A few practical questions

A

aarhud

Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Messages
3
Hey all,

I searched the forums, but did not find a quick and dirty answer for my application. I'm not so much a knife fanatic, but I do like to always have one on my person and they certainly are handy.

1) I'm looking for a affordable folding knife that I can open quickly with one hand and one that has a pocket clip. In the past I have carried Case knives, I love the sharpness and edge they have right out of the box. But I always feel guilty using them because they are so nice looking and I look at them as heirlooms. I like to keep a knife on me all the time, I cut a variety of stuff. From sharpening a stick for roasting marshmellows, to opening packages, to shaving PVC burs and cutting twine/rope. I also want something I can beat on and it will last. From browsing the forum, a few of the Kershaws seem like my best bet, is that what you guys would say? Care to mention a specific model?

2)Finally the hard question. I don't need a ridiculous sharp knife, nor a sharpening method that will preserve the knife for a decade. I just want a quick and easy way to get my knife back to a useful state. I tried to absorb all of the sharpening information, but frankly I just think its more than I want to get into. I'm looking for something to keep my knife usable, the same way I charge the batteries for my drill. And to add to that, I want a low maintenance blade, so does that mean to stay away from re curves?

Hopefully you guys can point me in the right direction!
 
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For 1, it sounds like you can't go wrong with any entry level Spyderco or Kershaw. They've all got good steel with great heat treats and will serve your purposes well. I'd look at the Delica, Endura, Native, or any of the Tenacious line for inexpensive Spyderco and the Cryo, Skyline, Injection, and Leek for inexpensive Kershaws. All of them have basic easy to sharpen blade shapes and steels.

For sharpening, you can't go wrong with the Spyderco Sharpmaker at $50ish, or if you want to go easier and more basic, just pick up a double sided pocket stone and freehand it. There's all varieties of stones for small amounts of money so take your pick.
 
For basic free-hand sharpening I would suggest a DMT diamond sharpening hone, either a coarse grit (blue plastic base) or a fine grit (red plastic base). Each can be purchased for around $15. They work great and maintain a flat sharpening surface after extensive use.

If I were only able to choose one sharpening hone it would be a coarse diamond hone. Such a hone can produce a hair-shaving edge and still be used to grind out chips or dents in a blades edge, though it can take awhile to do this depending on the severity of the damage.
 
Spyderco is a good place to start, they have a very wide range of work knives at a affordable price.

For basic maintenance a Spyderco ultra fine rod is all that is needed for touch ups, no need for water or oil, the UF is almost maintenance free. Get the rod and build a rig or free hand it, light gentle passes is all that is required for basic maintenance.
There's actually no need to stay away from recurves if you're going to free hand it using a rod.
 
Any good pocket knife with a clip over $40 will likely do. Even at that price point, there are far too many Brands and styles to focus on just one. What might be more important is to specify features - the things that make the knife easy to use. It sounds like you just need an everyday carry knife, but even that can be a bit broad in application. For starters, consider that it's main purpose is cutting. That means a flat ground blade, which doesn't come cheaply. Having a spear or drop point helps get under cord or packing straps. No wedge grind or side grooves keeps a slick low friction face on the blade, plus a Titanium oxide coating helps resist scratching to a high degree. How it opens is up to you - hole, stud, or disc all work. What is more important is the location and how it works with your thumb, not 15 other guys here on a forum. You have to go to a real brick and mortar store, pick them up, and try them out. Lots easier than a gun shop, too, real knife stores like you to handle them. That means Bigmart is off the list of places to get one.

Knife steel is important - 420 is common in lower priced knives, but something in the ATS34 or 154CM range gets you a superior steel worth the money that can still be resharpened as needed. Move up to a higher alloy, it gets difficult to dull, and difficult to sharpen, too. That's what high alloy steels are designed to do - be highly abrasion resistant, and that is what you do to sharpen it - use a fine grit stone to abrade it back into a cutting edge. Be careful what you ask for there.

The handle can be a variety of materials, but one piece G10 grips are the minimum I would suggest. FRN does work well - if it has liners. Most FRN knives over $40 are too pricey, the grips cost less than $2 to mold and have almost no further labor in them. The Griptillian isn't an exception to that, it's just marketed at that price and the consumer keeps shelling out for them. It does have a great shape - a good example of what to look for, no wild grinds, no excess slotting for grip, no weird extra features. Smooth and simple counts in a grip, sharp points or edges just raise blisters or even grind you and your jeans everytime you reach for it or whatever else might be in your pocket.

