2004 Riddle of Steel

[Howard Wallace]

I had the opportunity to attend Master at Arms James Keating’s 2004 Riddle of Steel training seminar in Hell’s Canyon. The lodge where we stayed was quiet and private, only accessible by jetboat. It was four days of very interesting knife instruction from both Mr. Keating and a number of other highly skilled instructors from around the country.

I had a wonderful time learning about some of the subtleties of the straight knife from the experts at the ROS. In an encounter with a skilled knife fighter nothing is as it appears to be. The scary looking attack is in fact not what it appears to be at all, but instead an equally lethal attack from another direction. I learned to never underestimate a guy with a knife.

During a knife show and tell one evening I asked Mr. Keating what he thought of the khukuri. He said it was a “ballsy” knife. He didn’t much like the fact that it had no guard, and mentioned that this would lead to a style of fighting that minimized defense. When I relayed Kami Sherpa’s advice that a khukuri fighter should be willing to “trade up,” for example to trade an arm for a head, he understood immediately. Mr. Keating’s preferred style incorporates considerable defense. He did close his comments on the khukuri by remarking to the attendees, “You do have to watch out for those guys though. They’ll kill you dead.”

I found it interesting that Mr. Keating expressed that respect for the khukuri, for a couple of reasons. One being that he is without question highly skilled in knife technique, and the other being that it lends itself to a style he does not care for.

Below is a picture of Mr. Keating and myself (in the hat) mugging for the camera. The Snake River and the beautiful Hell’s Canyon can be seen in the background. The knife Mr. Keating is holding is the Crossada he designed. It features guards (of course) and removable quillions that help not only to guard the hand but also to capture the opponent’s blade.

Here is a picture of some of the guest instructors. A couple of bucks gave us a sparring demonstration one early morning. It was amusing watching all of the knife instructors and aficionados silently and raptly watching as the two bucks occupied the training area with their demonstration.

I found the ROS to be a very worthwhile experience.

 

[BruiseLeee]

Interesting stuff, and nice pics.

 

[spiraltwista]

A yes the ring of steel, the devastaing clip point curving back slash, highly effective.

I guess its lucky Kami Sherpa never saw kukri combat, as a last ditch his tecnique works but normaly the man who loses his arm dies pretty fast.

But certainly attack is the best form of defense as they say! {especialy with kukri!

nice pix thanks for posting!

Spiral

 

[jim_l_clifton]

Howard,
Have to get there ONE DAY,a few of my friends attend,or have attended.Perhaps you met them,Vince,Lazi & Rob Patton!Mr. Keating is awesome.
Grandmaster Neil Hummerstone (Akijitsu) is another who thinks the Kuk is a devestating blade,we had an interesting discussion regarding the Kuk.
THE DUCK!

 

[Drdan]

Beautiful place the Riddle of Steel was held, Howard; looks like Heaven's Canyon to me. Any links for more information pertaining to the seminar or future ones? Thanks for the great photos...

 

[Daniel Koster]

Great pics....even better story. Thanks for sharing. I'm in awe....

 

[munk]

Hells Canyon, Idaho?

For some reason, more drowning deaths occur in Eastern Idaho on the Snake.


munk

 

[Howard Wallace]

A yes the ring of steel, the devastaing clip point curving back slash, highly effective.

I guess its lucky Kami Sherpa never saw kukri combat, as a last ditch his tecnique works but normaly the man who loses his arm dies pretty fast.

But certainly attack is the best form of defense as they say! {especialy with kukri!
Spiral

As I recall Kami Sherpa did have a story about drawing his khukuri. The guy he was facing ran away. Apparently there's a special something about someone who is willing to lose his arm in order to cleave your skull with a big knife.

