Ceramic PSA discs, 36grit blaze?

[javand]

Hey guys, I've meant to try these (the 36grit blaze)for a while, but never have. I'm wondering if they're worth the cost.

Has anyone tried these with a disc grinder, that can tell me about the longevity?

Can anyone comment on the longevity difference between the Blaze ceramic PSA discs that TruGrit carries, and the 3m 900dz ceramic psa discs they also carry, that are half as expensive?

I'm leaning toward just buying a bunch of the 60 grit 3M discs, but, figured I'd ask here first.

 

[HSC ///]

I haven't used the 36 grit , but I have the 60 grit Blaze from Tru Grit, they are about $7 each.
I can't quantify what I can get out of one in terms of blade grinding or handle flattening, I just don't really measure like this and don't have enough experience with using long term.

I don't feel like I burn them through them quickly at all, I feel like they are on the disc for awhile.
I just know I need them and so they cost what they cost.

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

I find that hogging is best done on the belt grinder at 36 thru 80 grit, and the disc grinder excels in smoothing and flattening at 120-400 grit.

 

[javand]

I haven't used the 36 grit , but I have the 60 grit Blaze from Tru Grit, they are about $7 each.
I can't quantify what I can get out of one in terms of blade grinding or handle flattening, I just don't really measure like this and don't have enough experience with using long term.

I don't feel like I burn them through them quickly at all, I feel like they are on the disc for awhile.
I just know I need them and so they cost what they cost.

Harbeer, have you used the 80 grit Rhynowet sheets on your disc at all? I'd love to hear a comparison on how you feel the blaze discs last comparatively. Although I'm mostly curious to hear about the 60 grit 3M ceramic PSAs in comparison, since they're half as much. If they last half as long, I'd rather go that route and get twice as much "fresh disc cutting" action as possible.

On the other hand, the 80 grit rhynowet is less than $1 a sheet, but if it takes 4-6 of them to equal one of those blaze or 3m discs, it's a no brainer to pay for the PSA discs, just to avoid the trouble of switching them out.



Obviously, abrasives are subjective, and the experience somewhat anecdotal.

 

[javand]

I find that hogging is best done on the belt grinder at 36 thru 80 grit, and the disc grinder excels in smoothing and flattening at 120-400 grit.

Sure, and I do most of my work that way, but there are parts of my process that need a reasonably aggressive abrasive on a flat (better than a cushioned belt loosely riding over a flat platen) surface. Hell, I rarely ever use 36 grit belts, as I usually find the deep scratches not to be worth it over a 40 or 50 grit belt which tends to have better abrasive grain distribution, but, occasionally, there are exceptions.

 

[javand]

Honestly I'm more interested in the 60 grits of either of these, but I'm curious to hear about the 36's. How they last, and how densely distributed the grains are.

 

[HSC ///]

Harbeer, have you used the 80 grit Rhynowet sheets on your disc at all? I'd love to hear a comparison on how you feel the blaze discs last comparatively. Although I'm mostly curious to hear about the 60 grit 3M ceramic PSAs in comparison, since they're half as much. If they last half as long, I'd rather go that route and get twice as much "fresh disc cutting" action as possible.

On the other hand, the 80 grit rhynowet is less than $1 a sheet, but if it takes 4-6 of them to equal one of those blaze or 3m discs, it's a no brainer to pay for the PSA discs, just to avoid the trouble of switching them out.



Obviously, abrasives are subjective, and the experience somewhat anecdotal.

no I don't use the Rhynowet on the 9" disc, I think it's a waste of my time.
I'd rather pay for the PSA
anyway sorry I don't really have much comparison

on a side note, I've been using my mill more and more for handle blocking and flattening/squaring. I find it much faster, much more accurate and the finish is great.

 

[kuraki]

Harbeer, have you used the 80 grit Rhynowet sheets on your disc at all? I'd love to hear a comparison on how you feel the blaze discs last comparatively. Although I'm mostly curious to hear about the 60 grit 3M ceramic PSAs in comparison, since they're half as much. If they last half as long, I'd rather go that route and get twice as much "fresh disc cutting" action as possible.

