885UH Dating Serial Nos. and Packaging

black mamba

black mamba

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Although I'm a big Schrade-o-phile from the folders right through the fixed blades, the 885UH King Ranch four inch stockman is probably my favorite. I'm also big into trying to accurately date the older knives I own. This thread is the culmination of several hours of scouring Schrade catalogs and the internet, trying to pin down the dating of the 885UH.

The first time the 885UH shows up in the Schrade catalogs is in the 1970. While the type of box is NOT shown with the 885, the 897UH photo shows the hinged gift box. We know from posts here on BFC that serial number 08497 came in the hinged box, and the knives had the long cut swedge and milled/coined liners with Schrade Walden tang stamps. This is the highest serial number I've found still in the hinged box.

In the 1971 Schrade catalog, the hinged box is gone, and the gift box is now the two-piece brown box. I have SW 885UH serial number 30337, also with milled/coined liners, that has the two-piece brown box with white cardboard sleeve. I believe this one is most likely from mid to late 1971.

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The 1972 Schrade Walden catalog still shows the two-piece brown box. The next highest serial number I’ve found that is stamped Schrade Walden is 72324. This one was posted by thawk, and the only photo of it shows the milled liners. Codger_64 posted SW 885UH with serial number 90354, but no photo. This is the highest numbered Schrade Walden 885UH that I’ve found, and would have been made sometime in 1972.

We know that when the serial numbers reached 99,999, the next started at A0001, and when they reached A99,999, the next was B0001, and so on. I have 885UH serial numbered S1800, but without the box. It has the belt finished blades, short drawn swedge and smooth liners. I think this knife is from about 1978, but I'm far from certain. The last year that the catalogs show the two-piece brown box is 1984, but I don't know if they were still serial numbering the knives at that time.

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Let's see if we can add to this information. Anyone with an 885UH, please post the tang stamps, serial numbers if present, box if present, and any photos or additional info about when bought, etc. Also, does anyone have any production numbers from Schrade: how many were made, etc. Let's try to piece this thing together!
 
Well, now I'm confused. Another BF member just posted a Schrade NY USA stamped knife, not a Walden, with serial number 45224. It has the milled liners and the long cut swedge. Codger and thawk both have posted knives with serial numbers higher than this that they said were stamped Schrade over Walden, although there were no scans or photos with their posts. So maybe the serial numbers weren't even consecutive??? :confused:
 
black mamba said:
Well, now I'm confused. Another BF member just posted a Schrade NY USA stamped knife, not a Walden, with serial number 45224. It has the milled liners and the long cut swedge. Codger and thawk both have posted knives with serial numbers higher than this that they said were stamped Schrade over Walden, although there were no scans or photos with their posts. So maybe the serial numbers weren't even consecutive??? :confused:
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Serials were consecutive within each pattern.
 
Michael, if that's the case, then someone is mistaken. The knife just posted with serial number 45224 is an 885UH stamped SCHRADE over NY USA. Thawk and you both posted that your 885UH knives were stamped SCHRADE over WALDEN over NY USA over STAINLESS. He said his was serial number 72324 and you said yours was serial number 90354. All three knives are 885UHs, but the non-Walden knife had to be made after your two, which have higher serial numbers. Something isn't right, unless they started the serial numbers over from 00001 when they changed the stamp from Schrade Walden to just Schrade in late '72 or '73.
 
black mamba said:
Michael, if that's the case, then someone is mistaken. The knife just posted with serial number 45224 is an 885UH stamped SCHRADE over NY USA. Thawk and you both posted that your 885UH knives were stamped SCHRADE over WALDEN over NY USA over STAINLESS. He said his was serial number 72324 and you said yours was serial number 90354. All three knives are 885UHs, but the non-Walden knife had to be made after your two, which have higher serial numbers. Something isn't right, unless they started the serial numbers over from 00001 when they changed the stamp from Schrade Walden to just Schrade in late '72 or '73.
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The oldest looking 885UH I have is:
#6903 Tang SCHRADE over NY USA over 885UH very long pull. Two blades stamped stainless
long swag and pull, milled/coined liners. No Box.

#7887 Schrade+ over USA 885UH, no milled/coined liners. Red insert box.

#A8819 almost the same knife, no milled/coined liners.
Two blades stamped UH. Blue insert box.
 