The lock is an area of much discussion. Frame locks are generally high cost, not likely to find one at the $40 level. That leaves liner locks as the main choice these days. Check that out carefully. A good liner lock is at least thick enough to cover over 50% of the blade thickness. The leaf needs to be as long a possible to minimize the angle it contact the blade. The material needs to be something different than the blade steel, so that the interaction is a bit sticky and they stay together, not polish each other. The angle of lockup should help prevent the blade pushing the lock out if it wobbles slightly. Expect blade wobble and some play against the frame stop pin as the knife gets older. Things wear, it can't be stopped. That's where some higher end knives have adjustments, or at least the liner keeps working into the lock further to take up the slack. The Axis lock does that, too.

The clip could be attached to either end. It really depends on what you like, and as you use it, you learn not to fumble it or get your thumb on the edge. Tip up, most knives have a decent detent action to prevent the blade opening up - which can open you up reaching into your pocket. Very few have, tho, we seem to know it's happening, and don't grab our knives at combat speed. Tip down, some don't like the slow opening or hand position. It doesn't mean they couldn't learn and gain enough skill to do it, they just don't want to, or make the excuse along the lines of it being a weapon that requires speed to deploy for devastating results. I'm sure FedEx packages require that. I suspect they aren't old enough to get a CCW and carry like an adult.

The more little screws holding the knife together, the more likely one will fall out. Don't go too far there. When you start looking for a knife, keep the features you want in mind and see where that might lead you. Far too many drink the Brand koolaid and buy a knife that perpetuates a lifestyle they would like to be associated with. In reality, a good knife will do, and even a cheap one is better than no knife.

Whatever, buy what you like - if you don't like it, you won't carry it. Once you get used to it - no knife is perfectly fitted to each and every single one of us - then you know what you might prefer, and it a few years, or months, or even weeks, you might try another you think better suited. Knives are like holsters - the precise fit and comfort using them creates an escalating list of required shapes and features. We all tend to acquire more than we can possibly carry, and I'm not blaming the makers. It's really all about us.
 
aarhud said:
Hey all,

I searched the forums, but did not find a quick and dirty answer for my application. I'm not so much a knife fanatic, but I do like to always have one on my person and they certainly are handy.

1) I'm looking for a affordable folding knife that I can open quickly with one hand and one that has a pocket clip. In the past I have carried Case knives, I love the sharpness and edge they have right out of the box. But I always feel guilty using them because they are so nice looking and I look at them as heirlooms. I like to keep a knife on me all the time, I cut a variety of stuff. From sharpening a stick for roasting marshmellows, to opening packages, to shaving PVC burs and cutting twine/rope. I also want something I can beat on and it will last. From browsing the forum, a few of the Kershaws seem like my best bet, is that what you guys would say? Care to mention a specific model?

2)Finally the hard question. I don't need a ridiculous sharp knife, nor a sharpening method that will preserve the knife for a decade. I just want a quick and easy way to get my knife back to a useful state. I tried to absorb all of the sharpening information, but frankly I just think its more than I want to get into. I'm looking for something to keep my knife usable, the same way I charge the batteries for my drill. And to add to that, I want a low maintenance blade, so does that mean to stay away from re curves?

Hopefully you guys can point me in the right direction!
Click to expand...

Have your Case knives been CV steel? If so, this explains the good results you've had with the edges since carbon sharpens up so nice.

I find the moderate grade stainless lives or dies by the quality of the heat treatment. If it is off and the steel too soft, then the stainless creates burrs when sharpening. On the other hand, more expensive stainlesses are so hard, you have to pay attention to how you sharpen them. Bottom line for me is that if you want an easy to sharpen stainless, you're looking for a mid grade stainless with good heat treatment and since heat treatment is done by the knife maker, you have to pick a brand known for doing a good job.

I don't know about how well Kershaw does but I do like Buck's 420HC and Opinel's treatment of 12C27. Opinel won't satisfy your carry requirements so perhaps something like a Buck Vantage or Buck Spitfire?

In terms of sharpening, I'm a moron and don't have the time to become great at it. So, I use a Lansky guided rod system ($25) to put a good edge on it and then use a DMT credit card diamond stone (less than $20) for quick fix ups. If a blade is hammered, I use the Lansky. Otherwise, a few stokes on the DMT is all that is needed.

Lastly and getting back to steel... Not many carbon steel modern folders. Can't think of any. If people konw of some, I would be interested to hear.
 
Hey all,

I bought a Kershaw 1555TI Cryo. Ended up being $28. At that price I will be annoyed if I lost it, but not bothered.

A sharpening stones purpose is to literally shave/grind the blade back to a fine edge right? And a hone is too remove any bends or imperfections to get back to a straight edge? So I guess I need both? I don't mind spending some time once a month keeping my knives in good order, some of the kitchen knives really need some help! There is a ton of bad information on the internet regarding sharpening, I'm just trying to find a easy to understand method.
 
