804 thread moved????

lt632ret

lt632ret

Joined
Jan 21, 2001
Messages
1,634
I do not know why the 804 question thread was moved but I suppose that is the right of the bosses or whoever. None the less the 804 in question was correct as I said. If you wish to compare that knife to other similar knives. A few days ago I posted in the thread The (New and Improved) old school Schrade thread on page 7 I posted pictures of 3 dozen bone handled schrades from the same era. The one in the first picture fifth from the left is the same pattern 804 and the jiggings of the others of the 3 dozen can be seen in the picture as well. I am also posting pics of a full box of these 804 patterns these however are in delrin the picture in black and white came from Schrade and was given to new employees ( in a set ) so that they knew what they were working on ( when they first went on the job. ). This is exactly how they looked and were handled when made in bone in Ellenville. This stamped shielding was not usually used on these in bone it was usually an unmarked shield. Still the knife looks correct. I could also dig out pictures from the Schrade collection and verify the jigging ect. If it is needed. I do not know what opinions will be offered in Mr Levines forum however the knife looks correct.. LT PS it should also be noted that while this model ( under a different model number was produced under Schrade Cut Co and then under Schrade Walden #804 in Walden until they moved to Ellenville. When they did move they in many cases did not use the exact same jigging patterns and indeed used several variations. which they had not used on the earlier versions. This sometimes confuses people who are not aware of this and consider the knives rehandled the fact is they are correct to the patterns from Ellenville. If the Schrade collection was available for reference this could be shown quite easily because all the types were on it. I know because I have examples like the ones in the pictures I have posted.
 
Perhaps I care about the forum here too much. I requested, before LT answered the post, that Cougar Allen move it to BRLevine's forum. Mr Allen agreed with me that it should be moved.

Certainly LT is authoritative and expert enough to answer any, that is any, Schrade question (and questions concerning many different aspects of knives). Many of us can answer questions-- and we are happy to--about dates and different little asides of Schrades, but do we want to become a battleground between eBay buyers and sellers? In any event, when a post is moved like that, the original stays here... where any of us can answer it, if we are capable of doing so. I felt no harm was done.

If I take my (self-appointed) duties as marguerita moderator too seriously, I apologize.

Phil
 
Actually, BL agreed with LT and the buyer has the genuine knife and a BLT sandwich!

Codger
 
Bada Bing...Bada Boom. No need to try the veal, as the BLT is most excellent. :thumbup: :thumbup:

Thanks for the pictures Rich.

Bill
 
The reason I answered it the way I did at first was so that it would be short and sweet. I felt that if the person was not happy then they could then do what they wanted and check with who they wanted. I just did not know what happened. Thats when I answered again it is no big deal mainly just my paranoia. It should be apparent that in my case I do not care who I get between as long as I can say what I believe and as long as they have the same right.

Your the boss TP hell I am just the Hoss ( as the old saying goes.) Thankyou for telling me what happened. Hey Micheal that was pretty clever dang son your catching a few good ones lately BLT sandwich. WELL ALRIGHT.

OK I am calling for a vote of confidence for a new moderator. Are you kidding like we could ever con someone else into this job. Seriously Phil I appreciate your taking the time to explain. Not many of these original blue box sixpacks still around. So perhapes someone enjoyed the pics. LT
 
Well, you know I appreciate them, even if I don't go on about it. Packaging is something I've keyed in on as a good indicator of an era of production. And maybe sometime we can see more of those flash cards. Dad used to have a set. Seems like he called one a Betty, one a zero. I don't remember them all.

Codger
 
Three thumbs up for the Marguerita Moderator :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
You do a good job Phil!
 
LT great pictures!
I missed the initial question.
TTYL
Larry
BLT I like it.
 
Thanks to all who looked at this 804.

All agree that its genuine, so I send an apology to the seller for expressing concerns.

As I told him, I have been studying 19th century S&W's for some time and those type of inconsistencies would have surely indicated a "reworked" Smith.

Guess I can't use my S&W eyes on Schrade knives.
 
Thankyou for letting us know your feelings. Please stop around whenever you can . Actually it was a good question that is often asked. Some people become quite adamant in thinking some of these pieces are reworked or fakes. It is simply that they do not understand. A similar problem often occurs when someone acquires a pattern and cannot find the exact variation in a catalogue. Often the piece is correct but what they do not realize is that many limited patterns were never published anywhere. Some styles were proto types. Your knife under various production dates. was Known as a Carpenters knife and had Fibestos ( fiber and asbestos a bad analogy would be a cross between gutta percha and a early attempt at a synthetic ) handles 81004 3/8 as well as bone and ebony . As an 804 itwas called a Mechanics Knife. This when they were made in bone, and delrin. There were even a few in pearl however many collectors do not believe it.

One rule of thumb to remember is that until very recently these knives were simply not worth enough to rehandle or rework. You paid 152 for your knife and for today that is a fair price ( actually a good price ). However 5 years ago the seller would have been hard pressed to get 50. Even in bone. Even though the book price even then was higher it was not what things were fetching. Now they are gold and unlike the zillions of regular delrin OTs and UH knives these were always rare and now are very rare. Remember Schrade cuts which are super collectable were made from 03 till the mid 40tys. Schrade Waldens from Walden were made for 10 years 46-56. However natural material Schrade Waldens from the Ellenville plant in natural materials were only made for a few years . Also they were made in limited amounts. Schrade resumed making natural handled knives in the mid 70 tys however by that time the Tang marking was changed to just Schrade. For all these reasons you I feel made a good collectable investment.

A few years ago if someone was going to rework a knife it would have been a Case or Napanoch or any number of high return collectable knives. If nothing else the first thing noticable about yours is that even if it had been reworked it would have been an older job ( with factory handles ) there would have been no reason for it. I must however say the marked shield is unusual for these ( in bone). However not unknown.

Once again please check out the pictures i posted a few days ago The (New and Improved) old school Schrade thread on page 7. This will give you an idea of the various styles and bone jiggings which were used. They are all examples of the jiggings and styles that were being done during this period.

Now that I have droned on boring everyone. Let talk about S&W knives let me tell you what I know about them er NOTHING which means I do not have to drone on. Enjoy your knife. If I or we can ever assist please call on us. LT
 
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