Does it REALLY matter??? The TV Guide Trap!

Joined
Dec 6, 2002
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Come on guys! ATS34, 154CM, CPM440v, VG10, BG42, Aus8A, 6A, 420J2, 12C27, SR101, CarbonV, , 5160, 52100, 1095, S90v, S30v, S60v, G2, QSblah, blah, blah... for the vast majority of us knife knuts, we maintain our knives and respect them...so, should blade steel really be the large deciding factor in whether or whether not we buy a knife? Personally I feel that if you go with a reputable company/maker, you like the look and feel of the knife, then you shouldn't even worry about the steel, because it's already damn good if it's being used... again, I'm talking about the "vast majority," not those rambo types whose survival depends on their blade. But, seriously, how much does the blade material factor in when you're buying a knife. I was finding myself getting sucked into what I call the alternate-cover trap... you know, you have a comic book, TV guide, magazine, etc. whose contents are the same, but they're offered with alternate covers, so you're left puzzled, wondering if you need to select a certain one, or worse yet, all of them... but they're really all the same animal. What do you think?

(too many beers last nite perhaps)
 
I don't pay a heck of a lot of attention to blade steel really, i mean i want a decent steel, but it doesn't weigh in importance to me, like overall design of a knife does.
 
larrytwohig,

I think the answer to your question is..."it depends" :)

For me, if I'm looking at a knife that's priced inexpensively (say, under $100), then steel selection is only important insofar as it meets a vague minimum requirement like....not 420J2!

However, as the price of the knife goes up, I expect that the materials used should be increasingly top of the line. For example, as much as I love my small Sebenza and the fact that I have found no other knife that fits my hand as well, if it was made out of AUS-6 well...I must admit that I might not like it quite so much.

Another real-example - the new Wilson/Ralph knife. It looks great, but there have been some who have expressed reservations due to the fact that it is a $400+ knife with 440C steel.

Make sense? Good, now go away and don't post again until you sober up! :D

Matthew
 
Originally posted by larrytwohig
:barf: ok, sober... makes sense... hmmm... did I put 420J2 up there? guess so... nevermind that one!:eek:

LOL, made me look! :)

Really though, you have a good question up there. I find myself thinking almost the same thing from time to time. I go through periods where nothing catches my eye except for higher-end knives, and periods where I feel like "getting back to basics", as it were.

Of course it's all relative - getting back to basics, for many of us, probably means spending no more than $50-$75 on a knife ;)

Matthew
 
Design and workmanship are more important than the blade steel...and 420J2 ain't blade steel!:)!

Paul
 
I just have a minimum standard; I flatly refuse to buy anything with 420J2 in the blade (unless it's lamintaed like Fallkniven), I'm not fond of AUS-6, but I'll get a knife with it if I like the knife otherwise. I'll tailor certain steels to different applications, for instance for a big bowie I prefer tough carbon steels. But D2, M2, 154CM, and so on, it doesn't make a huge difference.
 
It would be really interesting to actually do a blind test with knives made from all of the popular steels. Any bets as to the average user or even most "knife-nuts" being able to tell much difference? ;)
 
You do need to be somewhat aware of the steel your blade is made of. 440C, ATS-34, and CPM440v for example, take a very good edge and are rust-resistant in common environments. For many applicatons, they're a good compromise. GIN-1 is generally believed to be slightly inferior in the edge department, but it's highly rust-resistant. In a marine environment, it may be a better choice. Carbon V, D2, M2, on the other hand, are known to be much more rust-prone. But, many people think these alloys take a better edge. Without even arguing about that, the fact is that if you have a blade made of one of these more rust-prone alloys, you need to be aware of its rust-prone nature and pay more attention to its care.

Even 420J2 has it's place. It's primarily use for "art" or "fantasy" knives where a razor-sharp and durable edge is less important. What 420J2 is is virtually rust-proof in common environments and it also polishes very well. Again, it's not that 420J2 is a bad steel; it's just not a good choice for working knives. The problem is that 420J2 sometimes gets used in inappropriate places. Again, just be aware of the steel you're buying.

The world is full of trade-offs. It's rare to find something that excells in all respects. There is no one steel alloy that easily takes and holds a fantastic edge, is durable, never rusts, polishes nicely, is easy to work with (from a maker's perspective, for example does not require an absolutely perfect heat-treatment process), and is inexpensive. If there was such an alloy, then every knife would be made out of it and we wouldn't have the alphanumeric soup of alloys that we do have.

In situations like this, where optimizing one characteristic compromises others, the ideal solution for most applications is not found at the extremes. For most applications, the ideal solution is a compromise.
 
That would deoend on what the knife was for. If its going to be used, then I would decide by:
what task?
where is it used?


if its a matter of collectablity its not as big a factor, but it could be, such as a certain knife that very few were made with a particular steel, ect. Otherwise it would'nt make a differnce.
 
If you have nothing to compare a knife to, it doesn't really matter. My Emerson SOCFK is 154CM and I'm perfectly happy with it. I had a BM 710 in ATS34, that while no worse than the Emerson, I noticed that is was inferior to my 710 in M2. I was never really happy with the ATS34 710 after I got another in M2 because the ATS34 dulled significantly faster when cutting hard materials. It is definitely worth the $10 upgrade! But I still use my Emerson and have no problems with the steel, but if I went to buy another and a better steel was offered, I'd go for it.

So I won't let steel determine my choice of knives, but if I find a design I like, I'll get the best steel that design is available in.
 
Heck yeah I care about the steel !

To me knives are a passion, I have some older knives which I bought as a boy and had no clue about the steel and they are 420 etc... nowadays I wouldn't be cought dead with something as aus-8 in my pocket. I'll go from ATS-55 and ATS-34, 154CM upwards. Let's put it this way if you're a car nut do you collect lada's ??? That's what my passion is all about, hi-tech materials for hi-tech designs I'll gladly pay the price... but this is just my opinion.
 
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