One of the other attendees related a story he had heard about Gurkha trench warfare technique. He said the Gurkhas would run down the trench in a line. The first guy in line would strike the first enemy in the trench with the khukuri and then run by. He would not worry about the person he just struck as the second Gurkha would strike him again. The story goes that a squad of Gurkhas could clear a trench quickly this way, and an enemy looking down the trench would see a squad running full speed towards him and his comrades falling like dominoes.

Howard,
Perhaps you met them,Vince,Lazi & Rob Patton!Mr. Keating is awesome.
Grandmaster Neil Hummerstone (Akijitsu) is another who thinks the Kuk is a devestating blade,we had an interesting discussion regarding the Kuk.
THE DUCK!

Jim,
Vince and Rob were there. I'm not sure about the others. I'm pretty bad with names. Why don't you tell us the details of your conversation with Grandmaster Hummerstone? I'm interested in the reactions of martial artists to the khukuri.

Beautiful place the Riddle of Steel was held, Howard; looks like Heaven's Canyon to me. Any links for more information pertaining to the seminar or future ones? Thanks for the great photos...

Mr. Keating has a website at http://www.jamesakeating.com/ , and a blog page at http://www.jamesakeating.com/maajak1.html . There are a lot of interesting things on both pages, and information on the ROS is posted there. I expect the next ROS will roll around in 11 months or so.

The canyon is indeed beautiful. I want to go back some day and do some sturgeon fishing.

 

[Thomas Linton]

First, I am far from a "martial artist." (I'm with Indiana Jones on such matters. Awlays bring a gun to a knife fight.) However, I raise two questions.

1. I have seen martial artists engage with sticks and staves, neither of which have guards; yet, there was considrable defense involved. Why, therefore, would there necessarily be little or no defense in use of the khukuri?

2. I have seen Danny's (DIJ) tape, and I THOUGHT I saw many defensive moves.

Tom

 

[Howard Wallace]

First, I am far from a "martial artist." (I'm with Indiana Jones on such matters. Awlays bring a gun to a knife fight.) However, I raise two questions.

1. I have seen martial artists engage with sticks and staves, neither of which have guards; yet, there was considrable defense involved. Why, therefore, would there necessarily be little or no defense in use of the khukuri?

2. I have seen Danny's (DIJ) tape, and I THOUGHT I saw many defensive moves.

Tom

Tom,

Certainly, defense is possible and important. Evasion is critical in knife fighting. I think Mr. Keating's discomfort was due to the fact that a khukuri weilder has little mechanical defense against "sniping," or quick cuts to the knife hand. The guard provides some protection from this kind of attack. For the rare situation in which two opponents have weapons of equal range, sniping attacks allow decisive attack without coming into close range. Of course, many khukuris already have a range advantage over most other knives, and that by itself will minimise the sniping advantage.

Munk, Yes, that's the river.

 

[Yvsa]

The canyon is indeed beautiful. I want to go back some day and do some sturgeon fishing.

We used too live near the Snake and often drove there on the weekends too fish when we lived in Pullman Washington. The old man caught plenty of sturgeon, a prehistoric fish with absolutely no bones except for a spine. Be sure and pull the spinal cord out of the fish before skinning, gutting and cutting it into steaks.
We were told the spinal cord ruins the meat if it's left in, the same is true with the Spoonbill caught here in Oklahoma.
It's easily done by inserting a knife between the vertebrate just behind the head to severe the spinal cord and then carefully cutting around and just through the vertebrate at the tail without severing the spinal cord and then gently pulling the spinal cord out.
I have a couple of pix of a friend with the sturgeon he caught back in the '50s. IIRC It was 7'-2" long, weighed 210 pounds and took him 2 hours and 20 minutes to land the fish.
I'd have too look at the back of the pix to be absolutely sure of the figures, been a while since I've looked thru the fishing album.
A huge gob of nightcrawlers on a very large hook was the prefered and legal way of catching them.
I understand that there's a length limit on them now, can only be kept if they're between 3 and 6 foot long?
Your pix of the canyon brings back a lot of fond memories of hiking along the river looking for ndn artifacts while the old man was fishing. The country is very similar to where we used to go, a lot of fruit was raised in the canyon along where we went fishing.

