Buck Historians

BG42EDGE

BG42EDGE

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Comments please, from Joe and maybe from old-timers who were there or have records (Paul Bos would be good).

1980.

Nineteen hundred eighty was a big year for Buck.

Moved to new facility at El Cajon and operations there started in August.

Paul Bos started doing the heat treat. (?) Really could use some details as to exactly when.

Switched from 440C to 425MOD steel (apparently, it would SEEM, in August of 1980 because the new equipment was specifically made for 425MOD and wouldn't handle the harder 440C).

This poses a lot of interesting questions, for example, were blades made in 440C at one of the older sites for a time or did those operations cease immediately when operations at El Cajon started?

Were a lot of already finished 440C blades brought to El Cajon to be mated up with knife frames?

Any discussion?
 
That part of the history is still somewhat foggy. I am pretty sure that we did not have fineblanked parts until we moved into the Weld Blvd. address. The switch from 440c to 425mod was made because you cant fineblank 440c very long before your dies wear out/break.
It is my understanding that if you see a 500 series with a dot after the model number, this was done to indicate that the blade was fineblanked.
I dont know when each model was switched to fineblank from conventional blank. Fixed blade, folders...too many questions and not much data.
Could we assume that some models were made in 440c in the Weld factory? I've heard that it took a while to get the presses working so depending on how long "a while" was, I'd have to say yes, its possible we were still using 440c after the move to Weld although I could not tell you what models.
 
How about the question of exactly when Paul Bos started heat treating for Buck?

Does anyone have contact with him? I think that's an important fact to nail down for the history.

Also, does anyone know if some operations continued at the other plants for a while after El Cajon was operational?

Surely there are a few employees or retirees that would remember if it was a faucet type shutdown/startup?
 
BG42EDGE said:
How about the question of exactly when Paul Bos started heat treating for Buck?
Does anyone have contact with him? I think that's an important fact to nail down for the history.
Also, does anyone know if some operations continued at the other plants for a while after El Cajon was operational?
Surely there are a few employees or retirees that would remember if it was a faucet type shutdown/startup?
Click to expand...
dugh .. have ya thunk of askn master leroy sir?
he kno a bunch o stuff ...
and he might tell ya ifn ya asked him...
i send him a jar now and then..
he likes it a lot and says it helps his memory..
 
I think WBC was the last one to work at the El Cajon plant... He was working in back of the plant... I can't say for sure, but that's what I hear... :apple:
 
Nice to see ya, Wilde Bill.

The actual question, though, was about when El Cajon became operational.

At that time there were about seven Buck shops that were consolidated at El Cajon.

It would be interesting to know if they stayed open (and for how long) after El Cajon was operational. Did they continue to work with 440C until it was gone because it tore up the new equipment at El Cajon?

I'm curious because if Three-Dot blades were only made in 1980 until El Cajon became operational in August, that would mean the Three-Dot blades were only made for a total of seven months.

It would also be interesting to find out for sure if Paul Bos heat treated some or all of the Three-Dot blades.

There are many other questions, of course, and ANY, ANY discussion of ANY part of Buck History is welcome on this thread.

(Including Wilde Bill's lonely stint at El Cajon--how was that and what happened there? We know you made a huge scimitar for the ribbon-cutting at Post Falls).

I started this thread primarily because (as JOE'S "answers" show).....Buck history is rapidly being lost and it doesn't seem like Buck is taking it upon themselves to hire a historian or hire some help for Joe so he can deal with the problem.
 
And don't anybody jump to take that as a criticism of JOE.

Frankly, I don't see how he can be expected to do a big job like his (and excel, as he does) and then also do history research (or even record current history) to any degree at all.

This CAN be taken as a criticism of Buck for never dealing with the challenge of taking history seriously.

History is fragile information......and when it's lost.......it's lost forever.
 
I know that some of the old timers post (or at least visit) once in a while, so I hope they'll think about posting a few thoughts on Buck history. Maybe we could have an ongoing discussion.

Is this important? Yes.

Joe said:

That part of the history is still somewhat foggy.
Click to expand...

I was an Air Force Historian for 16 years, and.....believe me, as time goes by, history does not get LESS foggy......it gets MORE foggy.

I'd be VERY interested in hearing anything the Buck Inc. veteran employees could say about the questions I've asked.
 
BG42EDGE said:
And don't anybody jump to take that as a criticism of JOE.
Click to expand...

Boy I'm glad you cleared that up, my wife was about to sign on and give you what for! :D;)

You make a lot of great points. I have found that there are a lot of holes in our history and there simply isnt any paper data to fill them in. All we have are the memories of people who were there. BUT....I have been telling folks this for years now....if I am resorting to what people remember, thats a clear sign of desparation on my part. More often than not, when I ask someone about something that I already know the answer to, they get it wrong. I'm talking about bits of info where I have lots of suporting data and I KNOW the answer.
I dont have a lot of confidence in my brother's memories but on some things, it is all we have and their memories aint getting any better with time right? ;)

Wilde Bill is here? Nicest guy you will ever meet. His only character flaw is that he hangs out with Leroy! :p
 
Well, either Wilde Bill is here or somebody else is using his name in vain. :)

As far as the oral history goes, yes, it's haphazard.....but sometimes it's all you've got and you have to get as much as you can and then separate the wheat from the chaff and record the best history you can.

