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$10 forge burner , if that.

Mark Williams

Mark Williams

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Nov 28, 2000
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4,760
I know a lot of you guys have seen this burner or a variation there of, but here's mine just for S & Gs.

The pipe sections are 1 1/4" glavanized nipples. If you can get the black pipe. Go for it. I dont see as where it makes any difference. This burner will only get warm if it is slid into a section of tailpipe going into the forge. The sections of cutain rod are 3" long and brazed on the ends to keep them together. The hole in the orifice is a highly engineered miracle of modern bladesmithing. A #52 drill bit was put in the piece of copper tubing a squished on either side. The tubing is just over 6". Using my wife's blowdryer, I could forge weld a battleship if it would fit in the forge :D

All credit to my friend Jim Arbuckle for sharing the design with me.
 
I'm kinda lost on the burner. 3" lengths braised around what for a center? They all run lengthwise with the pipe?
I'm getting ready to build my forge/ salt treatment set up and need a burner design.
Take Care
TJ
 
Mark, How much gas pressure do you have to use? I've never seen the curtain rod used inside the burner before. Is there an advantage, if so could you explain it to this oldman...
 
Lemme guess, is the curtain rod for creating turbulence for mixing the air/fuel?

That be one biga$$ burner, Mark! :)
 
Since Mark seems to be busy I'll make up some BS for until he gets back :footinmou

The curtain rods brazed in there appear to be a flame retainer. They hold the flame back and keep a good mix going. You can run higher pressures on the blower and gas then. If your flame gets blown too far off the end of the burner it will be erratic. Similar to when you tune an oxy acetlylene torch, if you turn the gas up too high the flame jumps off the nozzle.

Just my 2 cents. It looks like a pretty good burner :)
 
I'm not even sure what the burner does, but galvanized metal when heated puts off zinc in gas form and can be very hazardous, and it only takes one time if you are sensitive to it.
 
Mark: That is almost the same burner that I make. Instead of a copper tube I use a 1/4 npt black pipe with a cape on the end and a 1/8" hole drilled in the center.
 
That looks like a real nice and simple burner!
My forge is a pice of 10" pipe about 12" long with 2 layers of 1" inswool on the inside and a single brick firebrick floor (just found some stainless sheet for a welding shelf :D ). I have only one ventury (Ron Reil style) burner in it and I have been able to weld up some cable damascus with it. Is there any real advantage to going with the forced air burner? Would it be better for welding stacked billets of damascus? BTW, my forge is used outside and must be taken down at the end of each session. Just curious.


Matt
 
Forced air gives you more control. You always have positive pressure. With an atmospheric/venturi bunrer you rely on it drawing air and breathing properly. Sometimes if its windy you'll have problems with it chugging or not buring as hot as it should because you get back pressure which effects the flame.
 
Thanks for the pix Mark. Mark explained this to me before but, I'm dense and I need pictures. This is very much like my burner, which is the same a George's but, I added more pipe for a better fuel air mix. You think adding the curtain rod to the first section of pipe would help the BTUs?

Here's mine... http://www.mountainhollow.net/welding_forge.htm
 
Matt is correct,

I didnt mean to say glavinized : I meant galvanized. :) (tard)

The black pipe comment was to mean that the local place I went to didnt have black pipe, thus the galvanized.

This would create a problem ....but. I just got through forging from the time I posted this till now, and I pulled the burner out of the piece of tailpipe and it is just warm :).

The amount of gas it uses will be more than a venturi for sure. I've had this discussion with another knothead once.(not meaning anyone here) Because of the opening being a #52 size hole ; plus the gaps from just squishing the copper tube around the drill bit, I'm running at less than 1 psi. I'm also having to open the needle valve a heck of a lot more to get a reading on the gauge than with the venturi burner to read 1 psi.

Regardless of gas usage. It works great and it will run outside the forge :) I was lighting it with the gas on and then turning on the blower once it was in the forge. Now I just throw in a paper towel light the gas and hit the blower. Every now and then it will woof if I'm not quick enough with the blower.

I think what we need is three differant forges. One for welding . One for small stuff and one for large stuff and heat treating.
 
I'm not sure if the curtain rods do anything other than help channel the colder air in an aligned path around the orifice. I tried a burner like yours and Georges, J. That's what made me think to mention it to you. With the copper tube blowing down the middle of the pipe, instead of just forming a mixture with the air , it seems to work much better. I would imagine you could play around with different size openings and dial this thing right in for the volume of the forge.
 
Mark, How long are the 1 1/4 dia. nipples? I can't wait till IG reads this....... I've been running ventura's for at least 3 years now but I'm ready for a change. Looking for more MPG.
 
I think the curtain rods could have a pretty significant difference. I've got a bernz-omatic heat shrink torch that the tip burned out of. It had a little diamon shaped plug that went in the end so that you ended up with 5 small openings instead of one big one. Without that plug it won't stay lit :mad:
I stuck a machine screw in across the opening and it would burn pretty good.
Then I stuck 3 machine screws through it so they crossed the opening and it burned almost like new :cool:
Flame seems to depend not only on the volume of gas and air, but also how fast they are moving, how they are mixed and who knows how many other variables.
I've got my forge set up with a modified venturi burner. I hook a shop vac to it with a large PVC ball valve to adjust flow for when I'm forging. This runs super hot at 1psi. I haven't tried welding with it but I probably could. If not, the limiting factor is the design of my forge, not my burner.
When I'm heat treating I take the shop vac off and just use it as a venturi burner. This makes it easier to keep the heat down where I want it for heat treating, and gives me a richer flame that helps cut down on scale.

I'm thinking of doing some experimenting with the burner to see if I can make it even better. Right now the orifice is just a 1/16" hole. I'm wondering what a smaller hole and higher pressure would do. Might try some other combinations as well.
 
John Frankl said:
Love it. Have you tried it without the curtain rod? If so, what were the differences?

Thanks,

John
Click to expand...
surely youv'e guessed.... without the curtain rod you have no curtains... so.....



everyone can see what your doing!! :)
 
Raymond Richard said:
Mark, How long are the 1 1/4 dia. nipples? I can't wait till IG reads this....... I've been running ventura's for at least 3 years now but I'm ready for a change. Looking for more MPG.
Click to expand...
HEHEHE!!!!! About time you seen the light. Got the parts listing on my site there Bubba. :D
 
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