A question regarding questions?

[Horsewright]

Recently I had the opportunity to have 2 new knife designs tested. These were a Hunter and a Skinner. Basically a matched set kind of a deal. They were new designs as small slicer type EDCs are more my norm. Anyway this test has been going on for several months and is coming to a close soon. These knives were provided to a hunting ranch that not only guides for native game (white tail, pigs etc) but also exotics. This is a busy place and these knives saw more use in one day, by the guides, then most such similar knives would see in years. The test has been from the beginning of Nov and will finish at the end of Mar. I made two sets, one of 52100 and the other of A2 (based on Aaron's testing here on BF). All heat treating was done by Peter's and with Brad's input we went for 60 RC on the hunters and 61 on the skinners. Knives were ground from 5/32" stock. The only difference in the knives was that the A2 ones had nickel silver bolsters and the 52100 had brass. The guides did not know which was which, nor, did they even know that they were two different steels. The steel question has already been answered. I spoke to the boss a short time ago and he said they had a strong preference for the A2 over the 52100. In fact he said it was leave the brass ones at home and fight over the nickel silver bolstered ones. This preference was mostly based on edge holding ability. Anyway, to get the most out of this test what other questions would you ask these guys?

 

[Overmountain]

How comfortable were they in the hand, i.e. hot spots. How well did they encounter harder stuff for quartering, etc. Also how well were they to work in the confines of the chest cavities.

Also ask them how comfortable and handy the sheaths were. All of this combined with the steel performance review should narrow you down to a good final design. Go ahead ask them what they would change about the knife, keeping in mind the change might be impossible and that each individual likes differet things. They also won't know nomenclature probably...
Sounds like some good blades if the guides are fighting to tske them... cheers!

Pics! We need visual stimulation! !

-Eric

 

[tryppyr]

I'd also ask if there were any issues (apart from edge retention) with the brass bolstered knives. Did they like the length? Were they grippy enough? Is there any good meat left that they can send back with the knives?

 

[james terrio]

This preference was mostly based on edge holding ability. Anyway, to get the most out of this test what other questions would you ask these guys?

You and your clients have already answered most of your own questions. It's not surprising that the higher alloy knives held a working edge longer than the low-allow blades.

At this point, your blades seem to be performing very well. As Eric mentioned, handle/sheath design is very important.

If you want to take edge-holding to the next level and beyond, you've got a lot of room in which to work with alloy and HT. Performance will have nothing to do with whether or not you use brass ( or dyed fossil T-rex bone) as an ornament.

 

[Daniel Fairly Knives]

I wonder if subconsciously they could be picking the nickle silver over the brass... but then again you mentioned they said it was the edge holding. I'd consider more but with silver bolsters and a random mark on each to identify.

 

[tryppyr]

Performance will have nothing to do with whether or not you use brass ( or dyed fossil T-rex bone) as an ornament.

Bear in mind, James, that perception is reality. If the end user perceives that brass ornamentation makes the knife weaker, for them it will be weaker... even if it isn't in a quantitative sense.

The customer may not always be right... but they are always the customer (until you make them shop elsewhere).

 

[12345678910]

If you compile all the answers, I'd take it as a guide to product percentage mix rather than absolute yes or no


I would ask about colour preferences

Were they micarta / g10 or wood ?

I'd take a poll on colour preference for the synthetics, blaze, vs yellow, vs bright blue, pink, purple,
and the liner colour contrast, complement or none

liners or no liners


Blood and slime in the thong hold is a pain to clean
Some like it, some don't
thong hole vs no thong hole


sheath style
does the sheath get worn or kept in the pack

leather or kydex
colour
belt-loops or what kind of attachment
righty, lefty, ambi



Ask them what they think the price is, what they would pay to buy it, what they would charge if they were selling them.
This only works if you have not discussed price
You may be surprised high or low.

This also opens up the possibility that you make some for them, brand their hunting guide name on them and let them sell them to their customers as a souvenir.

 

[Horsewright]

Thank you gentlemen for the input. I post very seldom but read often on this forum. I'll have you know that each and every one of you are on my list of folks to pay attention to. I read when you write.

Thanks Eric I am not a hunter and so had not thought of the inside the chest cavity idea. I could see where that could be very important to the over all design. I do have pics but have no idea how to get em on here. You are gonna send me the instructions but trust me, I would have better luck deciphering the writing on the inside of King Tut's tomb. I had to have help even to sign up for this outfit and will be upgrading to a knife makers membership when my I T guy is home from school. Maybe could email the pics to someone that could post em? Nor had it really thought on asking about the sheaths. As a long time sheath maker I figured kinda had that down but that is just plain dumb not to ask now that you mention it.

Greg outside of the bolster color and the handle color they were identical. Both sets were handled in wood. Iron wood and Cocobolo. So grippiness or lack there of would be similar. But I will check. They told me on the first day they had them they used em on some kind of critter I'd never heard of and couldn't tell ya know what it was now. So not sure how tasty that meat was!

James I hadn't really thought on pushing the steel further. Bears some thought. And as always you crack me up. I got some dinosaur bone come to think of it. At least a guy said it was, looks like white rock to me. Want some? Just little pieces though. Have to make itty bitty tiny kniflets with it.

Daniel I know that in the knife world brass is kind of passé, oh so seventies. But these guys are also cattle ranchers as am I. Brass isn't so bad in our outfit. In fact it is often preferred over nickel and or stainless. Much of the hardware on our saddles and tack will be brass. Stainless has been making in roads in the last few years but nickel kind of has a bad rap as cheap. Most ranchers are kinda seventies guys anyways....1870s. However it does bear asking if the visual appearance made any difference in their selection.

The Count thanks hadn't thought on the thong hole. These all did have them, good question there. I' m not sure what you mean in your first sentence? If you could a chance could you explain.

Thanks again gentlemen. Things I'd not thought of.

 

[aarongough]

I think the answers so far have all been good!

My only suggestion would be to ask them to list 2-3 things that could be improved on each knife. Leaving it open ended like that probably makes them think about it a bit more deeply than 'did you like X'... Don't take the answers as gospel obviously as it's going to be personal for each guy, but if the same suggestion come up more than once then it might be a good indicator of something to tweak.

As James said I think there's still a bit more room for tweaking the A2 as well. I run mine at 62-63HRC and have had no problems with chipping on my hard-use knives. My blades tend to be about 0.015" at the edge before being sharpened (maybe 0.020" behind the shoulder after sharpening) and they'll take being batoned through knots with only a tiny section of rolled edge to show for it when sharpened at 25º.