Review Modern Slip Joint Knives: Wasp and Proper (and Lionsteels))

[miso2]

Hi all,


I recently acquired a couple of modern slip joint knives.
Manly Wasp and Benchmade Proper 319 Krein regrind

My intension was to find a good modern slip joint knife ground thin with a premium stainless steel.
I had a nice custom slip joint knife fulfilling this.
But the spring broke, and I had to send it back to the maker abroad for repair.
That was a bit annoying and made me think that I need something more easily replaceable for EDC.

So, I went in to search production pieces, which would check all the boxes.
Unfortunately, most of modern variety seem to come with thick edges, and in many cases thick blade, too, as compare to traditional knives like GECs.

Then, I learned here that Manly Wasp is thinly ground to a relatively thin edge from its rather thick blade stock (0.11").
With S90V blade, it felt a real bargain.
I went with the orange G10 version.

Benchmade Proper has been ticking me a while, but the thick edge has repelled me.
I knew the Krein reground variants and pressed "order" immediately when I found that DLT was (and still is) offering them again.
Replaceability may not be good, as it is not certain whether they will be offered by Krein in the future.
Still, I can get a factory Proper to have spare parts in case something goes wrong, like the spring.

They are both great knives and worth every penny at different price points.
I am going to compare these two modern slip joint knives below.

 

[miso2]

The specs

                              Wasp                          Proper
  Overall length:             176 mm (6.93”)                170 mm (6.69")
  Closed length:              101 mm (3.98”)                97.8 mm (3.85")
  Blade Length:               75 mm (2.95”)                 72 mm (2.83")
  Blade thickness:            2.3 mm (0.09”)                2.04 mm (0.08")
  BTE at 15 DPS:              0.23 mm (0.009”)              0.23 mm (0.009"): from the original 0.64mm (0.025")
  Edge angle:                 15 DPS                        20 DPS
  Blade material:             S90V                          S30V
  Blade grind:                Flat                          Flat
  Handle thickness:           16 mm with clip (0.63”)       11 mm (0.43")
  Handle material:            Orange G10                    Canvas Micarta
  Weight:                     78 g (2.75 oz)                57 g (2 oz)
  Nail nick:                  Single                        Single
  Stops:                      Three                         One
  Pull (5 for SAK):           6~7                           5~6
  Pinchable:                  Yes                           Yes
  Pocket clip:                Yes                           No
  Internal stop pin:          Yes                           Yes

They are pretty comparable size-wise, except for the handle thickness.
Proper is quite thin, as thin as GEC #15.
Wasp is a lot thicker, especially with the pocket clip.
But the handle itself is slightly thinner than Bullnose.

Although the blade heights and stock thicknesses are quite different, their behind the edge thicknesses are virtually identical.
Also, the blade profiles are quite similar, making them comparable in cutting performance.

Other common features:
Screw construction. Both can be completely disassembled.
Unique pivot. They both have sorts of flat-cam hybrid tang with ramps, and the pull becomes heavier from the half-stop to the full open position.
Internal stop pin. This prevents the blade from hitting the back spring.
Washers. So the liners do not scratch the blade.
Milled liners.
Short travel distance of spring. I don't see the spring protrude much. It is very subtle as compared to GEC and Case. Less chance of breaking?


So they are filled with nice modern features, and yet as slicey as traditional knives.
I can highly recommend them for someone who wants sub 3" slip joint with a modern stainless steel and the traditional cutting capability instead of a pocket pry bar.

Now I am going to review individual knives briefly below.

 

[miso2]

The Wasp.
I got it at about $50.
With S90V?
Just wow.....

But the knife is not cheap.
Nice CNCed blade with a thin edge at 15 DPS (Their factory tour video is fun to watch).
Nice deep carry pocket clip.

The action was a bit stiff at the beginning.
I did my regular flushing cycles, and it became pretty smooth.
I was not sure about the 4 stop pivot but surprisingly got used to it quickly.

