What would you choose ...............

wolfeknives

wolfeknives

Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Jan 2, 2006
Messages
481
What would you like to see in an US factory produced slipjoint if you had the choice of any blade steel, liners, bolster material and covers. The only given would be screwed construction, and an internal stop pin for the blade. Patterns, are open as well, but must be a single blade. I would very much appreciate your thoughts and desires.

Wolfe
 
Stainless liners, bolsters and shield.... actually, with a screw construction I'd probably go shadow pattern (no bolsters). A variety of covers but some essentials are yellow delrin, ebony, jigged bone, "popcorn" stag/elk, micarta, g-10... although not essential for me, I think some of the exotic woods would get a lot of interest-- like two tone amboyna burl, for example. ...actually, with a screw together construction on a shadow pattern I'd probably skip jigged bone.

Blade must be full flat ground. For steel I'm not really picky. BG-42 would be pretty good. VG-10 from Spyderco would be fine... why isn't Spyderco making traditional patterns as well as modern versions of "ethnic knives"????

As far as pattern goes...There's a reason that the old folding hunters were so widely made in the old days and so widely copied today by both traditional and modern knife manufacturers. When it comes to single blades, this pattern is not only a classic but also a standard. But you can pretty much pick up a 100 year old catalog and make every pattern in the catalog starting with the oldies that have the highest demand from collectors.

I would find 2 or 3 blades much more interesting, especially with these materials. Single blades are popular, especially for modern knives. There are also a lot of single blade knives. I find more complicated patterns particularly interesting. I also like the utility of multiple blades. Personally, I'd like a double end jack (clip and sheepfoot) and a premium stock knife.
 
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Why would screwed construction be the only option? I realize that screws were used long ago, but they don't look pleasing to me. I really like the idea of pinned single blades with high end steel. Single blade gunstock? I like end caps too. I've been rooting for Queen through all their QC contortions.
 
Good question! I agree with all stainless components. I'd go with a sleeve board with top bolster only, and jigged bone covers (or something with texture).

My preferred blade is sheepsfoot, but lambs foot, and Wharncliffe are acceptable. If straight edge isn't doable, then a clip would suffice.

I agree with supratentorial supratentorial regarding steels as well - there are many good ones. Though I personally have had good results with 154cm with edge retention, and my less than expert level sharpening skills.

I really like 3.5" closed, but consider anything around 4" or less with a single blade to be "carry-able"
 
One blade, screwed construction and a stop pin... wouldn't be my first choice for a knife . But within those parameters my favorite single blade patterns are the Remington Trapper and the slim dogleg ala the Case/GEC #48. Definitely gonna need at least one set of bolsters to look correct on either of those. A lanyard tube on a Rem trapper is a nice touch IMO.
For steel, Elmax is just such a nicely balanced steel in terms of maintenance, cost and edge retention. I have a fixed blade in it that I just love. In terms of sharpening, because the factory edge is a very good convex it just takes a few strops to have it razor sharp.
On the sort of knife your describing, I think micarta would do well. Vintage micarta is all the rage these days.
 
Why would a stop pin be needed on a slip joint? Otherwise I'd say a copy of a single blade Remington with a clip point.
 
idahoguy said:
Why would screwed construction be the only option? I realize that screws were used long ago, but they don't look pleasing to me. I really like the idea of pinned single blades with high end steel. Single blade gunstock? I like end caps too. I've been rooting for Queen through all their QC contortions.
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I am doing design work for a new knife manufacturer. All the designs I have provided for them have been for "modern" folders. They are looking ahead for future production / models, and have asked me to think about a slipjoint design. Going to pinned construction is not an option since their manufacturing setup is not be compatible.
I am trying to get a feel for the features that would be desirable to the "traditional" fans, realizing that the screwed construction is a no go for many. Being a "traditional" knife lover myself, I am excited to see them take a stab at this market. My plan is to develop a design, make some prototypes and get them out into daily use. That will ensure that they have a solid, tested pattern when they are ready to go into production. They are willing o use any blade steel, a big plus for those who would like to see steel not offered by any other manufacturer.
 
JB in SC said:
Why would a stop pin be needed on a slip joint? Otherwise I'd say a copy of a single blade Remington with a clip point.
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Internal stop pins have been used in slip joints for some time. They positively prevent the blade edge from contacting the spring.
 
Sounds a lot like the pending knife from Lionsteel and it's been well received and anticipated. At least with screws there won't be any complaint about pins not being even.

I'd offer it in 2 covers; one natural and one artifical, stainless bolsters, liners and hardware, and some sort of signature steel blade; not stainless.
 
wolfeknives said:
Internal stop pins have been used in slip joints for some time. They positively prevent the blade edge from contacting the spring.
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Gotcha, Browne & Pharr made some really nice slipjoints with screwed construction back in the mid to late 70's. You might get some ideas from those designs. I had a few of them. Bob Browne was still living as of 2014. I don't know if Cecil Pharr is still around or not. Their shop was in Doraville near 285.
 
Well you certainly run the risk of producing a "neither fish nor fowl" knife!
Also the possibility of a tremendous hit, or, a tremendous flop!!
My prejudice in favor of very traditional knives and production methods causes me to guess the latter!!
You have set up quite a challenge for yourself - good luck!! I hope you succeed, despite my cynical view!!
 
