Giving a little talk on knife forums.

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May 9, 2000
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At Josh's next Big Sky Hammer-In, I am going to be talking to the attendees about knife forums. What I will be trying to do is get a dialogue going that will help makers and members of the ABS that attend the hammer-in to understand that forums can be a great place for them to promote the organization and its bladesmiths. What would you tell them if you had the opportunity?
 
If there will be a network cable available, you could show them BF....

maybe discuss the how-to threads, for-sale forum...& getting acquainted

with folks one might not meet otherwise.......a few thoughts for starters.
 
Keith,

Thank you very much for accepting my invitation. I know it is a long drive and a big effort on your part. I look forward to hearing what you have to say. From reading many of your posts I know it will be enlightening. You always seem to have a fair and balanced opinion, supporting the ABS, while offering suggestions of things that you'd like to see them do differently. It's easy to see why your opinion is respected among makers and collectors.
 
Is the hammer in, an invite event? or general public..? Sounds fun and i have to give it to you Josh for being so kind as to take it up. Sounds great for the community and those who attend.
 
Threads: 355,668, Posts: 3,980,115, Members: 98,767
That's the numbers for the largest knife based forum. pretty impressive numbers.
There are many other, albiet smaller, forums out there.
Point out the many makers that have made knifemaking a successfull business just on the power of the forums.
I think even Blade magazine has it's own forum.
I think there was even an article in a recent knife magazine that had an article on the net and how it's affecting knifemakers. Sorry don't know the magazine off hand.
 
I would be very candid in acknowledging the negative aspects - some people can be absolute chuckleheads and shovel the $%# till it's piled high and deep. But point out that those people tend to get called out immediately and pointedly. And also point out that they are by far the exception to the rule.

Mostly I would try to get across the positives that they would relate to most directly:

1) Preservation of the craft: the knifemakers sub-forums are a virtual hammer-in that runs 24/7/365. A ton of useful questions being asked and - significantly - a lot of makers willing to take the time to provide a ton and a half of informative answers covering all aspects of knifemaking.

2) Promotion of a maker's work. There's pretty much no way to guarantee that your knife gets published in a magazine, but any maker with a $200 digital camera, a $75 home-made light box and the patience to learn some VERY basic photo skills (all of which info is available on the forums) can show their work to an interested, informed and engaged audience. The feedback they receive will generally be polite - but they have to expect that people will comment on whay they don't like as well as what they do. That has to be handled with class by the maker - whether they agree with the criticism or not.

I would point out - maybe with a list of "do's and don'ts" - that successful participation on the forums isn't the perilous minefield of imminent doom that some make it out to be. I had a long conversation with Don Hanson on this subject at the Chicago show. He is a maker that clearly "gets it" when it comes to forum participation and would make a good example of how to go about things. I would give them several examples of bladesmiths who participate on the forums.

Mention that participation in the virtual world of the forums is a great way for a new maker to to emerge from obscurity and a great way for an established maker to stay on the radar screen.

Point out that it is a place where they can actually sell their knives if they choose to.

3) As a recent example of the good deeds that can be accomplished on the forums, I would point to the recent BFB Bowie and show them how that project evolved - entirely from forum participants - into the creation of a truly magnificent bowie that raised no small amount of change for a worthy charity.

4) Timely reporting. A print mags coverage of a show will likely trail the event by a matter of months. On the forums, it may be a matter of hours - or even contemporaneous.

5) Information and education - these are among the core values of the ABS. Well, the forums proide an excellent opportunity to why you do what you do the way you do.

6) Give them an idea of the diversity of participants - makers new and not, collectors and enthusiasts, dealers, photographers - it's pretty much a microcosm of the custom knife world.

Time for some coffee now - but that's a start, anyway.

Roger
 
Time for some coffee now - but that's a start, anyway.

Roger

That is a great start. A nice outline that sums up the positive and negative things that come up here. For those who are having a hard time accepting these forums, this clearly indicates how the positive clearly outweighs the bad that occasionally appears.

Thanks, Roger. And, good for you, Keith. Your talk will be well received, I am sure.

- Joe
 
Kieth,
The question was "what would I say"? I would hope, just enough. I think the general knife public is comprised of different groups of thinking.
I would probably use an illustration, say of drivers on the highway, etc. Some people drive fast, changing lanes rudely without much regard for other, perhaps less experienced drivers or even old drivers who are not use to the faster pace, while others are very deliberate, stressing safety and concern for the other guy.

