggest beef with the Queen Soddie, the blade profile. I can deal with a funky edge but the blade is thick and not profiled thin, a crowbar in the world of soddies. I like my soddies as slicers, GEC, Case and most my German Soddies are all profiled thin, some real cutters.

As for the GEC problems, the minor imperfections are of no concern to me since they will ride my pocket and suffer some abuse rendering them imperfect anyway. Heck, I ran over my black bullnose with my truck, scuffed up the handle on on side and the thing is still a cutting machine.