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Sebenza 21 Inconsistent Action

Discussion in 'Chris Reeve Knives' started by BK14, Oct 9, 2017.

  1. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    Hi all,
    My small Knifeart 21 is very smooth on opening and closing. However, sometimes the action seems much stiffer than other times. This is mostly noticeable on closing. Usually the blade free drops, but sometimes when I depress the lock bar it just stays there. I have been unable to detect any differences in how I am holding the knife when this happens. It really isn't a big deal practically, but I am wondering if this is normal. Thanks in advance!
     
  2. Ajack60

    Ajack60 Platinum Member Platinum Member

    Apr 21, 2013
    Is it the CF edition?????
    I've read that on the CF slab, the washer moves at times instead of staying stationary. That's what it sounds like. I don't know if grease gets between the washer and the CF slab that causes it to free spin. You may want to take it apart and clean the CF slab and use the grease sparingly on the CF side.
     
  3. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    I had not thought of this! Yes it is, and having been back to CRK for a different problem and coming back the same way I'm sure it's not a warranty concern. That could be what's causing it. I will disassemble and use very little grease on that side and see what happens.
     
  4. Nrthfce

    Nrthfce

    413
    Sep 17, 2014
    Use no grease, not even a little on the side of the washer that is in contact with the slab. Use sparingly on the side of washers that comes in contact with the blade. More problems will come from over greasing, if its even possible, than from under greasing in my experience.

    When I received my large reg pj, second hand,the washer was spinning. There was grease everywhere attracting contaminates, causing spacing issues, extra lock stick, screws loosening, and almost centering issues. Cleaned, applied super light grease in proper areas, and knife is close to perfection. Can’t rid the reg slight gummy lock, but I tell myself it’s security safety
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2017
    Lapedog likes this.
  5. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    Thanks for the help guys! I am terrible at leaving things be even for a little while, so I disassembled after reading the first post. I used a normal (about what is suggested in the official CRK disassembly video) on the lock side, and just a tiny amount on the blade side of the show side washer. It does not seem to be spinning but I guess use will tell if any seeps around. I'm glad I posted the thread, it's been bothersome and I literally would've never thought of that.
     
  6. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    So even with minimal lubricant I was still having the spinning problem, so I called CRK and spoke to Kayla (hopefully I'm not misspelling her name) this morning. She spoke to one of the technicians for me, and he said that the CF sebenzas are their "most finicky" and the small amount of flex exhibited by CF can cause the washers to spin, and there isn't really a solution that they have found. Bummer! It is super frustrating to have it so stiff every few openings, and I'm kind of disappointed to not be able to get a concrete answer from them. I love the knife, and will have to just play around with it I guess.
     
  7. Nrthfce

    Nrthfce

    413
    Sep 17, 2014
    I owned a CF 21 Large and had no issues with the spinning washer. Lucky I guess. I have heard before that they are prone to this... The only thing I would continue to try is getting the contact between the cf slab and the side of that washer as clean and dry as possible, i.e rubbing alcohol. Then use the smallest amount of grease possible, light film, between that washer and tang as well as the bushing and tang hole. Go with normal, but small amount on lock side washer and blade tang with none on slab. If I get even a glob, like say the size of a mm of broken off piece of 0.5 mm lead, IMO that is more than enough for one complete side of a large 21 washer.
    Oh crap, I have failed to acknowledge, cause I have mostly switched to regulars with old solid washer, your washers have holes in them. I would use even less grease. Maybe apply it to the knife tang in that minimal amount. Let it set or dry for minute, hit it with a hair dryer. That clear-ish fluid that may come out of the tube first is just a medium for the grease to travel, not actual grease itself. Avoid getting that in there it if possible. Last case, maybe try running it dry, with no grease, after cleaning with rubbing alcohol for a day or two and see what happens, then take apart and go with that littlest amount physically possible.

    I can't say for certain all, but in every video I have seen that I can recall about cleaning and lubing, IMO they over do it on the grease and maybe that's so it can be visible on the video feed.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2017
  8. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    After speaking with her on the phone, she said there would be no ill consequences if I just didn't use lubrication on that side. So I am trying that, and it hasn't started spinning yet. I am debating selling it, cause it's pretty bothersome and there's lots of other CRKs that are appealing to me. I would really hate to do that though, I love the knife and the CF.
     
  9. Nrthfce

    Nrthfce

    413
    Sep 17, 2014
    I edited above post after catching my ignorance on something, but you've addressed it in your last post to a certain extent.

    Most things I would try listed above.