 

[Howard Wallace]

We used too live near the Snake and often drove there on the weekends too fish when we lived in Pullman Washington.

Yvsa, I lived in Pullman from 83-86 while I was doing graduate work in physics at WSU and working on getting my teaching credentials. I suspect we've stomped over some of the same ground. Maybe jumped off of some of the same cliffs into the river.

 

[DannyinJapan]

"Evasion is critical in knife fighting"

I don't really think I should comment much becasue I have no idea what they were doing at the camp and I am not a definitive voice on anything.
however, I would like to suggest one thing about defense/evasion with the knife/small weapons.

Taking proper distance is something that you have to do using any kind of weapon. When you are attacked, you have to take proper distance to put the attacker in a bad position. He will overextend himself and lose his balance and you won't need much to defend yourself. (Dont think about the knife as being your defense. Your feet are your defense. Use them!)

Evasion is critical in any self defense situation. One does not simply block an attack. you have to move your body from the beginning. If you dont move out of the way, it doesnt matter how big your handguard is.
If you do move correctly, then you dont even need a knife.
A sharp pencil will do.

All weapons are the same, really. Move your body to a safe place and you will be OK.

 

[Ben Arown-Awile]

...Move your body to a safe place and you will be OK...

True. Like move your body to a place where people aren't fighting with knives.

 

[DannyinJapan]

That's right.
No joke.
100%

 

[raghorn]

You were just down the road, Howard. Thanks for the pics and commentary, drop me a line next time you're in the vicinity and I'll buy you dinner.

 

[spiraltwista]

Quote"As I recall Kami Sherpa did have a story about drawing his khukuri. The guy he was facing ran away. Apparently there's a special something about someone who is willing to lose his arm in order to cleave your skull with a big knife."

"One of the other attendees related a story he had heard about Gurkha trench warfare technique. He said the Gurkhas would run down the trench in a line. The first guy in line would strike the first enemy in the trench with the khukuri and then run by. He would not worry about the person he just struck as the second Gurkha would strike him again. The story goes that a squad of Gurkhas could clear a trench quickly this way, and an enemy looking down the trench would see a squad running full speed towards him and his comrades falling like dominoes. "

Well any unarmed man who doesnt run from a Gurkha with a kukri is rather silly! Theyy do maim , kill & intimidate after all.

But Combat is more than intimidation.{imho}

The other story someone recounted was certenly spread by Dr.Gwi, but doesnt seem to match the facs of trench construction.

Trenches are not long straight lines, they are a maze of corners & angles otherwise one shell would kill evryone in the entire trench.

Most ww1 reports & photos of Gurkha trench attacks show they would through a grenade over each loop of the trench then others would run round the corner with pistols,& kukris to clear up, then another grenade & so on.

Night raids involved the kukris a lot, but the concept of "steaming " through a mudy trench, doesnt seem to match the reports of the fierce hand to hand strugles, I have come across.

Spiral

ill see if I can find some photos & artists impresions {done by men who were there.}

 

[Howard Wallace]

Ben, Yours are probably the wisest words in this thread. I have never been in a knife fight and hope to live out my time on this earth without ever getting into one. Martial arts have intrigued me for years though, and continue to be an important part of my path. The puzzle of violence and how to deal with it is an important one for me. It does lead to apparent paradoxes for people looking in from the outside of my skin though.

Danny, Thanks for your insights and perceptions. They are much appreciated.

Spiral, Thanks for your thoughts. I had some similar thoughts about the trenches. I will not endorse the story I passed on, I just like to gossip and stir things up.

 

[spiraltwista]

Quote "I just like to gossip and stir things up."

Me too Howard!

To provoke thought & discusian & the search for knowledge, are all great pastimes, I find.

Cheers,
Spiral