On the other hand, the 80 grit rhynowet is less than $1 a sheet, but if it takes 4-6 of them to equal one of those blaze or 3m discs, it's a no brainer to pay for the PSA discs, just to avoid the trouble of switching them out.



Obviously, abrasives are subjective, and the experience somewhat anecdotal.

That I can give you some feedback on. I started using the 3m PSA discs based on H's recommendation. They easily cut 4-6 times longer than comparable Rhynowet sheets on steel. I don't like using them on handle material, and will use Rhynowet for that (and for higher grits the PSA doesn't come in).

So I've never used the Blaze, but the 60 and 120 grit PSA discs are IMO worth the cost or actually cheaper than using sheet paper on steel.

 

[javand]

no I don't use the Rhynowet on the 9" disc, I think it's a waste of my time.
I'd rather pay for the PSA
anyway sorry I don't really have much comparison

on a side note, I've been using my mill more and more for handle blocking and flattening/squaring. I find it much faster, much more accurate and the finish is great.

Yeah, flattening handle blocks isn't what I need it for, I rarely use wood, but when I do, I do it on the mill also. Mostly I need this for pre-flatening before surface grinding to accommodate for (surface grind out) warp, or for quickly flatening the back side of integral liner/bolsters, etc. These are time saving steps for me, but a belt on a flat platen will not produce flat on small rectangular or square parts because of the way the belt has cushion and rides.

I also have a few other metal shaping tricks I use that I need a reasonably aggressive, flat abrasive (parallelism isn't an issue here, just flatness), and it's things that are really tricky, or time consuming to fixture for any other machine.

I know the limitations of these types of abrasives and this type of machine, I just wanna know if the discs hold up relative to the cost.

 

[javand]

That I can give you some feedback on. I started using the 3m PSA discs based on H's recommendation. They easily cut 4-6 times longer than comparable Rhynowet sheets on steel. I don't like using them on handle material, and will use Rhynowet for that (and for higher grits the PSA doesn't come in).

So I've never used the Blaze, but the 60 and 120 grit PSA discs are IMO worth the cost or actually cheaper than using sheet paper on steel.

Thanks Kuraki, that's the info I needed. I find it doubtful that the Blaze discs hold up (fresh sharp at least) 2x as long as the 3m's, so for half the price, I'm gonna order a bunch of the 3ms. I'll order one of the 36 and 60 grit blazes just to try them out. I just wanted to ask here and make sure nobody said "they suck, don't waste your money", before I did.

 

[kuraki]

Yeah, flattening handle blocks isn't what I need it for, I rarely use wood, but when I do, I do it on the mill also. Mostly I need this for pre-flatening before surface grinding to accommodate for (surface grind out) warp, or for quickly flatening the back side of integral liner/bolsters, etc. These are time saving steps for me, but a belt on a flat platen will not produce flat on small rectangular or square parts because of the way the belt has cushion and rides.

I also have a few other metal shaping tricks I use that I need a reasonably aggressive, flat abrasive (parallelism isn't an issue here, just flatness), and it's things that are really tricky, or time consuming to fixture for any other machine.

I know the limitations of these types of abrasives and this type of machine, I just wanna know if the discs hold up relative to the cost.

That's exactly what I use them for most of the time. Establishing a reasonably flat surface to start from on the surface grinder.

 

[Horsewright]

I've experimented with both brands mentioned and the zirc at 36. Keep coming back to the 60 grit ones. I do not believe that I get 2x as much use out of the Blaze to justify the cost. I order the 3M ones from Tru Grit (I just tell em the purple ones). I use the disc for alot of different things and these psa discs seem to get it covered for everything I need to do on the disc.

 

[javand]

I've experimented with both brands mentioned and the zirc at 36. Keep coming back to the 60 grit ones. I do not believe that I get 2x as much use out of the Blaze to justify the cost. I order the 3M ones from Tru Grit (I just tell em the purple ones). I use the disc for alot of different things and these psa discs seem to get it covered for everything I need to do on the disc.

