Strider Experts: I have some questions...

[Poez]

...
That pic of Mr. Bob in the shop , the other guys look just a tad intimidated...

There could not be any different. Product philosophies are very far apart:
Bob Loveless - product excellence: manufacture the best product there is, as you understand it.
Strider - marketing concept: produce what consumer wants; and even better, create the demand which was not there before.
So I do not think Mr. Loveless was saying anything pleasant there. And he was right from his prospective. But of course that does not make the marketing approach any less effective - quite opposite.

 

[cziv]

Off topic but - Try a Hinderer if you like it's looks, it's as tough as a Strider. The lock makes full contact against the blade tang. I kinda thought that Sebenza did also but maybe not? I was going to buy my 1st Strider but I read so much baloney about them and all of my Hinderers have been perfect - really. :thumbup:

 

[Cynic2701]

I'm pretty sure that the Sebenza contacts all the way across the blade tang--the angle of the arc of the lock bar matches with the angle of the blade tang. Sure, there will be more pressure at the point furthest from the pivot, but that is unrelated to the contact on the rest of the lock bar face.

 

[neuron]

There could not be any different. Product philosophies are very far apart:
Bob Loveless - product excellence: manufacture the best product there is, as you understand it.
Strider - marketing concept: produce what consumer wants; and even better, create the demand which was not there before.
So I do not think Mr. Loveless was saying anything pleasant there. And he was right from his prospective. But of course that does not make the marketing approach any less effective - quite opposite.

Sorry, but this is just a silly and inaccurate characterization of Strider's "product philosophy". I'd say your characterization of Bob Loveless's philosophy accurately describes not only his philosophy but also Strider's and that of pretty much every other decent knife company. The key phrase is, of course, "as you understand it". In the case of Strider, the way they understand building the "best product there is" is to build the most durable, robust, and functional knife they can while still keeping it at a weight/size that can be carried and used; anything that's not of direct functional importance takes a backseat. With a company like CRK, just to take another example, extremely high tolerances, precision in manufacturing, and getting as close to perfection as possible in all aspects of manufacturing are the order of the day. And so on for any other serious knifemaker/company one might name...

Anyway, I don't want this thread to be derailed by yet another food fight about Strider as a company, so that's about all I'll say on the subject.

EDIT: The only other thing I'd add is to suggest that anyone who's considering a Strider buy/borrow/handle one for themselves and make their own judgments. As this thread and countless others one might dig up via the search function will evidence, they're probably one of the most polarizing companies in the knife world, with very divergent opinions about the company and their products.

 

[kawr]

Off topic but - Try a Hinderer if you like it's looks, it's as tough as a Strider. The lock makes full contact against the blade tang. I kinda thought that Sebenza did also but maybe not? I was going to buy my 1st Strider but I read so much baloney about them and all of my Hinderers have been perfect - really. :thumbup:

Sebenza lockbar contacts the tang flush and with a much larger surface area than on a strider. It's easy to check this by looking at the wearing on the lockbar surface. Not sure why there is always so much wrong info in strider threads. The way striders and crks lockup are different. They both have their pros and cons so ultimately it comes down to preference. If you want a lockup with a shit vent that lets gunk flow through better but will wear out fast get a strider. If you want a more stable and reliable lockup that will probably last a lifetime get a sebenza.

 

[cziv]

Sebenza lockbar contacts the tang flush and with a much larger surface area than on a strider. It's easy to check this by looking at the wearing on the lockbar surface. Not sure why there is always so much wrong info in strider threads. The way striders and crks lockup are different. They both have their pros and cons so ultimately it comes down to preference. If you want a lockup with a shit vent that lets gunk flow through better but will wear out fast get a strider. If you want a more stable and reliable lockup that will probably last a lifetime get a sebenza.

Thanks for the confrmation kawr, Cynic2701. I've owned 4 large Sebenzas (down to 2 now) and when I look at the lock mating area on the tang, it looks solidly marked by the lockbar, as if the full lock is touching the tang. I don't understand the differences between the Strider lockup and my Sebenzas, but that's a topic for another thread.