    As a disclaimer, and I apologize since its obviously troublesome for you, but I would love this scenario. It would give me multiple opportunities to tinker and try different stuff all while playing and taking apart my knife. Once resolved, I would feel closer to the knife and smarter than most. ;) I take apart clean knives just to clean then again. I strop sharp knives to see if I can get them sharper. Heck, I just bought a new axe, and during the sharpening process I ending up stropping it, getting it "too sharp" just so I could send a video to my buddy of me shaving hair off with it. :)
     
  10. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    Haha this is true, I normally enjoy this stuff too, but I am at a bit of a loss for things I can try. It's used, but maybe I can get something figured out with CRK if they would take it back and perhaps provide credit or something. I have to do something about it though, as every few openings it's basically a two handed knife. It goes from flying open and free dropping to opening about halfway when flicked and staying put when the lockbar is depressed. Any more tips of things I can try from the awesome people here would be much appreciated! I'll try it all as I would really love to get this resolved without having to take up any more of the good people at CRK's time.
     
  11. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    Alright so no matter what I've tried, I haven't been able to fix the problem. I either need to sell the knife or maybe try to work something else out. I'm very loathe to get rid of it and maybe it shouldn't bother me but I've been waiting for a Sebenza for years and there are tons of other versions of the 21 that I love so I might try to get my hands on a Micarta inlay. Thanks so much to everyone for the help here!
     
  12. Ajack60

    Ajack60 Platinum Member Platinum Member

    Apr 21, 2013
    Well, if you're going to keep the knife then it needs an adjustment . The CF where the washer sits may be too smooth for it to bind to the washer. It may need to be roughed up/scratched a bit to hold the washer without it moving. Don't know for sure if that would resolve the issue or what it would do for the resale of the knife.
    How old is the knife? Maybe send it in for new washers. If you bought it used, the washers could have been polished/sanded and is creating the problem. Maybe the washers are perfectly flat and needs to be warped/burred a bit for it to bind. On a couple of my keepers, I've somewhat polished the washers to make the blade smoother. One had a burr that was making it rough and the other had a high spot. I've got two 25's with CF slabs, one from the factory and the other is after market and the washers on the CF don't move.
     
  13. Lapedog

    Lapedog

    Dec 7, 2016
    Do not rough up the CF scale under the washer, if it makes the action worse then that will be irreversible. Instead try applying something sticky to the side of the washer contacting the CF scale.
     
  14. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    Good suggestions, thank you. The knife is about 2 months old, and I didn't have it for one of those months since it developed a blade crack near the thumb lug and needed to go back in. It had the washer problem before and after its visit back to CRK.
     
  15. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    I was thinking of maybe a drop of loctite but with the holes in the washers I thought it would be too risky. I think at this point I may try to get rid of it. It will be quite a while until I can spend this much on a knife again and don't really want to worry about it being so fiddly every time I disassemble, etc. Maybe something can be worked out and I can simply get a new front scale out of plain ti or something like that.
     
  16. Ajack60

    Ajack60 Platinum Member Platinum Member

    Apr 21, 2013
    Yes, you can purchase a presentation slab from CRK. You'd have to call for pricing.
    Personally, I wouldn't do any type of sticky, it may get all over the blade and you may not be able to get it off and whatever you put on it may have a chemical reaction with the resin in the CF and really screw it up. Not all CF is the same, I've had some that were rough feeling, I guess to have a better grip and some has been smooth, just like the patterns vary so does the finish.
     
  17. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    This makes sense. I'll just try to talk to CRK again and figure out something with them hopefully!
     
  18. Lapedog

    Lapedog

    Dec 7, 2016
    By something sticky I was thinking some like double sided tape or something. Not something that can run.
     
    BK14 likes this.
  19. BK14

    BK14

    338
    Sep 13, 2016
    Well I heard back from CRK, and am quite sadly, pretty disappointed. They said that I should let the knife break in and if it doesn't I can send it in to have it looked at. This is a bit odd to me as the technician in the shop said that nothing could be done to fix this problem, and the knife has already been in the shop once for warranty work. They said they would be able to put a new stop sleeve and front scale on, for over $150 from me. I hate to say that I am a bit disappointed, as my first foray into Chris Reeve, I have only been able to actually use the knife for a few weeks since I bought it in August. I guess I have no choice but to follow their instructions. If anyone else has had this problem, did the knife wear out of it? Thank you all so much for the continued help.
     
  20. JB in SC

    JB in SC Gold Member Gold Member

    May 19, 2001
    Use it, don't disassemble it for a few months. The bronze washers might take more time to properly break in. Some 21's will free drop, some never will...but it's not a given. I wouldn't modify the knife.
     

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