500 Duke Bolsters: When did they change to N.S. ?

[sitflyer]

Thanks to this post from Plumberdv in another thread:

I started to wonder when the 500 switched to Nickle Silver for the bolsters. I went through the BCCI archives up through the year 2002 after which it was dropped from the catalog, and the bolsters were listed as stainless steel. Buck still kept making the 500 for SFO's up till present and in the copied post I couldn't help but notice the NS bolsters in the description. Sooo I got out my newest 500, Which BTW has a new blade thanks to the great guys in the repair shop, and new scales of Elk from me...

and a magnet tells me that the bolsters are not steel. But with the original blade gone I became curious as to when the change to N.S. occured?

 

[Haebbie]

As I understand the standard 500 had a steel frame as long as they were offered
in the catalog. The model history on the BCCI site shows stainless steel for the 500
since it was discontiued in 2003. BUT the two birdie series from the late 90s and the
workmen series, whenever it was made, had a nickel silver frame. Ergo: Buck used both
materials for the frame at the same time.

Haebbie

 

[pinnah]

Dang Duane... That's just beautiful.

 

[sitflyer]

Thanks Haebbie, that is interesting. I went through the special projects list and the few that were listed were of SS...

 

[peterinct]

and a magnet tells me that the bolsters are not steel. But with the original blade gone I became curious as to when the change to N.S. occured?

Sit - Keep in mind that some "stainless steel" does not contain enough iron to be attracted by a magnet. Some 300 series stainless is not attracted by magnets.

Peter

 

[Plumberdv]

There are several articles in past BCCI newsletters about the Duke and the whole 500 series. I've been through every one and no where has the date they changed to NS been pinned down. Larry Oden mentioned that he has examples of each and that you can't tell using a magnet which is which and you really can't tell by looking.

 

[sitflyer]

Thank you Peter and Plumberdv. I just finished putting a magnet to my older ones and reached the same conclusion...the SS used does not attract a magnet.
I guess the only folks who would really know are the engravers who would see a difference in how their tools cut the metal.

 

[peterinct]

I guess the only folks who would really know are the engravers who would see a difference in how their tools cut the metal.

Interestingly, the name nickel/silver can be misleading as sometimes it is thought to contain silver, but it doesn't. The typical composition is 60% copper, 20% nickel and 20% zinc but those percentages seem to vary based on origin?

It becomes apparent immediately when incising the metal, and sometimes with guns especially, a sample cut is made in an inconspicuous place, such as under a grip, to determine how hard the material is to cut.

Also, on older items nickel silver has a duller look than 300 series steel when it tarnishes and it can have a sort of brass hue.

Peter

 

[st8yd]

That all depends on the magnet, the one I have even pulls the SS blade of a 110 thru the brass bolsters so I agree it's not really a good test.
However not long ago I picked an orange and cut it with my 501, which has nickel silver bolsters, and was unable to do anything more than wipe it off on my pants leg. Later that day I used it again and noticed a lot of tarnish on the bolsters, this won't happen to SS. Since it has worn itself back to normal from riding in my pocket. So in my opinion one could use a little oj to test it and it should polish back off simply.

To me though when holding the two side by side they seem to be a different color. I have also noticed that the pin on the NS seems to be more obvious than on the SS bolsters particularly so on the rear bolster, can't see'um on the SS.

 

[sitflyer]

Thanks st8yd, I have come to the conclusion that all of my Dukes are SS. I do have some 501's and 503's in NS, and they do look a little different, but they are older and have some pocket dings etc. clever idea on the acid test though:thumbup:

 

[David Martin]

In ' Blades Guide To Knives' by Steve Shackleford, on pg. 511 is the article on the 500 series and I'm not sure who wrote the articles (others are present) but therein it states. "Finally over time, Buck has switched the intergal stainless steel bolsters and liners to sintered (powdered metal) nickle-silver technology." DM

 

[David Martin]

Also, I don't know who writes the captions beside the photos for Buck's catalog but the 500 series did not come out until early 1975. DM

 

[Plumberdv]

In ' Blades Guide To Knives' by Steve Shackleford, on pg. 511 is the article on the 500 series and I'm not sure who wrote the articles (others are present) but therein it states. "Finally over time, Buck has switched the intergal stainless steel bolsters and liners to sintered (powdered metal) nickle-silver technology." DM

That's just about word for word what one article in the newsletter said. That's as close as I could find to a date of the change and that's not even close.

 

[Plumberdv]

Also, I don't know who writes the captions beside the photos for Buck's catalog but the 500 series did not come out until early 1975. DM

Good eye, David. I hadn't noticed the "Introduced in the 1960's" part intil you mentioned it.

 

[sitflyer]

Thanks David. going by Bucks catalogs the 500,501,503 and 505 were listed as SS up till and including 2002.
In 2003 the 500 went missing (Disco'd) and the 501,503,and 505 were listed as NS. It seems when the switch was made to NS the Duke was sent off to exile...

Also noted while perusing the catalogs was that 2000 and at least a few years prior the 500 series was listed as just that, all together...

2001 shows the 500 and 501 on seperate hunting pages, and the 503 and 505 in everyday...

2002 shows the 500 in hunting and the 501,503, and 505 in everyday.

Seems like they were trying to find a sweet spot for marketing the Duke towards the end there...

 

[David Martin]

Thanks gents. Thats a good point, with the Duke being discontinued and the others then went thru this frame steel change. Then by the time the Duke was brought back the change was old news so, it wasn't mentioned. I think 2003 is a good date to stick with. DM

 

[sitflyer]

There are several articles in past BCCI newsletters about the Duke and the whole 500 series. I've been through every one and no where has the date they changed to NS been pinned down. Larry Oden mentioned that he has examples of each and that you can't tell using a magnet which is which and you really can't tell by looking.

Thank you Plumberdv, and everyone else who replied. Seems this one has pretty much been answered...

Just opened this thread up due to new info from J Hubbard at Buck Knives posted in another thread:

FYI,
The side are made of 316 SS not nickel silver. This model did not transition to Nickel silver like the others did when we redesigned the line. The 501, 503 and 505 are nickel silver, the model 500 is 316. It looks like we are publishing the wrong specs. I have a call into the supplier to verify they are using stainless. Once I verify, I'll send a note to our marketing dept to correct future publications.


Jeff

This info was provided by Plumberdv in that same thread:

Thanks for clearing this up Jeff. That also explains why you can't tell by using a magnet. 316 is one of the "austenitic" stainless steels which are non-magnetic.

"Type 316
Contains 16% to 18% chromium and 11% to 14% nickel. It also has molybdenum added
to the nickel and chrome of the 304. The molybdenum is used to control pit type attack.
Type 316 is used in chemical processing, the pulp and paper industry, for food and
beverage processing and dispensing and in the more corrosive environments. The molybdenum
must be a minimum of 2%."

and Jeff answered thusly in another thread on 3/13/13 :

sorry, this slipped my mind. The blueprint calls for 316 stainless.

here's a link to that thread:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...-Duke-bolsters-frames?p=11963217#post11963217

seems to be the end of story on this question...

 

[David Martin]

I'm glad this information surfaced. DM