A note about my warranty

Fiddleback

Fiddleback

Knifemaker
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Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Oct 19, 2005
Messages
19,760
My warranty contains a satisfaction guarantee. This is intended to make purchasing a Fiddleback Forge knife a risk free venture. If you get the knife, and aren't happy with it, return it and you get a new one or a refund. Your choice. This covers the edge, the handle shape, the handle material, the craftsmanship, basically any reason you may think the knife is just not good enough, or not as nice as it looked in the pictures.

Lately, I have been getting a good bit of what I call Buyers Remorse refund requests. I've had 6 of these in the last month, and two this week. It is not the intention of my warranty to cover buyers remorse. Additionally, my warranty does not guarantee that you have sufficient funds to afford to buy knives at this time and I do not promise in the warranty to buy back knives when folks hit hard times.

I am a gear addict, same as y'all. I have done it too. Spent, regretted spending, and been lean for a while to recover from it. I try to help folks that are re-selling my knives by allowing them to sell in the forum, or link to a sale thread in the exchange. But I don't have some pile of money waiting to be sent out to folks that want to exchange their knives for cash.

I don't want to have to re-write the warranty, because I don't want it to look like some legalese fine print situation. Please use the warranty if you need it. But please don't abuse it, or it will have to be re-worded more and more carefully.
 
Well said Andy. Any one asking for a refund because they're on hard times and their eyes are bigger than their wallet is ridiculous. I buy when I shouldn't continuously but can only blame myself. Btw, what knives did they want to sell back? Maybe ill take one.
 
I just rotate the knives back into batches on Fridays. Thats not the problem. Its the cash on hand for supplies, etc that is hurt by this issue.
 
This is really too bad. I hope that everyone can pull it together and be responsible so that Andy doesn’t have to change his warranty policy, which is beyond excellent the way it is IMO.

It’s sad to me that I seem to see stuff like this almost every day: someone tries to do something nice for other people (in this case it is Fiddleback being trustworthy and bending over backwards to make sure people are content with the product they buy from their company) and soon enough a few “bad apples” show up to spoil the barrel, resulting in the original party realizing the need to protect themselves and their interests.

All it takes is a little personal responsibility to keep this from happening. To use a story from my own recent past as an example: a few weeks ago I said “I’ll take it” to a stabilized, dyed maple Kephart from Fiddleback. At the time, I was very busy and only really looked at the pictures in the sale thread–I did not read the accompanying text and descriptions. The picture of the knife I bought, as viewed on the computer I was using, appeared black. In a statement directly beneath the picture Andy said that it was purple. I did not realize that the knife was purple until several days later.

So, the point is that I likely would not have bought the knife originally if I had realized it was purple. That being said it is entirely my mistake so it would be unfair to do anything other than pay for the knife and graciously accept it. At this point I will wait to receive the knife and then judge what I want to do, but I expect to sell it and I expect to lose some money. That could have been prevented by me taking an extra minute to think and plan before I said “I’ll take it” and I think that this same simple principal applies to all transactions we have on this forum: if you say “I’ll take it” that is a verbal contract. Do not enter into a ANY type of contract unless you are sure you understand the conditions. It’s that simple really...Fiddleback should NOT be being forced to suck up the shortsightedness and poor planning of others, nor should they be penalized for attempting to be accommodating by offering such a rock solid warranty. That is my opinion of it at least.

As Andy himself has implied this effects us all, if only indirectly. Fiddleback is a small company and most small businesses ride a very thin line between making a profit and simply having enough to keep operations flowing. If we, as consumers, create false expectations for the company and then rescind our offer that puts Fiddleback in an extremely compromised position because they rely on that income to turn around and buy more materials and keep the whole show going. If they’ve already budgeted for funds that we are now declining to payout to them that could seriously mess with operations for a time. I for one want to see the show go on, and I think that Fiddleback’s outstanding warranty is too good to lose. If all it takes is each of us being personally responsible for our purchases then, in my opinion at least, that’s not such a hard thing to do and we would be well served to try out best to comply.


Peace all,

Sean
 
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Andy, I am really sorry to hear this.

I own knives from makers like Alan Wood (Ray Mears/Alan Wood UK), Roger Harrington (Bison Bushcraft UK), Iz Turley, Rod Garcia (Skookum Bush Tool), and Robert Carpenter (Battle Creek Knives) who are well sought after knife makers not to mention knives from Busse, Fallkniven, BRKT, BK&T, ESEE, Cold Steel, Benchmade, TOPS, Blind Horse Knives, Buck, Spyderco, and the ubiquitous Mora's. Owning all of these knives along with a large collection of yours Andy gives me a unique perspective in being able to judge the quality of the product you provide.