To help the knife public understand the purpose of the forums is to help the individual understand why he is even participating.
The balance that Josh mentioned should be incouraged. Our expressions, even if in disagreement, should reflect respect for the others opinions. But it will be up to each individual to use his part to make the forums a safe place to make expressions about our views, without fear of being crucified.
For a lot of would be participants, this fear has kept them in the lurking position. Others have taken a much harsher opinion of forums, washing their hands of them completely, putting themselves at a disadvantage in regard to the knifemaking/collecting public.
In my opinion, the bladeforums will be a small cross section of the general public. Probably wont change that much, but your talk might help some focus a little on the type of participant they want to be. You are doing a good thing.
Lin
 
Incredibly concise summary, Roger. Yours should be required reading.

The detractors often provide the most colorful exchanges. As even Emerson once said, "...it is not instruction, but provocation that I can receive from another soul". We tend to think hard and in-depth when the flags start waving red.

I am a ready example of someone related to the knifeworld who has built an entire business, and has benefitted countless makers, collectors, and proponents through my participation.

Guilty as charged!

This hammer-in is looking more and more like the place to be, in late June 2008.

Coop
 
Way to go, Keith!

Great post Roger!

I've been on these forums for over 5 years and have never been crucified. I've made new friends, sold bunch of knives and enjoyed a lot of very interesting reading. I have also answered many questions in the makers section and learned there to.

If you are not interested in custom knives (past, present, future) then stay away from these forums!!!:D
 
Excellent post, Roger. And Don, I always enjoy seeing your work shown here and am very glad that you, Lin, and other makers choose to participate in the forums.

Bill
 
Roger,
I guess you posted while I was writing. Very good information. It's just such constructive insight that makes the forums so useful to me. I really think if Keith and others like him can impart such positive views of the forums, it will be doing the knife community a great service. Good stuff. Lin
 
Great advice Roger.
Keith you will no doubt do very well representing the forums.

As of tomorrow I will have been participating on this incredible forum for one year.
Before wardering here, my opinion of forums was that they were a vast waste of time.

Well, the last year has been the most educational and most enjoyable year of my knife collecting adventure.

Thanks friends & teachers. :)
 
Great input guys. Jon the hammer in is open to the public. I will have all of the info for the hammer-in posted by the end of the weekend. I'm just waiting for my website guy to get it posted. I will put a thread up when it's ready. Thanks.

I hope you all come.
 
Keith,

Thank you very much for accepting my invitation. I know it is a long drive and a big effort on your part. I look forward to hearing what you have to say. From reading many of your posts I know it will be enlightening. You always seem to have a fair and balanced opinion, supporting the ABS, while offering suggestions of things that you'd like to see them do differently. It's easy to see why your opinion is respected among makers and collectors.

His opinions are also respected on this Forum ... although I imagine that would be obvious. :cool:
 
Lots of great input. My general theme will be very much along the lines of what Roger posted. I started this thread as a way to assist my thought process, and it has so far been very helpful.
 
Keith, a reference to the information on the following thread might be interesting.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=508811

Seems that most of the "responders" don't subscribe to Blade Magazine and some don't think much of any of the knife magazines. If a maker advertises in Blade, this forum has an audience that they are likely not reaching.

I don't post as often as many do, and don't feel obligated to post at all. I do try to visit for a while every day. If I see a thread that is interesting, and I feel from reading the posts that I can add something, I might comment. Many times I just lurk. It's a great way to relax, keep up with some friends and their work, and make new friends. I guess the point is.... a maker or collector can choose the level of participation that they want, and are comfortable with.

I agree with Roger's post that the forums are also a good way to expose your work to the knife buying public at a very low cost. The best way to judge the effectiveness of the exposure is in the increase in web site hits and orders. It works. We have tested this over and over.

There are a few cautions that should be recognized though. The access to information is often instant and from some of the best in the business. It can also be from people that don't really know the information they are providing first hand. The chuckleheads Roger was referring to don't last long, but some of the posters providing information are doing it with the best of intentions. It just might not be good information. The advice here is free, sometimes repeated several times and worth at least what you pay for it. If you question the validity of advice received on a forum, Pvt. Message someone that you think will know the answer. They will likely tell you or lead you to someone that does know.

If you want to increase the exposure to your business, people will need to know who you are, so use your name. To me it is a courtesy to identify your self in a conversation and the same holds true here. Along the same lines, if you don't know who the poster is, why would you assume that his experience or level of knowledge is better than yours? Many people hide their identity on the forums, and I just have to wonder about the reason.

Montanna is a bit of a drive for someone in South Georgia (have anvil and will travel) even though I would love to make the trip. I would be very interested in your comments, if you would care to post them after your talk. It would be an interesting topic to discuss at a Georgia Guild meeting.
 
I will most definitely post a thread about the hammer-in when I get back home afterwards. I will also take as many photos as possible so that one or two of them will be good enough to post.
 
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