25, the future?

gull wing

gull wing

Joined
May 4, 2002
Messages
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I don't know anyone on the "inside", but it seems the powers that be are leaning to 25 as "the future".
Just an observation.

25's:
Ti slab side
Micarta Inlay
Carbon Fiber slab side


If so, it leads to the question what line will go by the wayside?
X - 21
X - Umnum
X - Ti-Lock
X - Mnandi

I'm sure many of you know more than I do on this subject, please inform.
 
The 25 still has a long way to go. Wood inlays, insingo blade, tanto blade, CGG, handles, unique handles, and Damascus blades. All of that leads me to think that the 21 will be around for quite a bit longer.
 
Chris himself has said that he doesn't plan on discontinuing the 21 anytime soon.
I can't see the umnumzaan or the mnandi being discontinued, a lot of people love them, and they are different enough that the other models can't replace them.
The Ti-Lock, however, doesn't really seem to fit well with the CRK lineup.
There's no reason that they can't all coexist, though.
 
CRK is offering the 25 with more options than the Umnumzaan in the same size and build style, so I could see it replacing it one day.
 
I certainly hope they don't do away with the 21 for sure.
The others well, I could go either way. I might look hard at an Insingo 25 though.:)
 
gull wing said:
I certainly hope they don't do away with the 21 for sure.
The others well, I could go either way. I might look hard at an Insingo 25 though.:)
Click to expand...

I'm with gullwing, hope they don't get rid of the 21!! This may be blasphemy but i kinda think the finger choil on the 25 is, well... Ugly. Maybe i'm just too used to the straight lines of the 21. The inlaid version looks a little odd too. Seems like the two inlays just don't go together, shapewise that is. Who knows, maybe they'll grow on me and I'll end up with 7 or 8 or 12 of em'.
 
The 21 is freaking iconic!

If they ever do away with it in favor of that abomination with finger grooves they call the 25, I'm going to be soooooo mad

:p

Kidding of course, don't all you 25 nuts kill me:D
 
Regarding the Sebenza 21, it is unlikely they would discontinue their top seller in 2015 (as noted in this vid, the 21 is CRK's "Benchmark Product" and the "Backbone" of their offering that they are "known for worldwide", and is "their most popular knife"):

Go to the 5 minute mark
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGFjKYf06Qk

The Sebenza 25 is a very different knife than the 21 and I don't think it targets the same use or market. The only way the 25 could really be considered an "evolution" of the 21, at least in my mind, is if it was offered in a "25 lightweight" model with the same thinner blade and thinner profile that makes the 21 such a pocket-friendly large EDC. I love the 25, but it is much more of a tank than the large 21, and I think folks buying large 21's are not looking for a thick and heavy knife.
 
If I was to take a wild guess as to which models will be eventually discontinued my guess would be the Ti-Lock and the Umnumzaan. Again that's just if I had to make a guess on the topic.

If the Ti-Lock goes away, I'd like to see it replaced with a model based on it, but in RIL. I could see the Umnumzaan being replaced with another large tactical folder with a brand new design. My wild ass guess will be the 21 stays the current 21 design while the 25 evolves into the next Sebenza redesign such as the 30 or 32 or whatever number it may be.
 
kidcongo said:
The Sebenza 25 is a very different knife than the 21 and I don't think it targets the same use or market. The only way the 25 could really be considered an "evolution" of the 21, at least in my mind, is if it was offered in a "25 lightweight" model with the same thinner blade and thinner profile that makes the 21 such a pocket-friendly large EDC. I love the 25, but it is much more of a tank than the large 21, and I think folks buying large 21's are not looking for a thick and heavy knife.
Click to expand...

Owning a 25 and handling a few 21's, I just do not understand your thinking on this. The weight difference is minimal, (4.7 vs 5.2), blade width (1.25 vs 1.40)...same overall length, slab thickness. You make it sound like the 25 is a beast compared to the 21. The only difference is really blade thickness and I really doubt that anyone would notice a carry difference between the two.

I still think the 21 should stay in production...but to say that the 25 needs a lightweight version. Makes no sense to me.
 
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IMO, I think Mr. Chris is enevtably trying to get away from the bushing system. I talked to him briefly at Blade last year and he went on and on about how much time it takes to get the internals of the 21 perfectly matched so there's no blade play etc..I would HATE to see the 21 go, but maybe eventually it is the one?

My guess tho would be the Umnumzaan. It's basically the same knife as the 25, so why produce both? He even gave it the same pivot as the 25 and the tilock. Also, the jimping is the same as on the 21(I think it is). You can see a pattern where he's trying to stream line the production of his line up. The 21 is kinda the "odd man out" as far as sharing parts with the others.
 
Great thread with many good points being made… I think only CRK nuts ( like us) really understand all the finer points being brought up here… For even a fairly educated knife enthusiast any and all CRK's will cut and carry with ease, our preferences are more personal than CRK can probably consider as gospel. Although it does seem they do care what is said on this forum. Bart
 
It's good to see the 21 is still the top seller, so I'm thinking it will stay in production for now.

As far as the bushing system, I love it, but I could see myself having a 21 with a pivot system like the 25/Umnum. *
Heck I can adjust a pivot and apply Locktite.

*As long as the pivot diameter is substantial and isn't a skinny 1/8" like some "other" knives.
 
I think the 25 is here to stay for a very long time and will eventually replace the Umnum. I called a certain place of business recently and mistakenly was asked if I wanted to be placed on a list for the small 25s? I said "Yes" faster than a bat outta hell only to be told "Whoops that isn't ready quite yet. So it is safe to say that the 25 isn't going anywhere. I know it would be a huge loss and many would be devastated (including myself) but CRK could probably save a ton of money doing away with the Mnandi and moving that time and energy to other projects. They already cut some costs making it by implementing the new nail nick and pivot. Doesn't it take totally different machinery and basically an entirely different beast to make them, from the scales to the blades? I was once told by a gentleman that worked at CRK for almost 10 years that they actually lost money on Mammoth Bark Mnandis some years due to the cost of the bark and the time put into "cutting" it and preparing it. Plus, now there will be no more Mammoth Ivory or Mammoth Bark and those were two of the most popular Mnandi inlays. Definitely makes one think what direction the Mnandi is going to go in next?
What I do know is the 21 isn't going anywhere with as many Exclusives and options as they have for it. I'd say they would wipe the slate clean before getting rid of the 21, but once again just my opinion.
 
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