The alternative is letting it be lost forever. People tend to die without notice.

Yes, it's time-consuming. Yes, you have make use of a tape recorder. Yes, it's a lot of work.

No, you can't do a full-time job and ALSO be a historian.

Boy, I'm sure glad Joe's wife didn't sign on......

:)
 
BG42EDGE said:
How about the question of exactly when Paul Bos started heat treating for Buck?

Does anyone have contact with him? I think that's an important fact to nail down for the history.

Also, does anyone know if some operations continued at the other plants for a while after El Cajon was operational?

Surely there are a few employees or retirees that would remember if it was a faucet type shutdown/startup?
Click to expand...


IN My research for BuckMaster Knives The Authorized History -of- Models 184 & 185 . I had MANY conversations with Paul. I know that he Heat Treated Buck knives when Frank Buck(God rest his SOUL) was around. I am not sure when he passed..
Was he an employee of BUCK Knives NO however he heat treated for Buck and many others for years before he was on payroll..
Matter of fact here is one of his Knife awards.These awards are Given to Buck employees.

834710591_apnJi-XL.jpg
 
BG42EDGE said:
No, you can't do a full-time job and ALSO be a historian.

Boy, I'm sure glad Joe's wife didn't sign on......

:)
Click to expand...


YES You can :) it's called time managment. I work 65-70 hrs a weeks, Plus I am Happliy Married have 4 children and I just wrote in the Middle of the night for 3 1/2 years and SACRAFICED Family time :)
 
I had MANY conversations with Paul. I know that he Heat Treated Buck knives when Frank Buck(God rest his SOUL) was around.
Click to expand...

Well, maybe Paul will read here and tell us what year he started heat treating all the Buck knives. He no doubt knows, and nobody else knows. That information would be real, real helpful.

Many other things, too. Where are the guys that know?
 
humm i chated with chuck a good bit
he said it would have been nice if they could have keep records better on who did what and when
but he contuned
they were so concerned and bussy with keeping the company in the black that there was NOT time to
record all the informtion that they get asked about now


ya knows dere 42 dat it is not all history on the knives them selves
some times ya learns things of note like the prayer consultation room they had which become a storage room later
the controversy over john wain knives
heck now a daysi dont try to write down the things i learn bout buck ..
and much of the time i dont bother with any facts of knives i learn... some are neat
like the 112 tire knife proto type i got from a eng there... buck sway has it now
but ya jest keep a hitting on every one ya can and ya might learn some thing
like the 112 and the 110 blades were intentionally made to not be interchangeable
and that at one time ifn ya had a finger groved 110 you could get wrote up
and some other neat stuff i dont care to post here...
and i wills tells ya right quick
dont ever one remember the same facts the same !!!!!

well gots to go find a knife fer my contest ...
thinking of a folding kalinga.. but gots to find dat rascule
ta ta fer now
 
Dave!!!

You're back!!!

We missed you!!!

At least tell us about the "getting written up for having a FG Buck."

That sounds fascinating.

Still waiting for some old Buck salts to comment on some of the questions......especially:

Nineteen hundred eighty was a big year for Buck.

Moved to new facility at El Cajon and operations there started in August.

Paul Bos started doing the heat treat. (?) Really could use some details as to exactly when.

Switched from 440C to 425MOD steel (apparently, it would SEEM, in August of 1980 because the new equipment was specifically made for 425MOD and wouldn't handle the harder 440C).

This poses a lot of interesting questions, for example, were blades made in 440C at one of the older sites for a time or did those operations cease immediately when operations at El Cajon started?

Were a lot of already finished 440C blades brought to El Cajon to be mated up with knife frames?

You would think there would be at least one old-timer with that info.

:)
 
BG42EDGE said:
Dave!!!

You're back!!!

We missed you!!!

At least tell us about the "getting written up for having a FG Buck."

That sounds fascinating.

Still waiting for some old Buck salts to comment on some of the questions......especially:

Nineteen hundred eighty was a big year for Buck.

Moved to new facility at El Cajon and operations there started in August.

Paul Bos started doing the heat treat. (?) Really could use some details as to exactly when.

Switched from 440C to 425MOD steel (apparently, it would SEEM, in August of 1980 because the new equipment was specifically made for 425MOD and wouldn't handle the harder 440C).

This poses a lot of interesting questions, for example, were blades made in 440C at one of the older sites for a time or did those operations cease immediately when operations at El Cajon started?

Were a lot of already finished 440C blades brought to El Cajon to be mated up with knife frames?

You would think there would be at least one old-timer with that info.

:)
Click to expand...

yessire
 
I talked to Leroy and I know when we shut down and moved to weld we took everything . so no other plants were running. Citified was heat treating our knives .
We used 440c and 425mod until late 1983 I think that's when Paul Bos moved from Bradly to Weld. Paul also worked at Citified.
 
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