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Thanks, kg, I'm beginning to think that whenever they changed the tang stamp they started the serial numbers over from 0001. I don't know how else to explain the fact that both Schrade+ with smooth liners and Schrade NY USA knives, that we know were made after the Schrade Waldens, have lower serial numbers than several documented Schrade Waldens. There are two documented knives from the SCHRADE NY USA era with coined/milled liners with serial numbers between 45xxx and 69xxx that had to have been made before your #7887 SCHRADE+ knife.
 
black mamba said:
Thanks, kg, I'm beginning to think that whenever they changed the tang stamp they started the serial numbers over from 0001. I don't know how else to explain the fact that both Schrade+ with smooth liners and Schrade NY USA knives, that we know were made after the Schrade Waldens, have lower serial numbers than several documented Schrade Waldens. There are two documented knives from the SCHRADE NY USA era with coined/milled liners with serial numbers between 45xxx and 69xxx that had to have been made before your #7887 SCHRADE+ knife.
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Do a survey here and elsewhere. Look at as many as you can find on eBay. The serials were for loss warranty control, not date of manufacture. Naturally I did not remember my post from 2007 and did not conduct a survey on this pattern. Go for it!
 
Thanks, Michael, that's what I've been doing, but not getting very far. I've only found nine that have both tang stamps and serial numbers. The biggest problem is that most of the ones on eBay, even if they have serial numbers, they aren't listed. Many people aren't even aware that some of them have serial numbers. But I will continue to pursue this.
 
Well, in the last two weeks I've had a chance to gather some more data, and here is what I've come up with, in chart form.

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Notice that some of the dates in the last column are in red, which denotes that they are known dates, from either original buyers or price stickers on the boxes. Anyone who owns any of the knives in the chart, that has additional info on the type of swedge or dates of purchase, please post it in this thread.

My conclusions:
(1) It seems obvious that the serial numbers start back over again with each new tang stamp. I never heard this before, but look at the serial numbers of the last Walden and first NY USA tang stamps, and again at the last NY USA and first SCHRADE+ stamps.
(2) During the entire Walden era, probably fewer than 100,000 885UHs were made, a time frame of roughly 2½ years. This averages out to about 40,000 per year. But it seems likely to me that they became more popular as time went on, so that by the time they were stamped NY USA in the mid '70s, they may have been making between 50 and 100 thousand per year.
(3) Not shown in the chart, but from other sources, I believe they went away from the brown 2-piece box in 1984. The later ones had foam inserts, while the earlier ones had felt/cardboard inserts with cut-outs. I believe the changeover happened in the late 1970s, but have nothing more specific than that.
(4) It's unfortunate that there are large gaps in the serial numbers we have, but possibly the change in swedge from long cut swedge to short drawn swedge occurred with the change to the SCHRADE+ tang stamp.
(5) Without any concrete production figures, I don't think we can make any further conclusions. It seems unlikely to me that they ever made much more than a few hundred thousand per year, so I doubt that the numbers ran from 99999 to A99999, then to B99999, and so forth. If this was true, then they made over 2 million 885UHs in only 7-8 years during the SCHRADE+ era. And remember, these were more expensive than the Old Timers, and so many fewer were sold.

Please add any pertinent info you might have, and make comments or suggestions on the numbers or my conclusions. Thank you!
 
This is my 885UH # 6903, it has the longest nail-pull I have ever seen on a 4" Schrade. Handle is almost Black and White.
The nail pull is 31 mm or 1.22047"
I have checked all my 4" Schrade knives.
However, Schrade made the first Buck 301s from 1966 to about 1970,
Camillus then made the Buck 301s for some years, until Buck made their 301s.

The Camillus 301s have the same long pull...???
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source
 
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JCup, did the knife come with a box? It should have left the factory with a hinged box.
 
black mamba said:
JCup, did the knife come with a box? It should have left the factory with a hinged box.
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No, they showed me a Schrade Walden dealer display case that had all the knives removed, which had been moved to one of their display counters. There were no boxes, but all the knives appeared to be NOS. It seemed they knew very little about knives, in general.
 
I just recently lost out on an auction for serial number #052xx (the lowest number I've seen anywhere) including the hinged box and all paperwork in like-new condition. I bid up to $100+, including shipping, and got outbid. 😩 I really wanted that knife, but didn't think it was worth more than that. There's always someone with more money than you!
 
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