2 Chinooks & a Manix failed a "spine-whack"?

3Guardsmen

3Guardsmen

Joined
Mar 16, 2005
Messages
3,652
I found this post in the "Blade discussion" forum, in the "strider vs manix" thread, and thought it might get more attention over here:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3299445&postcount=28

high said:
hi all, i dont own a strider but own a manix and 2 chinook II'S .I am very fond of spyderco but have been carrying a benchmade 710hs and rittergrip for a while now and just have more confidence in the axis lock. i spine whacked my chinooks and mannix one day and to my disbelief they failed.i personally dont even know if the spine whack test is even a fair test of a lockback or not but there was an article in blade magazine written by jerry van cook about the chinook I and II where he said he spine whacked the chinook and it passed .to be fair i spine whacked the ritter and 710 and they held fine. its also interesting but i looked carefully at the mannix and both chinooks and the combo edge chinook seems to take much more pressure to unlock while the other two take just a light push and bingo they unlock.anyway im rambling so suffice to say i am an axis man for now as i have grown very fond of my fingers. high
Click to expand...


Thats a pretty big claim, and I just don't buy it.

Cheers,
3Guardsmen
 
Hi 3guardsmen,

thanx for the "heads up". I responded to "High" on the original thread.

sal
 
I saw that. Thank you for the quick response. I didn't buy at all what the gentleman was saying, partially due to his low post count, but mostly because I own both of the knives in question and have experienced no such failures (my Manix and Chinnok laughed at me when I spine-whacked them :D ), and find it incredibly hard to swallow that 1 person could end up with 3 bum locks (especially in tanks like the Chinook & Manix). But, I guess anything is possible. I may have been premature in my suspicion, especially after seeing the gentleman's (High's) next post. For that I am sorry.

High,
If all 3 locks turn out to be defective, you really might want to think about playing the lottery, you'd probably win big. :D


Sincerely,
3Guardsmen
 
From the posts the incredible "spinewhacker" made it seems he has some warranty problems with other manufacturers too. He does expresses his urge to sneak a Spyderco Military into Disneyworld! :confused:

Well hmmm, people are strange.

i believe all spyderco's are prone to failing the spinewhaking test.

If you clamp them in a vise, tighten the vise as hard as you can with a long metal pipe on the handle and smash the spine of blade with a 20 lbs sledgehammer full power the lock might fail.

Maybe we can buy him a sharpened crowbar and tell him to spinewhack that one! :yawn:
 
hey mongo , you got to be kidding baby. am i the first guy in this forum to not want to be without my knife. others have asked similar questions about autos and illegal blade lengths, etc. and as far as the sledgehammer comment everyone else reading my threads have been gentlemen especially sal glesser the person most involved in his knives. why this extremely sarcastic post of yours. have i ever dissed you in any way. you really got under my skin man and i hope everyone here sees your inflamatory comments for what they are. have a good life. high
 
I have trouble believing that. I had one of each of those folders and the lock just goes in much too deep for a whack on the spine to make it pop that far up to disengage. I just have a lot of trouble seeing this actually taking place.

STR
 
Slippery shoes are more dangerous in a fight than having a knife with a lesser lock.
What are people doing with their knives that such excessive lock strength is needed? What kind of wierd knife play does one study that the spine needs to take such high pressure?
I worry more about skill development than I do about lock strength.
 
I have NEVER had a Spyderco, any Spyderco, fail a spine-whack test, EVER! I don't believe this.
 
Mr High, i appologize if i offended you in any way, or hurt your feelings thrue my post. I am certain that you send the 3 spyderco's back to the Spyderco W&R departement and received them back without any malfunction.

Sorry if my humourous remarks offended you

Peace
 
I've owned 2 original Chinooks, one Chinook II and a Manix. None of them have ever failed the spine whack test. Each knife has a tiny bit of play, but the lock is extremely secure.
 
I don't say High's knives didn't have the issue he mentioned, but I can tell that my wife has a Chinook (first generation) and she used to break coconuts with the spine of the knife (open), so I'd say it passed (and exceeded) the spine whack test. Considering the constructon of the Chinook and the Manix, I find odd (to say the least) that such lock failure can happen. Just like my forespeaker, I want to testify that I never, ever had a lockback failure, even with the "cheap" FRN spydies.
 
I'm with the "never had a failure" crowd :) My Chinook II is probably the strongest lockback I've ever owned. It is my opinion that you would have to seriously abuse 3 of Spydercos toughest models to get similar failures.
 