No. You don't need a hone or steel for bends in your your knives. Especially kitchen knives. Straightening out with a steel was needed for old, thin, soft butchers knives. You don't have one of those. Nobody does. So that who schtick with the steel and the knife? It doesn't do anything with a modern knife except impress people who don't realize its not doing anything.
 
aarhud said:
Hey all,

I bought a Kershaw 1555TI Cryo. Ended up being $28. At that price I will be annoyed if I lost it, but not bothered.

A sharpening stones purpose is to literally shave/grind the blade back to a fine edge right? And a hone is too remove any bends or imperfections to get back to a straight edge? So I guess I need both? I don't mind spending some time once a month keeping my knives in good order, some of the kitchen knives really need some help! There is a ton of bad information on the internet regarding sharpening, I'm just trying to find a easy to understand method.
Click to expand...
A "hone" and a "sharpening stone" are the same thing. Depending on their level of abrasiveness, they can both be used to sharpen a blade or grind out imperfectings in the edge.
 
aarhud said:
Hey all,

I bought a Kershaw 1555TI Cryo. Ended up being $28. At that price I will be annoyed if I lost it, but not bothered.

A sharpening stones purpose is to literally shave/grind the blade back to a fine edge right? And a hone is too remove any bends or imperfections to get back to a straight edge? So I guess I need both? I don't mind spending some time once a month keeping my knives in good order, some of the kitchen knives really need some help! There is a ton of bad information on the internet regarding sharpening, I'm just trying to find a easy to understand method.
Click to expand...

Suggest you start a thread in the Maintenance sub forum for better, more focused advice on sharpening.

Here is my simplistic view.

Edges degrade from sharp in 3 primary ways. First, they wear down from abrasion and become rounded and blunt. Steels with large carbides are known for resisting this type of dulling. Second, the cutting edge can chip and fracture. Fine grained steels have a reputation for resisting this kind of dulling well. Third, the cutting edge can bend or even fold over. Harder steels resist this form of dulling well.

Honing sticks or rods, can correct this latter form of dulling but as others have noted, it mostly applies to blades with softer steels. I disagree with the assertion that this no longer applies. Many home kitchen knives use soft stainless and respond to steeling (for me).

Sharpening stones, honing stones and strops form a continuum of abrasives used for scrubbing off metal to create a new sharp V edge. Some cutting jobs (like cutting rope) seem to be handled best with a rough but pronounced V edge. In this scenario, course and medium stones do fine. Other cutting jobs (like wood working) seem to be handled best with a highly polished and smooth V edge. To get this sort of edge, one starts with a course stone and then uses progressively fine stones, finishing with a strop. Very fine stones are called "honing stones" and are used to polish the V edge, not to re-align it like a honing rod.

When a blade has gone dull from either abrasion or chipping, you must remove metal to form a new V. When you sharpen one side enough to do this, the metal will deform creating a burr (which is very much like a weak fold). Some metals like the mid grade stainless on your (and my) knives can form burrs during sharpening. Holding the stone at a consistent angle and controlling the pressure are usually key to removing the burr and polishing the edge (this is called honing).

I think pretty much anybody can get a V edge with a basic stone provided the steel is forgiving and they are willing to practice. Non-stainless carbon is very forgiving.

I tried and failed at freehand sharpening for years. It wasn't until I started using a Lansky system with a guided rod that I started to get a feel for steel while sharpening. It does require that you attach a guide to the blade and filddle with the guide rods. But, I've been able to get sharp and repeatably sharp edges much faster in the end. Takes less than inning in front of the TV while the Red Sox beat the Yankees. It takes longer if the Yankees win.

The Lansky (and other guided rod systems) work by removing many of the variables from the mix. That would be my recommendation as a place to start. Once I got a feel for creating and then honing away a burr, I could start to use other methods with a LOT more success.

The knife you got sounds perfect for the job. A Lansky basic will set you back less than $30 and if you stick with it at all, will teach you a lot while giving consistent, easy to achieve results.
 
My knife came in today, and was exactly what I was looking for. Small enough to carry around, but large enough to use. Feels sturdy and I won't mind putting it to use. I really like the thumb part that makes it easy to flick open (easier than the index finger place on the actual knife imo). The knife for sure does not have the sharp factory edge like a Case knife. It's not too bad though. I will pick up the Lansky basic and see what I can do with it. I appreciate that suggestion.

Thanks again for all the help and input. I'm a brand loyal type, between Kershaw and Case I think I will be set on pocket knives.
 
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