Learning to appreciate my medium grit stone...

Kaizen1

Kaizen1

Joined
Jan 4, 2006
Messages
6,294
Hey folks,

In my quest to perfect my sharpening technique, I've been primarily focused on getting a highly polished edge, constantly pushing to achieve isane levels of totally impractical sharpness. And I know Joe Talmadge warned all of us of the super polished edges and their lack of utility, but I didn't listen. I kept thinking how cool it would be to push cut thin paper and whittle hair (don't get me wrong, it's very cool).

Lately, I've come to really appreciate the higher grit stone that I have (medium grit sharpmaker stone). It used to be that thing I used to prepare my knife for finer grits. For the past couple of days, I've sharpened my EDC with only the medium grit stone and I really like this edge. The "bite" is significantly different from the polished edge that I've been using for the past few months. I like how it catches so much easier. When I cut paper, it feels like it rips with a clean cut. Since I generally don't have to use my knife too often or under extreme situations, I have the option to change how fine I keep my edge without it really affecting my day.

And if you have that same option and have been keeping your blade at a highly polished edge for awhile now, I suggest you try switching it up just for fun to see how you like it. If anything, we have another variable to consider to keep our rotation interesting:thumbup:.
 
The finer the polish on your edge, the less friction it has. On a thick or thick-to-us edge used for slicing, a little friction is a good thing as you get to place your hand's force into the edge to make the cut while still retaining the damage-resistance of a thick edge. Plus, stopping at a medium grit saves you precious time; especially on a thick-to-us edge of high-carbon stainless goodness.

I like thinning out the edge until the high level of polish is again helpful (plus, at low, low angles, the furroughs left by any particular grit are deeper at the edge itself than on higher angled edges i.e. a 45-included degree edge at 8,000 grit makes optical glass seem coarse and a 12-included degree edge at the same grit feels "toothy."). Higher risk of damage, but the payoff in cutting goodness often feels worth it. When it isn't worth it, I follow your lead and rip a thicker edge onto the knife with a coarse diamond benchstone and try not to think about it.
 
Kaizen I've also gone through the same thing and found I agree with you. I really like the finish I get with the Spyderco medium bench hone I have. Unlike Thom I don't put on a low low angle edge, 12 degrees included. My edges are more like 10 to 12 degrees per side, 20-24 ish included with the Spyderco med. hone finish. For how I use a pocket knife it is by far the better edge for me. I'll still every now and then put on a highly polished screeming edge just to remind myself that I can do it and do prefer the Med edge.
 
Just to clarify, db, I rarely go to that low of an angle on anything but kitchen knives made with steels that can hold such angles. My pocketknife edges hover more between 20 and 50 included degrees (though most are polished as best as I can get 'em). I've had a pocketknifes sharpened that thin, but had to resharpen them a little thicker as the edges would bend or crack for some weird reason. :o I blame the cracked edges on too many carbides! :p The ones that just rolled without cracking were all steels with low carbide volumes. :rolleyes:
 
I am undergoing the same transition. I am still not a fan of coarse edges, but something in the medium range, or an edge with a big grit jump seem to me a lot more utilitarian. Unfortunately, those are two areas where I need a lot more practice as well. Getting a good edge on medium and even coarse grit and getting such an edge in as little time as possible. I still have ways to go before I am a decent "sharpener" :(.
 
Same here. I can get a good, possibly passable edge, on a 1000 grit waterstone, but I strop on that stone for a long time to get that edge. Also noticed that I can't get a good freehand edge with a 1200 grit diamond compared to either a 600 grit diamond or 1200 grit waterstone or sandpaper.
 
I use a very light touch edge first stroke when doing my finishing strokes on the medium and coarse sharpening. Coarse edges do have a place but I'm not a real big fan of them either. I've settled on my Spyderco medium bench hone and or my Norton 4000 water stone as my prefered finishing grit. Thom your one of the few who I think does put on and use a thinner edge than I do. Thats not a bad thing. :) I do kind of have a hard time believing you have any pocket knives with a 50 degree edg on them. :) must be a knife you haven't gotten around to sharpening yet. :) You do bring up a interesting point about how angle and finish relate to how coarse/fine a edge acts. I'm not sure a person would notice a difference of lets just say 1000 grit at a 20 degree edge and a 30 degree edge included,but I'm guessing a person may notice at a much greater angle.
Is this something you've seen in sharpening?
 
By chance, I've also learned that I much prefer to stop at a "medium" grit for most my hunting/meat knives. I like to keep a polished edge with me to but what I dub the "micro-serrations" gives me a little better control in meat. (Now, that's probably completely placebo effect...but ignorance is bliss.)
 
I got my view on classifying grits from sanding and grinding on metal, wood, paint, etc. while helping out my dad. Coarse was 60 and rougher, medium was up to around 320, and fine was anything beyond that. 800 grit was of no use until working on a finish coat and dealing with tiny imperfections that you don't care about when painting heavy equipment.

A coarse edge for me is something I put on with a file, and it can barely take hair off my arm, 120 is toothy but has it's uses. I spent my first couple years of freehand practice never going past 400 grit, and I stuck with something coarser, 280, when I got a clamp system.

Now, I polish everything to at least 4000 before the strop; except for kitchen knives that will be used on meat. Outside of that, I don't slice. I have noticed that 90% + of my cutting is a push, so I shine up my edges.
 
db said:
Is this something you've seen in sharpening?
Click to expand...

Absolutely. Even before cutting, knives get the three-finger test. It's kid-tested/mother-approved and thinner edges tend to have more "bite" on it than thicker edges of the same angle.

hardheart said:
Now, I polish everything to at least 4000 before the strop; except for kitchen knives that will be used on meat. Outside of that, I don't slice. I have noticed that 90% + of my cutting is a push, so I shine up my edges.
Click to expand...

A polished edge on a kitchen knife makes for quite the slicing experience. Unfortunately, the temptation to slice steak and chicken so that they're thinner than linguine is strong.
 
I still enjoy a higher polished edge and I'm pretty sure I'll be jumping back and forth as I attempt to keep my EDC interesting. I would probably thin out most of my knives if I had either a belt sander or some diamond sharpeners. I brought my Waved Endura to roughly 15 degrees inclusive and it slices paper better than my ZDP Caly 3. I love all this sharpening stuff. It's a great outlet for my obsessive-compulsive tendencies:D.
 
A cheap and very good stone to thin your edges is one of those 2 sided black silicon hones found at just about any hardware store. Should be under $10 I still use mine alot even though I have a DMT XXC.In fact I just used it yesterday to grind a new edge on a kitchen knife it took me about 5 min to do.
 
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