Just finished reading the thread over in Blade Discussions and then this one. I decided to pull out a Manix and see what happens. This Manix was used lighlty for about 3wks. I whacked it several times with no failures. My technique was similar to the good 'ol Cold Steel Video, heavy glove, holding the back part of the handle, and smacking the blade on a wooden 2x4 secured on a workbench. Started out light at first, but when I increased the force and on hit #5 the lock failed and the blade snapped shut. I was able to duplicate this 4 times. It did not happen with regularity, and the force required to make the lock fail was extreme. Light to mid-range strikes and the lock held, heavier blows however and the lock failed. I have no experience with the Chinook model. I am now curious as well, what would cause this to happen in a lockback? The lock "bouncing" under heavy force? Perhaps the pivot or other tensioning points out of spec? I checked all the handle screws and they are all tight. :confused:
 
I think the lock bouncing would be the main cause.

What real life situation (besides whacking cocunuts) would the spine whack relate to?

So a spine whack consists of:
Holding a knife with heavy gloves on. Hold it to where the blade would close on your hand. Beating it on wood.

I don't think I'd try that even with heavy gloves on. It sounds painful to have a knife close on your hand no matter what type of glove you are wearing.

Do you whack the very tip of the knife?

How does spyderco perform this test?
 
I held the knife so that when the blade closed, my hand was pretty much safe. The heavy welding glove was just as an added measure of safety. I didn't whack the very tip of the Manix, I tried to be consistant and strike in the middle of the spine. The force required to make it fail, IMO, was rather great. I did basically a full-force downward swing onto the wood. At this point I've also done this with several other folders, and have met with varying results. I've tested 1 other Manix (failure) 2 BM 630's (1 fail\1 pass) 1 Spyderco Endura (pass),1 CS Voyager (pass), 1 806D2 Axis (pass) 1 Old AFCK Liner Lock (fail) 1 Strider SMF (pass).
As has been said, I'm not sure the extent of the "real world" applications of such tests, and I'm not really sure what Spyderco's testing consists of. I hear they have a machine that measures\tests lock strengths and failures. I'm guessing that if many Manix have the same traits, then it might well be within normal parameters for the knife. Regardless, I tend to retire any piece that has any lock slippage at all usually just for my own "piece of mind".
Anyway, it was the mention of 2 Manix having lock failures that sparked my interest in what would cause a lockback to fail like that, my testing was far from scientific to say the least.
 
I could believe that someone could wind up with a Chinook II or Manix that would fail a spine whack test. Not likely, but certainly within the realm of possibility. BUT, one person winding up with two Chinook IIs and a Manix all failing the whack test? No offense, but I find that difficult to believe.

On the other hand, maybe you're performing the whack test with your thumb or some other part of your hand depressing the lock. Honestly, I think there must be something wrong with the way you're performing the test.
 
I would think that you'd break one of those knives in the process. I would think that there would be lock damage if the lock failed. It's kind of odd that an endura would beat a manix in a spine whack test.
 
The reason we call them "folders" is that they "fold". They are made to bend at the pivot, with the lock preventing this from happening accidentally.

If I release the lock, I expect it to fold. If I abuse the lock, I should expect it to fold. What is the standard force with which we perform the spine-whack test? There is no standard.

I suggest that if you perform the test by striking the back of the blade on the back of your hand, instead of the edge of a table or a 2x4, you will strike with a reasonable amount of force. Much harder than that, I would see as testing to destruction rather than verifying for use.

Of course, on the internet, nobody can see that you are a dog. Nobody can see how you test, or if you test, or if you just talk.
 
hi all,guys my 2 chinooks and manix are on their way to spyderco today via 2 day ups. in the box is a note and a copy of sals post asking me to call this to his attention. in hindsight rather than cause such an upset i should have sent the knives in without posting my spine whacking results.truth is i got caught up in all this lock testing that is so often mentioned on the forums. it was never my intention to bad talk spyderco period. but guys some of the tones of the posts sound like we were mortal enemies or something. 2 things about me are i dont post much as i would rather read and learn and only chime in when i need an opinion or info from my fellow formites. number two is i dont lie. as i posted to sal and company if they deem the knives o.k. then that is good enough for me and as i wrote i will pay for the return shipping and labor costs gladly. respectfully high
 
As High has pointed out, Sal managed to respecfully reply, and yet a number of you felt the need to come here into Sal's forum and basically crap on one of his customers.
Not only is that, in my opinion, low class, you insult Sal/Spyderco by doing it, although you probably meant it as some kind of brand loyalty.

If Sal, the very person who makes these knives, can manage to consider the possibility that they failed, maybe some of you should try to learn something, instead of posting what you did.
 
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