The handle feels very sturdy.
The orange G10 scales are pretty and enough grippy.
I do not find the nail nick really useful.
Since the blade is well proud of the handle, you can easily pinch it open even with your left hand.

Some may not like the exposed blade tang.


There were few issues with the knife.
The spine of the blade was very sharp.
Because of this, it was painful to close the blade.
I had to sand it with #2,000 paper.

The tip is about to come out from the handles.
I will need to grind it down soon.

The blade shape is unique.
I take it as a variant of sod buster.
It would be nicer if the point is dropped a bit.

You can see how narrow the edge bevel is for Wasp as compared to Bullnose at same 15 DPS.

Overall, it is a really solid slip joint knife with a nice blade.
The steel feels quite similar to S110V in sharpening and edge retention.
With the low price point and good availability, I do not hesitate to use hell out of it (for a non-locking knife).
This is going to be my travel companion.

 

[miso2]

Proper.
What a handsome knife!

First of all, the spring on my sample is good.
It is not strong as Bullnose, but comparable to GEC #15.

I love the canvas micarta.
It feels fluffy and warm in hand.

It should pair very nicely with jeans.

No pocket clip.
You can just drop this light weight knife into a pocket and forget about it.
Or you can put it into a pocket slip.
Mine is a medium sized slip (5" x 2"), big enough to swallow this thin knife.

The blade is very utilitarian.
It has a nice pointy tip to penetrate plastic package.
I think the edge line is similar to my favorite Zulu spear pattern.
Very easy to maintain the edge from the heel to the tip consistently on Edge Pro.

Some issues.
First, the centering was bit off.
I was able to fix it to some extent by tweaking the pivot and scales.

The spring on the back is not perfectly flush.
It does not bother be very much, but some may not like it for a $200 knife.
There are gaps between the liners, which can only be detected under light.

Lastly, the regrind is not consistent and even.
Not too bad.
But it would be a lot nicer if I can get even edge bevels on both sides.


Overall, I really love the knife.
This is my second encounter with S30V.
I thought it should be quite similar to S35VN.
But the steel seems to take a keener edge, and deburring was easier than S35VN.
I don't know if it is the steel or heat-treatment.
Anyway, I love the steel, too.
With the pretty and comfortable micarta handle, slicey blade, good stainless steel, easy deployment, and light weight, I think it would be a great EDC companion.
I plan to rotate this with a custom slip joint, which should be coming back from repair soon, and reground Lionsteel Otnat, which is coming in several months.

 

[popedandy]

Excellent job on the comparison and review!

 

[on_the_edge]

Thank you for the review. As between the two, if you had to pick one, which would it be and why?

 

[miso2]

Thank you for the review. As between the two, if you had to pick one, which would it be and why?

They are at very different price points, $50 vs $200.

With that said, I would choose Proper regrind because it feels like a high-end modern slip joint knife or an upgraded GEC to me, and that is what I have wanted.
The design is well thought out.
Ergonomic contoured handle, utilitarian blade shape, materials, the flat-cam hybrid tang, and so on.
And it is the better slicer of the two, probably due to the smaller blade height than Wasp.

Wasp feels more rugged and like a Case Sod Buster on heavy steroid.
You can definitely put it to work without hesitation.

The other considerations are pocket clip and warranty.
Proper regrind is out of Benchmade warranty.
I did not care about it because I live outside of the US anyway.
But that may matter to you.
If you must need a pocket clip, then Wasp.

Hope this helps.

 

[miso2]

I ground the tip of Wasp a bit.
It is more safer in pocket.

 

[J D Wijbenga]

Excellent review of two interesting knives! Thanks!

 

[mycough]

This is fantastic write up. I have ordered a wasp already, Miso, pm me about your signature, maybe I can help...