I wish I knew what a shit vent was - sounds intriguing?? Who would want one and if needed then why don't my XM's & CRKs have them. HMMM? Time to use the search function and good luck with your Strider to the OP! :thumbup:

 

[Poez]

....
Anyway, I don't want this thread to be derailed by yet another food fight about Strider as a company, so that's about all I'll say on the subject.
...

That is a good idea. I do not want this neither, so will not call your view silly, or any other names.
I did not mean anything bad at all. If you had any understanding of various marketing strategies companies use to achieve their financial and growth goals, you would see that.

 

[neuron]

I did not mean anything bad at all. If you had any understanding of various marketing strategies companies use to achieve their financial and growth goals, you would see that.

I have plenty of understanding of such things and don't deny that Strider is very effective with their marketing strategies. All I was objecting to -- and calling "silly" -- was what I took to be the implication, by way of the purported contrast to Bob Loveless's design philosophy, that Strider's focus is on marketing instead of making what they take to be the best product possible (by their understanding of "best"). If I was wrong in that interpretation of what you wrote -- which I take, from what you said about "not meaning anything bad at all" by the contrast, I was -- then I apologize for calling your characterization silly.

 

[neuron]

Off topic but - Try a Hinderer if you like it's looks, it's as tough as a Strider. The lock makes full contact against the blade tang. I kinda thought that Sebenza did also but maybe not? I was going to buy my 1st Strider but I read so much baloney about them and all of my Hinderers have been perfect - really. :thumbup:

I've only owned a couple of Hinderers -- both of which I've now sold off -- but I remember checking one of them (a production XM-18 flipper) when the topic of lockbar contact came up in another thread. And at least on that one, it was the same type of lockup as Strider/Emerson/etc., namely contact only at the farthest point from the pivot, rather than along the full face of the lockbar like on a Sebenza.

 

[cziv]

I've only owned a couple of Hinderers -- both of which I've now sold off -- but I remember checking one of them (a production XM-18 flipper) when the topic of lockbar contact came up in another thread. And at least on that one, it was the same type of lockup as Strider/Emerson/etc., namely contact only at the farthest point from the pivot, rather than along the full face of the lockbar like on a Sebenza.

I have an XM-18 in my pocket. I just shined an led flashlight inside with the blade opened and just the the last 1/2 (outermost) of the lockbar is blocking the light from my flashlight. Closer to the inside below the detent ball there's some light coming out. So much for that myth eh? Now I'm pissed thanks neuron! POS! with a shit vent right? :barf:

 

[Reeek]

I agree with this - I have $60 knives that are more solid than some customs I have or had.

Wow. I have yearned for a Strider of some form for a while now but any amount of blade-play is unacceptable to me on a locking knife. I have Kershaw's costing under $50 that have zero play , one would think a knife of this ... integrity , would have no play as well. ?

Tostig

 

[Reeek]

It seems to me that getting perfect contact with the full face of the lockbar or most of the lockbar is astronomically more difficult than a single point. I say that because some knives I have or had where the lock contact was using more than a single point, all had vertical downward play and the lock felt as if it were rocking on a fulcrum when I exerted moderate downward pressure on the spine. Also, while doing the up and down pressure by holding the opened knife and pinching the spine with the other hand I can see and feel the lockbar moving in and out and I even had the locak fail a couple times doing this. And I'm not talking about putting the knife is a vise. This is just moderate up and down pressure by pinching the spine of the opened knife and applying moderate up and down pressure on the lock face bare handed.

Solid lock up matters most to me in a folder and it seems that the more you pay, solid lockup becomes more fleeting.

 

[Poez]

Could it be that the bigger the contact area, the longer it takes for knife to break-in and the more chance of sticky lock?
It is always a balance of many things.

Or using a different type of lock...

 

[cziv]

I have an XM-18 in my pocket. I just shined an led flashlight inside with the blade opened and just the the last 1/2 (outermost) of the lockbar is blocking the light from my flashlight. Closer to the inside below the detent ball there's some light coming out. So much for that myth eh? Now I'm pissed thanks neuron! POS! with a shit vent right? :barf:

I just pulled out another XM-18 and the same thing - partial lock bar to tang contact! Took out one of my Sebenzas and shined the flashlight in there and it was totally flush - no light showing along the total lockbar and tang interface. The Sebenza is technically the more expensive knife though if you;re a first responder.

