A little questiom from a new guy

N

nedocervar

Banned
Joined
Nov 13, 2003
Messages
64
Normally I use my knife to slice food. In good restaurant too, I am in habit to draw out my EDC (a good italian style handmade knife, 440c good hardened blade, 4" long) to cut in the suited style a fantastic steak. By this time, it's an embarassed situation no more (for my friend and me at least...).
It will be a pure insult have in use a "kaiman" with plastic handle and serrated edge to enjoy italian cooking.
On the other hands, I like my knife scary sharp always. But as soon as the blade come in conctact with ceramic plate, it tends to get dull afterwards!
Someone can suggest me a better blade, maybe a new CPM, that is able to maintain a crisp razor edge after my fantastic dinners? I am too lazy to soak my waterstone everytime, and sharpmaker (fantastc product like many other jigs) is almost like the "kaiman" for my sharpening taste.
Please, don't answer with joke like: "use a cardboard plate" and so on.
Thanks in advance.
-Nedo Cervar
 
Ceramic is harder than steel. Serrations work because only the points of the serrations get dulled, but who wants to sharpen all those serrations? Use a wharncliffe or sheepsfoot. Only the point will be dulled and it's easy to sharpen. :cool:
 
If you really need a sharp knife to cut a steak, that restaurant you are in can not be that good.

Honestly, you shouldn't need a good knife to cut a well prepared steak. I think my father would be rather insulted if I would pull out a sharp knife to cut his steak....but I degress: Murray Carter suggests on his DVD to buy a steak knife that is serrated and made from the cheapest steel available. This way the serrations will bend when they come in contact with the plate and act more like a saw than serrations.
 
Dear Hob, you are a barbarous (I joke naturally :p ).
The use of a saw to slice a well prepared steak is like drink champagne in a plastic glass.
When cook the best portion of a meal, a friend of mine is use to use only his Loveless "Skandic Semi-Skinner".
It is a question of taste and respect for food (remember, I'm italian:D ).
I am sure that your father would be proud to see so high bon ton.
Cougar, wharncliff is a great shape for potato peelers and so on. Nevertheless your advice is precious;) . Thanks.
-Nedo Cervar
 
Welcome to the party. It's always good to get new folks in the forums or things start getting dull.

One of the two reasons that steak knives have serrated edges is because they don't dull too quickly and they don't mess up the ceramic too much. The other is that they cut fiberous material like steak very well. Some of you guys must have eaten some awfully wimpy cattle. My steaks have lot of chewability and taste. Now if we are talking Butterballs that's a different topic.

Here are some good Spyderco knives I have used in the kitchen. They are very sharp and really hold a great edge. I have some Victorinox kitchen knives that are also excellent.

http://spyderco.com/catalog/details.php?product=65

http://spyderco.com/catalog/details.php?product=150

http://www.victorinox.ch/newsite/en/produkte/index.htm
 
It's not that we really need to use our pocketknives to cut steak, it's just that it's always a pleasure to use a fine knife. Don't even try to reason with us -- we are knife knuts! We are not reasonable people! :D

If you don't like wharncliffes no amount of reasoning is going to convince you to use one -- but try searching the Gallery forum here. You might find some wharncliffes that are not potato peelers.

Some of us use American tantos, though I personally hate them.

A narrow triangle profile with little or no belly works fine. Anything pointy, really.
 
nedocervar said:
Normally I use my knife to slice food. In good restaurant too, I am in habit to draw out my EDC (a good italian style handmade knife, 440c good hardened blade, 4" long) to cut in the suited style a fantastic steak. By this time, it's an embarassed situation no more (for my friend and me at least...).
It will be a pure insult have in use a "kaiman" with plastic handle and serrated edge to enjoy italian cooking.
On the other hands, I like my knife scary sharp always. But as soon as the blade come in conctact with ceramic plate, it tends to get dull afterwards!
Someone can suggest me a better blade, maybe a new CPM, that is able to maintain a crisp razor edge after my fantastic dinners? I am too lazy to soak my waterstone everytime, and sharpmaker (fantastc product like many other jigs) is almost like the "kaiman" for my sharpening taste.
Please, don't answer with joke like: "use a cardboard plate" and so on.
Thanks in advance.
-Nedo Cervar
Click to expand...
I can relate to this since lately ive been in search of a good " eating knife'
I found Boker arbolito series has a knife and fork set with stag handles.
then also I found one of their arbolito hunter series with stag handles
quite fine and decent for an elegant dining scene or your Mountain man I,like em raw and bloody by the fire scene plus it doubles as your light
all around knife. Its in 440-C steel though. Gee this led me to buy new
kitchen knives and a set of Dmt steels then finaly with all the forged
and superstainless lingo ended up buying a sog field in s30v which
i think gives me the most for the money. I saw some stag handled Pumas
but from what ive read here the may be over priced and quality wise
doubtfull. so theres my cent and a half
 
I believe Boker makes a ceramic paring knife. It should not dull so easily on the plate. They also make a ceramic blade folder.
Bill
 
