A gun safe question.

R

rookie4real

Joined
Aug 15, 2007
Messages
546
I have a problem: I'm a gun owner and I live in a rented apatment. If I lived in a house I would have gotten a large expensive safe and bolted it to a concrete floor. However the reality is that I don't have a concrete floor to bolt anything to and a large heavy safe would probably break the floor and fall to the neighbor that lives below me.
I was playing with the idea of buying a medium or small size safe that is not very heavy but I don't know how much protection would it provide in the event of a thieft. Also, I'm thinking it would have to be brought at night so nobody gets any ideas.
What would you do if you were me?
 
Probably not the idea you were looking for....But I did my best to hide them when in an apartment. It was only after moving into a home that I was able to buy the big heavy safe and bolt it to the basement floor. I suppose if you only have pistols the smaller Costco type safe would be better than nothing.
 
just cover it with a moving quilt on "refrigerator" hand truck and bring it in... put it in a corner to hinder tipping, and bolt it to the wall studs, cover with draped cloth....if it has external hinges you may be able to remove the door...
 
I went with the Stack-On cabinet. I wanted it on the 2nd floor of the house and deep in a walk-in closet. It's screwed to studs in 6 places and the floor in 4.
If someone REALLY wants to rip it out, they be able to, but it keeps the guns away from the kids and meets my insurance requirements.
 
Just don't buy any "home type" safe that is lined with concrete to store magazines, ammo or handguns! They're generally smaller home document type of safes that are touted as fire proof.

Concrete hydrates (or releases moisture as it cures) for up to 50 years in ideal conditions. And anything trapped inside a concrete and steel lined box could rust! It is a mini micro climate inside with emitting moisture.

Most of the reliable safe manufacturers will state if it is lined with concrete or it will say "not for guns."
 
If it's theives you are worried about, I would think that a better approach then a safe might be hiding your gun. Of course if you've got a pile of guns that might be a bit more difficult.
 
Just my thoughts/opinion
Perhaps you need to buy a home, with the price of rents these days you could possibly buy a house for about the same money you're paying for rent. Worth looking into, interest rates are low right now,and it's a buyers market. Well worth investigating your options. You can't lose when owning property.

One of those Stack-On types are better than nothing I guess, that being said they don't really provide that much security from theft/fire, but they will keep young kids out.

Good luck
 
How many guns and what type (i.e. handguns vs. long guns) are we talking?

Is your worry just child safety (and even if you don't have kids, you still have a moral responsibility to keep your guns safe from any children) and theft, or are you also worried about fire?

Theft protection is generally not so difficult. Most home robberies are "smash and grab" style operations. The intruder spends no more than a few minutes inside, does not bring much along the line of tools, and will not bother with any container which will take more than one minute to open or anything which can't be hand-carried.
 
How much and what type of protection do you need or want?

The home cabinet type are not much better then a tool box and are relatively easy to carry off. Do you really want to screw one of these into wall studs or the floor of an apartment? You can carry those off with a simple two wheeler or with a friend that will help you hand carry it loaded with the stuff (emply you can carry it by yourself).

Next you have the small gun light duty gun safes like Sentry and others in the $400 range on sale. Not the best locks but, better then a simple key lock. Heavy enough to resist an easy carry off or simple prying attacks. Light enough to not crush the floor or cause an apartment floor to sag if placed near an exterior wall. These will have simple fire protection but, not enough if the neighbhor sets their kitchen on fire or smokes in bed though.
 
If you're going to be there for awhile, I would get something as sturdy (read heavy) as you think your floor can handle and you can get up the stairs. The weight depends not only on size but the safe's construction (wall and door thickness). If you're living in a somewhat modern apartment and there is no significant termite or dry rot damage (you might not be able to tell though - about any damage), I would think the floor should be able to handle a three to four hundred fifty pound safe fairly easily (imagine you and a couple of friends standing in the same spot on the floor). Since we're not talking high end very heavy safes, Costco and similar stores often have decent deals on gun safes. I bought a Cannon 24 gun, 30 minute fire rating safe from Costco. They make a whole line of safes, from light weight to bomb proof. Some question Cannon's commitment to the customer but I'm happy so far. It weighs about 450 pounds and my son and I got it up one flight of stairs using an old rusty commercial dolly and a lot of elbow grease. A few friends would make the job pretty easy. It is lag screwed to the floor joists. It's fairly light for its size because the sheet metal used for its construction is probably 14, possibly 12 gauge. So a maniac with an axe (or a reciprocating saw could get through it with some time and noise. A nice higher end (and much heavier) safe would probably have 1/8" to 1/4" plate. Mine has a good lock and bolt mechanism and a sturdy door and internal hinges.