 

[neuron]

I have an XM-18 in my pocket. I just shined an led flashlight inside with the blade opened and just the the last 1/2 (outermost) of the lockbar is blocking the light from my flashlight. Closer to the inside below the detent ball there's some light coming out. So much for that myth eh? Now I'm pissed thanks neuron! POS! with a shit vent right? :barf:

I just pulled out another XM-18 and the same thing - partial lock bar to tang contact! Took out one of my Sebenzas and shined the flashlight in there and it was totally flush - no light showing along the total lockbar and tang interface. The Sebenza is technically the more expensive knife though if you;re a first responder.

Haha, why are you disappointed/upset about this? The lockup on your Hinderers is, I'm sure, excellent, and I bet Rick wouldn't have decided to do it that way if he didn't see merit in the design or thought it was inferior to some other way of doing it.

This was pretty much the conclusion of another thread on lock contact points a while back (the same one that prompted me to check the XM-18 I had at the time), but it's worth repeating here. As long as the lockbar-blade tang are making contact in the way the manufacturer/designer intended them to, both the full and partial (at point farthest from the pivot) contact approaches will make for an excellent frame or liner lock. It's only really when things aren't making contact the way they should that you can run into problems such as lock slippage.

 

[JNewell]

I am reminded of the old saying, "buy the gun, not the story." In my opinion, based on owning four of them, Striders are worth buying and worthy performers, wholly apart from the internet hype. If you disagree, no worries.

By the way, on the washers, I don't think there's "design," I think there's mostly happenstance. The washers on my Sebenzas don't rotate...it doesn't really prove much either way if they do or don't. If one side of a Strider rotates and the other doesn't, it's either coincidence or at most the difference between the Ti and G10 sides as far as friction on the bronze washer goes. There are no issues that are going to arise as a result. :thumbup:

 

[cziv]

Haha, why are you disappointed/upset about this? The lockup on your Hinderers is, I'm sure, excellent, and I bet Rick wouldn't have decided to do it that way if he didn't see merit in the design or thought it was inferior to some other way of doing it.

This was pretty much the conclusion of another thread on lock contact points a while back (the same one that prompted me to check the XM-18 I had at the time), but it's worth repeating here. As long as the lockbar-blade tang are making contact in the way the manufacturer/designer intended them to, both the full and partial (at point farthest from the pivot) contact approaches will make for an excellent frame or liner lock. It's only really when things aren't making contact the way they should that you can run into problems such as lock slippage.

Right on man I was kidding really. I'd never part with my Hinderers! They lock hard enough for my use and I've chopped down a lot of branches and even more little green ones with my XM-18!

I am reminded of the old saying, "buy the gun, not the story." In my opinion, based on owning four of them, Striders are worth buying and worthy performers, wholly apart from the internet hype. If you disagree, no worries.

By the way, on the washers, I don't think there's "design," I think there's mostly happenstance. The washers on my Sebenzas don't rotate...it doesn't really prove much either way if they do or don't. If one side of a Strider rotates and the other doesn't, it's either coincidence or at most the difference between the Ti and G10 sides as far as friction on the bronze washer goes. There are no issues that are going to arise as a result. :thumbup:

Well said JNewell, it's an example of 2 good working designs! :thumbup:

 

[Striderco]

was thinking of expanding my strider collection. now im having second thoughts. like someone said find a seb with blade play! Im sorry but if i fork over 400-500 for a knife it better not have blade play or i dont want it!! Sorry Mick dont think ill be buying anymore pal!

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

was thinking of expanding my strider collection. now im having second thoughts. like someone said find a seb with blade play! Im sorry but if i fork over 400-500 for a knife it better not have blade play or i dont want it!! Sorry Mick dont think ill be buying anymore pal!

Straw man. The SMF and Sebenza are two totally different knives. With that logic a hardcore Strider fan could say "No more sebs for me! If it can't pry a car door open for 500 dollars then I don't want it!"

 

[lafferjc]

I've owned 3 Sebenzas with 2 of them having no blade play and 1 developing some a year into ownership.
I've owned 5 Striders with 4 of them having no blade play and one developing some blade play 8 months into ownership.
I'll keep buying both offerings from both amazing makers.
I'm a proud owner of both Chris Reeve and Strider....along with many others.