Many thanks to everybody. I am so happy to have a conversation with you. Only apologize my poor english. It will be better if I continue to write in this marvelous Forum.
DGG, I can't immagine to saw the fibers of a good steak. The taste was suffering the consequences of this action. Really. It is like you cut a good prosciutto in wrong direction. We understand that for average restaurant is much more confortable to use serrated edge for obvious reason, but in their kitchen serrated knives are used only to cut bread.
Certainly Spyderco and Victorinox (expecially) are excellent. But, once again Victorinox usually use 440A steels.
Cougar, you take the right view, IMHO, when you say that not all wharncliffe are good only for potato peelers. But come in my mind that Centofante models are not perfect stright edge.
Bill DeShivs, ceramic knives can not be razor sharp because they are too brittle. When I reprofile them with SiC I can't go under a too obtuse primary grind. Much better steel than ceramic. Normally my relieves are 10° compreensive...
Garageboy , I am using to use fork for other tasks. Immagine the elegance and the pleasure to slice steak with a butter knife :o . Nevertheless a good steak is not necessairly flabby like butter.
Tarantado, are you sure that Boker Arbolito knives and forks with stag handles are 440C? I read in Boker catalog ("Der Katalog Zum Lesen und Bestellen" page 37) their steel are 440A. Please, Take me informed about the succes of S30V. I own many knives with this steel. In this moment only D-2 behave properly a little more, if heated over 60 RC, in my limited experience of course
Cheers!
-Nedo Cervar
 
Nedo, americans like their steak VERY tender even if they have to add tenderizers to it .It's been some time but the steak I had in Italy was a bit different.Most americans don't know that the Chianina beef was developed by the etruscans 2 or 3 thousand years ago and they think beef is something new !! But to save the blade it's a matter of technique ,just ease up on the force when you get almost through the steak. I use a Sebenza .
 
:D
Hi mete.
I realized now! I was very worried. What kind of new technology forks have made up the Americans to slice a fantastic Fiorentina (=Chianina) with its long hard bone where is attached the best flesh? Damn...I am not well informed I say to myself. Is it possible? Two nights without sleep owing to this dilemma.
Finally! Thank you for illumination.
Mete, give me another answer, just because I don't stay so ignorant: with steak, medium Americans are used to drink Coke instead good red wine?
Joking aside, the Sebby is a great knife, it is equal to this task and easy to clean and resharpen after the work aroung 1 Kg of good Fiorentina. Your method is interesting and entail a very good control.
Complimenti
-Nedo Cervar
 
im with mete on this light cutting stroke
while it may seem funny take the first cut of steak and use it like a cutting board under the rest of the steak your blade will only be on the plate once works for me then when i get to the truck i open the glove box get my handy DMT folding 1200 grit and make a few light passes and call it a day
ooo and yes i use the restroom to wash my knife up right after my meal
 
I happen to like my steaks tender enough to cut with a simple table knife- no steak knife needed. I'll be hung for this, but I seldom grill steaks. I prefer cooking them in a small amount of liquid, then searing them quickly for the final flavoring. Comes out butter-soft, but also with a great flavor.
 
Sword and Shield said:
I happen to like my steaks tender enough to cut with a simple table knife- no steak knife needed. I'll be hung for this, but I seldom grill steaks. I prefer cooking them in a small amount of liquid, then searing them quickly for the final flavoring. Comes out butter-soft, but also with a great flavor.
Click to expand...

You should try beer steak on the grill. Mix some beer and butter and baste the steak as it is cooking. Add a little A-1 sauce to the mix if you like that taste. I usually get lazy and stop basting and just pour it on and mush it around on the meat. Keep the meat turning so it doesn't burn and don't overcook. Some good corn-on-the-cob, potatoes or potatoe salad, and the rest of the beer and I'm set for the rest of the day!

If you get tired of steak there is always beer chicken but you need to use the oven for that. So many good ways to cook food and so little time.

I'm not a big fan of steak that cuts like hotdogs. I want something there to hold all the good juice and flavor and give the old chompers something to work on and the taste buds something to remember.
 
Excuse me friends.
Maybe we wander from the subject a little.
My best "recipe", suggest by the gentleman connoisseur Cliff Stamp is: make the primary edge very acute, say 5 - 10 degrees per side, with a microbevel at about 20 degrees per side. The ceramic conctacts will flatten the edge, but the microbevel will reduce their impact and use a smooth steel can restore the edge efficiently.
Have any of you best alternatives?
Thanks in advance
- Nedo Cervar
 
I Simply lay the blade over a few degrees and slice the steak. The edge contacts the plate at an angle similar but steaper than when sharpening. The wife says that she can always tell how much I enjoy the steak by how fine I Slice it. Very fine, delitious. thick, yuck!!!
 
You slice the steak and in the same time you bend back and put a fresh microbevel? Fantastic! I deduce you use "alternate slices"! :D
I check it immediately.
 
What I sometimes do is use the fork to lift the steak slightly off the plate, then cut with the knife blade nearly parallel to the plate. This way the edge never contacts the plate.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top