You are a stand-up guy who without question produces a very high quality handmade product consistently. I have not found fault with any of your knives I own. I certainly yield and acknowledge mistakes can happen. So do you and if it happens I understand you try very hard to make it right. I can't say it any plainer than that.

You take care Andy.

Sincerely,
Mark
 
Well, the warranty is there because nobody is perfect, and I do make mistakes. Also, my picture taking skills stink so bad that I worry that folks might be underwhelmed when they get their knife.

Last thursday I mistakenly mixed up two kepharts and sent them to the wrong customers. It happens. I do make mistakes. I can't be unable to handle real warranty situations like the one above because of the ones that are just buyers remorse. It weakens the whole thing.
 
Wow!!! First off, Andy your work is amazing and there is no reason you should have to be inconvenienced by a customers lack of maturity. If buying a knife for $200-300 puts someone in a tight spot then guess what?!? YOU CAN'T AFFORD IT!!! I think you may need to change the rules of Fiddleback Fridays as opposed to your warranty. The warranty you described above is outstanding and you are going way above and beyond with it. I am a man of principle. If I chose to purchase a anything and get a warranty like this one the last thing I would ever think about doing is disrespecting the maker by attempting to return the product with a cowardly excuse like "I don't have the money." I am new to the forum but it took me maybe 1 second to figure out Andy posts new blades for sale every Friday. A reasonable person would save enough money and put it to the side. Then when he/she finds the available knife they want they kindly and promptly send the money and get the knife. That sounds simple right? At least it does to me. If I am being harsh or hurting feelings with this post then oh well. Grow a pair and get 2 full time jobs. Think of the stress it puts on the maker and his family. Just because he has the God given talent to make kick ass, usable, knives and actually sell them doesn't mean his family has to suffer due to the customers lack of "adult responsibility". Then there is the subject of legitimate customer/collectors getting screwed out of the knife they wanted and could actually pay for. I personally work hard for a certain lifestyle and I do it without complaining, but when I see that Andy has to make a post like this it kinda rubs me the wrong way. If we, the customer, support the business with equal integrity and honor then we all profit from the transaction. Andy keep up the good work and I'm sorry you have to deal with this kind of issue.
Semper FI!
 
Pveiled, Well said!


p.s. I hope you like the EDKarda from last week. Just know the one I get will be far sexier than yours. Lol
 
MedicWrightDR said:
...Think of the stress it puts on the maker and his family...
Click to expand...

This is the crux of the issue, for me. We are not buying knives from behind a glass case at a Wal Mart. This is a handmade knife that is made in a small shop by the owner of the company. He has very little assistance, and the assistance he does have seems to also be invested in the company to a degree (meaning they stand to lose from the companies losses). If we don't honour our commitments people at Fiddleback Forge might have to think twice about what groceries or other supplies they can afford that week. That is why we should all be thinking twice before making commitments to this company. They deserve your patronage, don't get me wrong, but we really can't expect them to suck up losses the same way a larger company might. Every week is make or break when you're running a small business. If we beleive that Fiddleback is doing something worth support then show that support by being responsible about your own purchasing.

Sorry to pontificate so strongly on something that really doesn't require my attention but, like MedicWrightDR, reading that Fiddleback is having problems that could be completely circumvented if people were taking personal responsibility sort of rubs me the wrong way. This is one of the fundamental problems with our society...if we were all a little more honest with ourselves and really took responsibility for our actions a huge precentage of the "problems" our society faces would be substansially reduced, IMO.
 
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I think your warranty is above anything we could hope for.
2 of your patterns are on my short list of "must haves" BUT, I'm not there yet as a bunch of other stuff has caught my eye and I don't spend family money on my addiction...

IF I sold my buyers remorse box...I'd be flush but I keep thinking it's not really remorse more like Blade-ADD.

Carry on,
Pete
 
I've got it, a beautiful fix! What if you start a sticky of "Public Shame"? You could list anyone not paying for their blade and the ones who have buyers remorse. The publicity would stop the issue real quick.


Ok, just kidding......kinda. ;)
 
I'd rather bend my warranty and get taken advantage of than shame a customer over a knife. I know you were joking Schmittie, but I wanted to make sure this thread didn't turn into some kinda witch hunt.
 