A good cabinet that is well secured to the floor and walls would be a lot better than nothing. You'd want a decent lock that can't be knocked off in 30 seconds with a hammer or cut off with bolt cutters. I'd go ahead and bolt it to the floor and possibly walls if you can find the joists and studs. Holes are easy to patch when you move and it will definitely afford you more peace of mind. An acquaintance of mine had two 750 pound safes (and a lot of valuable guns) carted right out of his house because they were not bolted down. It is more time consuming and a lot noisier to cut a safe loose from the floor and or walls. Depending on how much was going in the safe, maybe a smaller, heavier walled safe would work. But then again, I've always heard "buy bigger than you need now because you will fill it up". Sorry for all the verbiage and good luck.
 
An alternate idea might be to hide the guns (you don't specify what type or how many) from easy detection.
I have seen some very clever false wall concealments in the back of a kitchen cupboard, a compartment built into the base of an armchair, conduits in roof spaces that hold long arms but look like regular plumbing fittings, under floorboard spaces, even a dummy toilet tank.

The only absolute condition about this method is that only you may know the method of concealment, and that nobody, particularly a child, has unsupervised access to your apartment.
 
Good Pelican case attached to a wall bolt with a heavy chain and lock. Basically I look to try to deter theft as best as I can, keep the firearms away from children. This is accomplished thorough multiple single key locks on good gun cases, or combo locks on good gun cases. Cases could be chained to a wall stud by means of some easily obtained hardware store materials. Then get renters insurance, and a good catalogue of what you own, including serial numbers, type, and appraised cost of what you have. Remember that some arms will appreciate in value over time for whatever reason.
 
You could try the best of both worlds; a safe AND hide them:

http://www.bedgunsafe.com/

If I didn't already have a safe, I'd seriously consider one of these. A bit pricey; but it provides fire protection, lockability, and concealment.
 
I don't have all that much to add except to say a gun "safe" even just one of those steel gun lockers from WalMart, screwed into studs inside a closet, is still really hard to get out. The close confines of the closet make it difficult to reach and locate and cut or lever out the screws and the fact that it is inside the closet makes it difficult to get enough leverage to pry open the door.

Yes, it can be done, but it is hard and crooks don't like hard. Sure, they can rip off the closet door and tear down the wall, but that takes time and makes noise. Given the limitations of your circumstances, it will keep out smash and grabbers and safeguard any children from getting to the guns.

I would also make sure to ask your insurance agent about gun insurance. My basic homeowners policy only covers $2,000.00 worth of guns. Not a problem for me but could be for you. I don't even know if renter's insurance has that kind of coverage.
 
A good insurance policy is just as if not even more important than a safe in my opinion. It's a lot cheaper than you might think if you get it from these guys:
http://www.collectinsure.com/ The peace of mind from an insurance policy is worth every penny. These guys have been around for many years.

Any safe, no matter how light, is better than no safe, as long as it is bolted down to the walls and/or floor, preferably both. Keep it out of sight in your house or apartment, especially from nosy neighbors and when you bring it to your house make sure it is covered up so folks think its a refrigerator or appliance.
 
You were thinking correctly.

Buy a 200 to 400 pound safe and put it in your closet.

Bolt it to studs in the wall if you like.

Most thieves will not bother.

If they can cart the safe out the door, I hope you are not home when they come...

Later, you can add a larger safe, but don't go over 600 pounds. Regular moving companies won't move safes much over 500 pounds without a special fee.

The smaller safe will still be useful.

Better two medium-size safes than one large one for transportation purposes.

Also, get an electric dehumidifier like a goldenrod to protect from rust.

M.
 
Last edited:
If you bolt the wall, you will probably leave some nasty scars and end up loosing some damage deposit.

At my last rental, I bolted a safe to the floor through the carpet. When I moved out, I just fluffed the carpet a bit and the holes disappeared.
 
I have a winchester steel box with the electronic safe mounted to my bed frame for my night gun. It works fine and would take about a half hour to remove it via prying. *shrug* I have a floor model in the closet but the other works just fine. If a thief wants your guns and has enough time he will get them unless he is very dumb.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top