With screw construction, I would prefer stainless liners and bolsters. I'd like to see a 3" closed length Gunstock or Serpentine/Dogleg. I prefer ease of sharpening over edge rentention so something like VG-10 or S35VN would be great for stainless, and O1 or A2 for carbon. I love natural materials for handles, but with screw construction, I think a smooth surface would look best. Smooth dyed bone or wood would fit the bill nicely. For a single blade, it's tough to beat a clip point or broad spear point. I prefer clip poibts like Case has on the Peanut and Mini Trapper to those of GECs 15 and 74. I know that last bit is rather unpopular.
 
wolfeknives said:
What would you like to see in an US factory produced slipjoint if you had the choice of any blade steel, liners, bolster material and covers. The only given would be screwed construction, and an internal stop pin for the blade. Patterns, are open as well, but must be a single blade. I would very much appreciate your thoughts and desires.
Click to expand...

If screwed construction must be used, why not take advantage of the design possibilities opened by this type of construction and use different interchangeable covers, blade steels, linings and bolsters? Different blade shapes and lengths could be used, as long as they fit in the frame (or even offer several different frames). One could go on-line and pick out the parts and have the knife assembled, or modify it as tastes change/ develop.
 
Single blade trapper, brass bolsters, carbon steel blade and springs. Stage bone handle covers. Not sure on blade shape, possibly the clip but a sheeps foot might look nice too.
 
Bartleby said:
If screwed construction must be used, why not take advantage of the design possibilities opened by this type of construction and use different interchangeable covers, blade steels, linings and bolsters? Different blade shapes and lengths could be used, as long as they fit in the frame (or even offer several different frames). One could go on-line and pick out the parts and have the knife assembled, or modify it as tastes change/ develop.
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Enrique Peña has made trappers with screw construction but even he doesn't recommend a user disassemble the knife. His reasoning for that type of construction was to enable a maker to service and clean the knife without tearing it apart and risking it not going back together properly (or damaging an expensive cover material). Don Hanson III does some as well, but they cost $2500 and up.

I don't think it would be as easy as it sounds to offer interchangeable parts that have any level of precision fitting. I do see it as a method of offering various styles, handles, liners as options in the original ordering/fitting process. Blades on slip joints are pretty difficult to get flush at all three positions, I don't see it as being any easier with a screw together construction. As critical as most traditional buyers are, ill fitting parts would not be appreciated.
 
It seems like the most desirable knives out there that are 1 blade fall into the 3.5-3.75" closed clip point" category, thinking of the 15s, TC Barlows, CSC Boy's knives, etc. Zulu spears seem popular too... It seems like that'd be an easy win, stainless (or Titanium) liners and bolsters, high end steel etc. I have an AG Russell Barlow with the stop pin, I really appreciate the feature. That actually might be a good one to draw inspiration from as it checks a lot of popular boxes. I'm guessing it doesn't get a ton of attention due to the CR-MOV steel and country of origin, but man it's sweet for the money.
 
I think the benchmade proper was a great modern slipjoint to blend into the catalog of a modern folder company.

If you're kind of blurring the traditional lines, I like micarta as a handle material as it can be both modern and traditional. Clips seem to look great on single blade traditionals, IMO. I prefer two or three however but it seems that's not an option. I like curvy handles most of the time, serpentine or sowbelly. Straighter handles wok nice for multiple blades since you can grasp either end but with a single blade you might as well make the ergos and looks favor the single blade.

I also find that I like a big bit of steel sticking out of the handle so that I don't have to rely on the nail nick to open. The GEC farmer jack is an example but you would be limited to lower tip blade designs or a nice upsweep in the butt of the handle like a canoe. Or you could get a wide blade like pretty much any spyderco folder. I've also found if you add a full length finger groove instead of a nail nick you can one hand open a slightly lighter spring slipjoint if there's enough metal showing, but without the studs or holes in modern knives. Actually, if you textured the knife right, maybe a bead blast or acid wash finish, the blade might have enough grip to one hand open without a nick or groove on any kind.

Shiny bolsters and butt cap make a knife look more friendly, IMO. I think it looks more like an accessory as less like a weapon.

The biggest thing missing from the traditional looking slipjoint knives is nicer stainless, 440c or nicer, in a knife with reliable QC. There are a few out there but it seems like 440a or similar are most of them. If queen could get their act together with QC reliability they would do much better, IMO.
 
With keeping in mind that a lot of people move from modern to traditionals, I don't really see this as being a "traditional for traditional folks".
Look at the Pena or K'Roo models with Jigged Ti. They have a rather large following, and they aren't "traditional" scale materials...

This is along the lines of a traditional for those that want a knife that can perform like a modern knife while having the class of an "old school" design.

Ergonomic handle, quality tool steel that will still take a patina, take a easily hold a Great edge, ease of maintenance offered by some rust inhibition of said tool steel.

Pattern:
Sowbelly, Saddlehorn, or Sodbuster.
(Ergonomics trumps just about everything.)

Blade shape:
Trailing or straight back.
Belly placed about 3/4 the way towards the tip. Should offer enough flat, belly and tip for various jobs, while maximizing the cutting edge.

Steel:
CPM-Cruwear/PD-1, M4, or 52100
(52100 if the others aren't possible)

Handle materials:
Micarta, Ironwood, or Osage Orange
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I would want a good user that I wouldn't have to worry too much about. All the steels take a Great edge, have some stain resistance, and have the toughness to hold a thin, keen edge without much damage from accidental impacts that a smaller knife would encounter. All can be ran to 60-62 and maintain an easily touched up edge while offering Great wear resistance.
 
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I would like a 3" closed single blade Barlow with a bail,
a 1095 clip point blade, nickle silver frame / bolsters, and natural covers.
Because it's screwed construction though, maybe it could just be a Barlow shaped jack with a stainless frame like the " demo knife " ( can't remember the real name )
 
I like too many varieties to pick a pattern. But I think there is a severe shortage of quality authentic Mother-of-Pearl handles coming out of the big 3 US companies (GEC, Case, and Queen). It is such a great looking handle material, with a ton of history behind it. It belongs on a traditional knife.
 
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