I am one of the people involved with the Kephart mix-up that Andy described. There were actually 2 knives I ordered and there was a problem with both, one was the wrong knife and one was missing a sheath that was supposed to come with it. I had the option to return both and request a refund but the reality of the situation was that I was just disappointed to wait to get the new knives and not get what I really wanted. Instead of returning the knives I talked with Andy and we worked out a compromise that I believe we are both satisfied with and that Andy kept 2 knives sold. A huge factor in the compromise was Andy stepping forward to take responsibility and willing to work with me on something that worked out for both of us. There are many companies out there that charge a 20% restocking fee if you get the knife and decide you do not like it. One company sent me a $250 knife that had a defect in the finish that was easily noticeable. Not only did I have to pay the return postage from my own pocket they also kept the postage that they spent to send me the knife. I can understand this on on return because I did not like the knife but this was a high end knife with a defect. Needless to say they will not get anymore of my business.

I have been extremely impressed with Andy's ethics and how he stands behind his product. His actions will gurantee I will buy more of his knives in the future. My only suggestion on his warranty is that if the buyer decides he does not like the knife and wants to return it that return postage should be the buyers responsibility along with the cost for the postage to ship the knife originally. A warranty should protect a buyer from a defective or sub standard product, not protect them just because they changed their mind, did not fully read the item description, or did not have the funds in the first place to be able to afford the knife. Maybe if people realize they have to spend a little of their own money if they decide to return a knife they will think twice. The way it is now they really do not have anything to loose by ordering a kinife and then returning it.

The most inportant thing to realize is that Andy is a skilled craftsman and the more time he takes handling returns and paperwork the less time he has to make knives. A secondary isue is when people order these knives and have buyers remorse they took away the opportunity from some other buyer who may have really wanted the knife but just saw it too late on the listing.
 
Fiddleback said:
I'd rather bend my warranty and get taken advantage of than shame a customer over a knife. I know you were joking Schmittie, but I wanted to make sure this thread didn't turn into some kinda witch hunt.
Click to expand...


Oh good. You never know how things are taken. Just trying to add a shot of humor. Hope it wasn't too inappropriate. Apologies if it was taken otherwise.
 
Fiddleback said:
Well, the warranty is there because nobody is perfect, and I do make mistakes. Also, my picture taking skills stink so bad that I worry that folks might be underwhelmed when they get their knife.

Last thursday I mistakenly mixed up two kepharts and sent them to the wrong customers. It happens. I do make mistakes. I can't be unable to handle real warranty situations like the one above because of the ones that are just buyers remorse. It weakens the whole thing.
Click to expand...


It is a tough situation for you. I imagine you want people feeling good about having bought a knife from you, so you offer the your satisfaction guarantee. On the flip side, that makes it easy for people to buy the knife more whimsically thinking they can return it within a month for whatever reason or if something happens to come up in that month putting them in a financial bind, they see a recent purchase as some quick cash back.

People may not know what kind of situation it puts you in and they read this and make a more thought out decision before purchasing a knife. Or you could make your knives less tempting to buy. :p

I think it is really great to be able to buy directly from the maker. I hope that can continue with putting you in too much of a bind or hassle and giving you plenty of time to churn out some great knives.
 
Andy is an artist and a craftsman. He has been fortunate enough have been able to expand and take on some help to make his business move towards success. He puts forth a damned quality product and stands by his work absolutely. I know this firsthand.

I want Andy and company to make money. I want Andy and company to provide for their families as knife makers. I want Andy and company to NOT operate on a tight red line, but rather make a good solid living. I support all of these desires through my happy purchases. "I'll take it." or "Dibs" are contracts with Andy and his company in my mind. The knives are gorgeous each week and it is VERY tempting, but in effort to help Andy and company move to the larger success they deserve and will have (believe it Fiddleback, it is coming!), I feel it is vital to respect these words. This forum is already a testament to these things that I say and the others here that are in agreement help solidify Andy's mission.

Here's to Fiddleback Forge's success! Let's all help make that happen.

ps. and telling a friend or two doesn't hurt either. i "whip it out" every chance I get to pimp the FB goods. (sorry for the saucy language, but tis my moniker)
 
Very frustrating, and hopefully this kind of behavior will sort its self out.

Really, it is a sign of strong laziness. They would rather put you out, and take advantage of you, than just sell it them selves. Sure, it might take them a few days, and the effort of taking it to the post, but that is the adult thing to do.

I kind of feel like it is a generation of entitled people, who feel they are deserving of a life with no problems, or efforts.
 
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