 

[cbach8tw]

Good review. I have two Wasps in Sandvik, very good user knives, and the new ones now have a stop pin to prevent the blade from hitting the liner when closing, earlier models did not have that if I recall correctly. The only thing I have had trouble with mine was the clip came loose on my orange one, and I think it is mostly me, the wrench I got with mine does not really tighten the screws in the clip, maybe wrong size and or maybe could be slightly stripped from factory. The rep did offer to send a replacement hardware kit to see it helps, which is nice, but I already bought a set, still need to take time to look at it. I also did use the wrench to tighten the blade pivot on my other one, which helped keep the blade tight from side to side play. Overall mine have been good light weight users for the price. After awhile the four blade stops are addictive. The price you got for the S90v is really good.
I really like my Proper, the edge did seem a little rough, not a regrind, but it is a usable working edge. This is a nice gentleman's folder. So, I can easily open it, but does yours seem to be a little too easy to open too? Light spring? Have not used it enough to see how well the edge holds up or how hard it is to sharpen yet. I want to get the clip point version now too, but my only draw back is the price. I had a gift card and found it on sale so I only had to spend about 30.00, but if I had not had those discounts, the price for a new one is a little high. Just my two cents.

 

[cbach8tw]

My Wasp is the topmknife in the photo of all the orange knives. Then my black Wasp and my Proper.

 

[miso2]

Good review. I have two Wasps in Sandvik, very good user knives, and the new ones now have a stop pin to prevent the blade from hitting the liner when closing, earlier models did not have that if I recall correctly. The only thing I have had trouble with mine was the clip came loose on my orange one, and I think it is mostly me, the wrench I got with mine does not really tighten the screws in the clip, maybe wrong size and or maybe could be slightly stripped from factory. The rep did offer to send a replacement hardware kit to see it helps, which is nice, but I already bought a set, still need to take time to look at it. I also did use the wrench to tighten the blade pivot on my other one, which helped keep the blade tight from side to side play. Overall mine have been good light weight users for the price. After awhile the four blade stops are addictive. The price you got for the S90v is really good.
I really like my Proper, the edge did seem a little rough, not a regrind, but it is a usable working edge. This is a nice gentleman's folder. So, I can easily open it, but does yours seem to be a little too easy to open too? Light spring? Have not used it enough to see how well the edge holds up or how hard it is to sharpen yet. I want to get the clip point version now too, but my only draw back is the price. I had a gift card and found it on sale so I only had to spend about 30.00, but if I had not had those discounts, the price for a new one is a little high. Just my two cents.

Thank you for your review!
Nice set of knives.

The clip on my Wasp got loose and could not really be fixed even when the screw is tightened down.
I guess it is how it is.
I will take it off and install a replacement plate at some point.

Regarding proper, the spring of mine is enough stout.
I need as much force as for Bullnose to initiate the motion of the blade to close.
But I can open it much more easily than Bullnose because of the rounded tang and the ramp, and because the spring does not move (or bend) very much.
This is quite different from GEC or Case knives, of which springs protrude a lot during the operation.
I guess this makes the walk&talk feel very different from traditionals.
Actually I consider it a design feature and like it.
Especially, the quieter talk reminds me of Umnumzaan a bit.


Edit:
I measured the initial force required to move the blade to close.
I put the blade spine on a scale about 1 inch away from the tip and pushed it down to measure the pressure.
Case Sod Buster Jr.: 0.88 lbs
GEC #15: 1.32 lbs
Proper: 1.54 lbs
Bullnose: 1.59 lbs
You can see that Proper is as secure as Bullnose at the open position.

The blade tang is partially rounded.

Sod Buster Jr. has a fully rounded tang.
But it is still snappier than Proper.
This probably depends on where the spring rests on the blade at each position.
Also, as mentioned above, how much the spring protrudes and moves away from the blade may matter.

The spring of Proper drops a very short distance (invisible in the pic) to hit the blade.
This makes the knife much less snappier than Sod Buster Jr. or Bullnose when opening.
It is as snappier as SAK main blade.

Also, the rounded tang prevents the blade to drop shut from a long distance.
This is how close you can keep the blade away from the handle before the spring forces it to close.