Yeah I kinda figured that would be the case with the 36's, it's the same reason I don't like 36 grit belts. Yes, they're aggressive, but the grain density is so low, you get all these super deep scratches in certain areas that you have to chase out at 60 or 80 grit regardless. Better to just go with a 40 or 50, and then you can jump to 120 easily, and with less frustrating clean-up, the difference in metal removal isn't really significant in my opinion either.

 

[Darrin Sanders]

I'm with Dave, I prefer the purple ones from 3M. I use 220 the most but find all of them to be equal in quality. Another big plus is that they also work well on pretty much any material, wood, stag, ivory, etc.. They allow me to only have to order & stock one type of disc for everything. Give em a try and let me know what you think.

 

[javand]

I'm with Dave, I prefer the purple ones from 3M. I use 220 the most but find all of them to be equal in quality. Another big plus is that they also work well on pretty much any material, wood, stag, ivory, etc.. They allow me to only have to order & stock one type of disc for everything. Give em a try and let me know what you think.

Thanks Darrin, will do. Pop is coming up for the hammer-in this weekend at Haywood CC, so I called him this morning and asked him to bring me a few to try. He only had the 120's in stock, but it should give me an idea how they'll work out for me.

Also he's carrying some Indasa paper, the people that make Rhynowet Redline, apparently they've got some newer paper called Rhynowet Plusline, that they say is better. He's bringing me some of that also to try.

 

[Darrin Sanders]

Thanks Darrin, will do. Pop is coming up for the hammer-in this weekend at Haywood CC, so I called him this morning and asked him to bring me a few to try. He only had the 120's in stock, but it should give me an idea how they'll work out for me.

Also he's carrying some Indasa paper, the people that make Rhynowet Redline, apparently they've got some newer paper called Rhynowet Plusline, that they say is better. He's bringing me some of that also to try.

If its better than Rhynowet I gotta have some. Let me know what you think once you give it a try.

 

[kuraki]

The biggest difference is they don't have that initial sharp bite that makes Rhyno so great, so you might think at first, this thing sucks. But it's like an obtuse angle high carbide edge. Can't shave but just keeps going and going.

 

[javand]

The biggest difference is they don't have that initial sharp bite that makes Rhyno so great, so you might think at first, this thing sucks. But it's like an obtuse angle high carbide edge. Can't shave but just keeps going and going.

Well I picked up some 120's yesterday at the hammer-in, I'll report back in a bit after I try them, but my problem with rhynowet is that that sharp bite only lasts like 5 seconds on the disc.

If its better than Rhynowet I gotta have some. Let me know what you think once you give it a try.

So it's still Rhynowet, but it's Rhynowet Plus, as opposed to Rhynowet Redline. I'm hand sanding with it today, and I gotta say, initial impressions at 400 grit are very good. It was apparent immediately that it's more aggressive (sharper) feeling cut, and seems to last longer before it's "polishing" instead of cutting. At high grits as we all know, this is usually in the order of 1-2 strokes per section of paper, this feels like double that.

This stuff has a slightly heavier backing, the rep says it's more tear resistant. The lower grits are even heavier, and I'm guessing that'll help longevity on the disc.

However, above 400 grit these sheets are Silicon Carbide instead of Aluminum Oxide, on paper, that seems like a good thing to me, but I'll report back after I get to use it some more.


The 80 grit is definitely much heavier backed, the pack size is like double that of the Redline. It's also a little pricier at that grit, but the nominal grits are roughly the same price I've been getting from Supergrit, plus that was literally the only thing I was buying from them, and having to pay shipping, so it'll work out more economical getting from Pop, since I already buy most of my abrasives from him anyway.

 

[javand]

The biggest difference is they don't have that initial sharp bite that makes Rhyno so great, so you might think at first, this thing sucks. But it's like an obtuse angle high carbide edge. Can't shave but just keeps going and going.

Yeah, initial impressions on this are really good also. I don't find the sharpness to be significantly different, but after actually grinding a bit, it's still sharp, so, I can't wait to try the 60 grit.

 

[REK Knives]

That's interesting that the psa discs last so much longer than rhyno... never woulda guessed that! Can anyone advise how difficult it is to peel off - does it leave a lot of residue behind or is it clean?