A question for all English Busse fans

[Tree Herder V]

Hallo Gentelmen!
On friday I'll be going to UK for short (lasting only a week) vacation and to visit my friends. I'll paln to do some sightseeing. I wonder if I can take a knife with me. As fa as I'm concerned there is very strict law in UK regarding defensive weapons, that forbids carring knives. As I do not want to loose any of my beloved Game Wardens - that I normally EDC, I was thinking of taking Benchmade Snoody Activator (it's a fixed blade with blade length around 2" - less than 3"). Can I carry such small knife or is it better to leave all blades home?
Also which UK made survival equipment (all except knives) do you find interesting and worth buying ?
Thanks!

 

[mike biz]

Try hiding the GW in one of Michael Vick's custom hide-away water bottles. That should get you through security no problem.

 

[James Way]

For a knife to be carry-legal, it must be both under 3" in blade length and not lock- e.g. Spyderco UKPK, most SAKs, etc. However, even these cannot be carried into some areas e.g. schools. Basically under the eyes of the law locking blade = fixed.

The only exemptions are if it is part of religious dress or national costume, or if you have a good reason for it. The validity of a good reason is kinda up to the copper/magistrates. Sadly SD is not a defence-

": Is "self defence" a good reason?
A: Absolutely not! If you are carrying a knife for self defence, by definition you are carrying the knife as a weapon. Not only are you guilty of carrying a bladed article, contrary to s139 of the 1988 Criminal Justice Act, but you are also guilty of the more serious offence of carrying an offensive weapon."

Taking them into the country should no problem- obviously as long as it is in your luggage and not carry-on. As far as illegal knives, IIRC push daggers, cane swords, butterfly knives and automatic knives are all verboten, as well as some others which I can't remember.

The best place for carry advice is the BritishBlades law forum, but I hope I've been of some help.

 

[Guyon]

Take a folding (not locking) SAK. The tools will come in handy while traveling, and you won't have to worry.

 

[Guyon]

This one might cover all your possible needs...

 

[JohnTheTexican]

The only exemptions are if it is part of religious dress or national costume, or if you have a good reason for it.

Sounds like you need to join the Busse Cult. I'm pretty sure that at least one knife is a required part of the religious regalia.

 

[Guyon]

Sounds like you need to join the Busse Cult. I'm pretty sure that at least one knife is a required part of the religious regalia.

This is an excellent idea and a "loophole" that needs further exploration. TonyG has already mentioned getting us tax exemption status. Exactly how do we go about getting "recognized" as a viable system of belief?

 

[foxyrick]

This is an excellent idea and a "loophole" that needs further exploration. TonyG has already mentioned getting us tax exemption status. Exactly how do we go about getting "recognized" as a viable system of belief?

Not sure what it takes, but the Jedi tried it not so long ago. There was a public census and enough people put 'Jedi' as their religion (including me ) for it to actually be officialised. It wasn't though; never really found out why. Probably the damned government got involved!

So it's not that simple... Maybe we need some Busse fans in the government...

I'm in anyway!


As to Tree Herder V's question, it was answered quite correctly by James. Unless one has a definate, lawful purpose (like specific work) for having a knife in public, it is unlawful unless it's a folder (non-locking) with a blade less than 3 inches. Note that a court allowed the police to measure the length of the 'edge' of a blade including going around the serrations! Certainly no knives are allowed on schools grounds, on planes, and the transport police can seize your knife on a train, even if it meets the allowed critera!

They have to know you have it though...

Rick.

 

[Guyon]

They have to know you have it though...

Rick.

I'm guessing that this means... if you just absolutely *have to* stab someone with your Game Warden, do so discreetly, and if the blade will not come unstuck, be sure to wipe any prints off the handle.

 

[Tree Herder V]

Thank you all guys! In that case I'll leave all my blades at home... 9 days without them it shouldn't be that bad...
Guyon - you'd need a backpack to carry this monster :thumbup: But it's defenately not a defensive weapon (you would be robbed before you find the blede) - unless you throw it at someone.
As to the Busse cult - I'm in and I officially offer my apartament to be the Busse Shrine of Drinking Hog - you all send me your infi to make proper wall decorations

 

[bigbrick]

To expand on James' answer

From a forum reply regarding this subject(I forget which one):

"Under no circumstances, can you ever carry an offensive weapon in this country - but an offensive weapon can be a ballpoint pen, a bunch of keys, an apple - anything. Under UK law, an object - any object only becomes an offensive weapon, when a person either does harm with it or intends to do harm with it - not before. It's the persons intention that makes the object offensive, not the object itself".

If you are caught carrying a blade that the arresting officer deems an offensive weapon, the likelyhood is you will arrested and offered a police caution.Under no circumstances accept this caution as it is seen as an admission of guilt, i.e. You were intending to stab someone,or would possible use the knife in a self defence situation if one arose.This admission could possibly land you with a court appearance and a small fine in addition to the police caution.

I regularly EDC a Fallkniven TK3 and really dont worry about it.Why? Because the last time I was stopped and searched I was 16, and that was 19 years ago.However,if I was walking down the street dressed like Dr Dre or Enimem,or obviously drunk or under the influence of drugs I would expect to be stopped and searched immediately if spotted by the police.The majority of recent knife crimes are being perpetrated by 13-25 year old wannabe gangsters As overzealous as the UK police are, I do believe they have the discretion about them to beable to distinguish the difference between who is likely to be a threat to the public and who is not.....however I maybe completly wrong.
Your main problem,I believe,would actually be getting the knife through customs at the airport you arrive at,Although,I know of a German guy recently visiting England for a deerstalking weekend,bringing with him a Fallkniven H1 for dressing game and had no problems whatsoever.

British Knife Law FAQ
http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8336

Ask-A-Cop, knives and related issues
http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2011

The sad state of the UK
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=336748

Not sure what it takes, but the Jedi tried it not so long ago. There was a public census and enough people put 'Jedi' as their religion (including me ) for it to actually be officialised. It wasn't though; never really found out why. Probably the damned government got involved!

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2001/10/09/jedi_knights_achieve_official_recognition/

And on a lighter note

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2001/04/10/may_the_false_declaration/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2001/04/23/uk_jedi_get_green_light/

Sorry if I have waffled on too much, but I had to kill some time while waiting for my first busse combat knife(a FFBM)to arrive at the post office, where I am now heading to directly
So if I'm not heard from again...... I've been stopped,arrested and had the key thrown away. Chances are they would probably destroy the mistress aswell,or rather,they could try

Hope this helped
Bigbrick

 

[Tree Herder V]

Thanks bigbrick! Very informative answer! I decided to leave all baldes at home. 7-9 days it's not that long, and I don't want any trouble in foreign country, and I won't be needing knife for any special purpose.
I hope you post some pics of your new FFBM:thumbup:

 

[Tony G]

TonyG has already mentioned getting us tax exemption status. Exactly how do we go about getting "recognized" as a viable system of belief?

I'm thinking virgin sacrifice....

I was writing up the by-laws and got slowed down because some Military work came in:foot:. Also the part about the “first option” on any single women over 18 going to the tax guy got kind of complicated; especially the part where I can sell my option in any particular case, and the value of the option in INFI. I'm leaning towards and intra-cult option auction.