This is probably why the "talk" is not great with Proper, but not the spring tension.
Again, I take it as a design feature and like it.

 

[miso2]

Edited.

 

[cbach8tw]

Thank you for your review!
Nice set of knives.

The clip on my Wasp got loose and could not really be fixed even when the screw is tightened down.
I guess it is how it is.
I will take it off and install a replacement plate at some point.

Regarding proper, the spring of mine is enough stout.
I need as much force as for Bullnose to initiate the motion of the blade to close.
But I can open it much more easily than Bullnose because of the rounded tang and the ramp, and because the spring does not move (or bend) very much.
This is quite different from GEC or Case knives, of which springs protrude a lot during the operation.
I guess this makes the walk&talk feel very different from traditionals.
Actually I consider it a design feature and like it.
Especially, the quieter talk reminds me of Umnumzaan a bit.


Edit:
I measured the initial force required to move the blade to close.
I put the blade spine on a scale about 1 inch away from the tip and pushed it down to measure the pressure.
Case Sod Buster Jr.: 0.88 lbs
GEC #15: 1.32 lbs
Proper: 1.54 lbs
Bullnose: 1.59 lbs
You can see that Proper is as secure as Bullnose at the open position.

The blade tang is partially rounded.

Sod Buster Jr. has a fully rounded tang.
But it is still snappier than Proper.
This probably depends on where the spring rests on the blade at each position.
Also, as mentioned above, how much the spring protrudes and moves away from the blade may matter.

The spring of Proper drops a very short distance (invisible in the pic) to hit the blade.
This makes the knife much less snappier than Sod Buster Jr. or Bullnose when opening.
It is as snappier as SAK main blade.

Also, the rounded tang prevents the blade to drop shut from a long distance.
This is how close you can keep the blade away from the handle before the spring forces it to close.

This is probably why the "talk" is not great with Proper, but not the spring tension.
Again, I take it as a design feature and like it.

Thanks for info and something to think about, I feel better knowing that the lock up of my Proper is secure and not just my belief when opening that the spring is light. And how the tang is rounded so not to fall far and thus maybe strike the blade on closing.

 

[Alberta Ed]

Love my WASP in 12C27. It's Europe-legal if you're traveling.

 

[Therom]

I have chosen a Wasp in 12c27 steel
I like a steel that is easier to sharpen than s90v, especially since I am not planning to abuse this knife
It is one of my most carried knife and it was my re-entry way into slip joints

Since I have the Wasp I have got a TRM Atlas, an Hinderer Slippy, a Spyderco ukpk and a Benchmade Proper clip point....

While the wasp is the cheapest it is clearly one of the more carried with the Atlas

 

[miso2]

Love my WASP in 12C27. It's Europe-legal if you're traveling.

Yes.
I am going to Germany next month, and Wasp will accompany me!

 

[miso2]

I have chosen a Wasp in 12c27 steel
I like a steel that is easier to sharpen than s90v, especially since I am not planning to abuse this knife
It is one of my most carried knife and it was my re-entry way into slip joints

Since I have the Wasp I have got a TRM Atlas, an Hinderer Slippy, a Spyderco ukpk and a Benchmade Proper clip point....

While the wasp is the cheapest it is clearly one of the more carried with the Atlas

I do not have experienced with 12C27, but it looks like a nice rounded steel.
Interesting that it is also used for ice skate blades.
It must be tough with good edge retention.

TRM Atlas is a knife I am looking into, too.
Reasonably thin blade stock and ground thin.

 

[Therom]

For slip joint I prefer softer steel
Most of the time slip joints are used with reason and I prefer to keep sharpening as easy as possible... I may have been influenced but my time carrying a SAK as a teenager

Benchmade does a great s30v

Manly 12c27 take keep a good edge and I super easy to sharpen

I would have preferred something like 154cm on the Atlas rather than S35vn but so far I had no issue with the s35vn on this knife

BD1N is good on the UKPK

My only concern is the 20cv on the slippy - I have not sharpened it so far and I hope it will not to hard to work on