A real kukri bayonet c.1820

S

spiraltwista

Joined
Nov 29, 2002
Messages
3,229
Just picked up one of the super rare original Brown Bess kukri Bayonets, the 9 or 10 that came in 1975 from Nepal had 2 varients of inscription or were uninscribed.

This is a third type of inscription.... Apparently something "new" in both the bayonet & kukri world.

It also has what appears to be an EIC type lion & flag as seen on some sword type early Nepali made bayonets & rifles, but with a further inscription underneath.

Its in amazing condition, lots of dark spots but virtualy no pitting, other than a very finely "pepery" muzzle catch spring.

Its a wide angh khola fuller to which is an rathey unusual feature as well. The hole thing is socket,elbow & blade is drawn & forged from one piece of metal, Amazing metalworkingby the old kami.

So rare I never thought Id get one! :)

Its also cleary done a lot more than parade work...

Translation of inscriptions defintaly welcome!

Spiral



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WOW! Congrats Spiral!!!! :thumbup: :cool: :D
So these really do exist hunh? :confused:
From what I understood the Brown Bess Kukri Bayonets were figments of someone's imagination that were forged with add on parts to an old kukri; so now I have to change my understanding... :foot: :o

It most certainly appears too have been around the block a time or two but still in wonderful condition in spite of that.:D
I wonder if the blade was forged in that shape or if it has just been sharpened so much that the shape gradually changed over the years?

What do you mean about the "EIC type lion & flag?" I understand about the lion as its engraving can be seen and I assume it's holding a flag of some sorts so I guess the question is actually, what is the "EIC?" ;)

Edit:
Spiral, Beoram that posts sometimes here in the HI Forum/Cantina may be able to translate it for you.
HERE is Ben's homepage. Ben has an email link right at the top of the page to contact him with. Ben is a very affable fellow that has been a great help in getting things Nepali translated. :D

spiraltwista said:
It also has what appears to be an EIC type lion & flag as seen on some sword type early Nepali made bayonets & rifles, but with a further inscription underneath.

So rare I never thought Id get one! :)

Spiral
Click to expand...
 
EIC: East India Company
The Victorian Web said:
One of the strangest parts of the history of the British Empire involves that commercial venture generally known as the East India Company, though its original name when founded by royal charter on the very last day of 1600 was the Governor and Company of Merchants of London Trading into the East Indies. As its name suggests, the company was the enterprise of London businessmen who banded together to make money importing spices from South Asia. For centuries the valuable spice trade with the East Indies (as they were long known) relied on land routes across Asia and the Middle East, but by the sixteenth century, the superior navigational technology and skills of the Portuguese for the first time permitted Europeans to cut out intermediaries and hence make themselves far greater profits. The Spanish and Portuguese had a monopoly of the East Indies spice trade until destruction of the Spanish Aramada in 1588, which permitted the British and Dutch to seek their share of this wealthy import business.

The company with the long name first entered the spice trade in the form of an old-fashioned or early capitalist venture, essentially conducting each voyage as a separate business venture with its own subsribers or stock-holders. This approach lasted for a dozen years, and then in 1612 the company switched to temporary joint stocks and finally to permanent joint stocks in 1657. Supposedly a monopoly, the company evenentually faced competition from another group of English investors and merchants, and the two merged in 1708 as the United Company of Merchants of England Trading to the East Indies.

According to the Encyclopedia Britannica,
The company met with opposition from the Dutch in the Dutch East Indies (now Indonesia) and the Portuguese. The Dutch virtually excluded company members from the East Indies after the Amboina Massacre in 1623 (an incident in which English, Japanese, and Portuguese traders were executed by Dutch authorities), but the company's defeat of the Portuguese in India (1612) won them trading concessions from the Mughal Empire. The company settled down to a trade in cotton and silk piece goods, indigo, and saltpetre, with spices from South India. It extended its activities to the Persian Gulf, Southeast Asia, and East Asia.
Click to expand...

The company's encounters with foreign competitors eventually required it to assemble its own military and administrative departments, thereby becoming an imperial power in its own right, though the British government began to reign it in by the late eighteenth century. Before Parliament created a government-controlled policy-making body with the Regulating Act of 1773 and the India Act eleven years later, shareholders' meetings made decisions about Britain's de facto colonies in the East. The British government took away the Company's monopoly in 1813, and after 1834 it worked as the government's agency until the 1857 India Mutiny when the Colonial Office took full control. The East India Company went out of existence in 1873.

During its heyday, the East India Company not only established trade through Asia and the Middle East but also effectively became of the ruler of territories vastly larger than the United Kingdrom itself. In addition, it also created, rather than conquered, colonies. Singapore, for example, was an island with very few Malay inhabitants in 1819 when Sir Stamford Raffles purchased it for the Company from their ruler, the Sultan of Johor, and created what eventually became one of the world's greatest trans-shipment ports.
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And this is the flag:

250px-British_East_India_Company_flag.svg.png


Mohd.
 
Thanks guys!

I just got this translation.


rom Olikara, {But any other translation welcome.}

The 1st inscription(in a rectangular cartouche) reads - 'Saal 83'

Saal- Year (Vikram Samvat Calendar)
83 - 1883 V.S.

Now 1883 Vikram Samvat corresponds to 1826 A.D.

However it could also be pre. Aprill 1827 A.D. as the V.S. calendar starts from April.

The second inscription reads - 'Shri Gorakhnath Sahay' which is in Sanskrit (The religious language of the Hindus)

Shri Gorakhnath Sahay -

So perhaps means something like "Lord Gorkanath Helps." Or the "Helper of Lord Gorkhanath."


Well most are fakes Yvsa, I saw some of these in The Nepal National museam. They all had this slender blade shape. 9 or 10 real ones came in in 1975 but they went to the worlds top bayonet collecters. Hayes, Carter , Skennerton etc. But these have been wellrecorded in paintings & litrture going back to pre. 1830.


As Mohd says EIC is east India company who have used many symbols including rampant lion with flag.

It seems the rampant Lion is also the symbol of the Nepali king as well. So it could have either meanings. Ill do another photo to show it later, on the original pics I was trying to catch the sanscrit/Devangari.


Cheers,
Spiral
 
Very interesting. I enjoy reading the history regarding the various khukuris.
 
a very satisfying find indeed. well done. :thumbup:
 
Thanks Spiral, will be looking forward to seeing the complete lion pic!:thumbup: :D
 
DAYUM. Nice snag.

Saw what was clearly a homemade add-on of a bayonet lug to a cheap khuk at my last gun show. Never thought it was based on something real.

Mac
 
He we go Yvsa! typical rampant lion of the peroid, appears closest to the Nepali royal standerd of the Shah familys rampant lion.

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And a photo to show the fullering...

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Spiral
 
A lot to the top kukri collectors but an absouloute fortune to the top bayonet collectors.

Of those that were found in 1975 5 stayed in England, 5 went to the states.

If any were resold it doesnt appear it was done on the open market. It is one of the rarest bayonets out there & its dated as well.


If I had 5 rusty beatun up ones without dates , I could sell them all today for $2000 each minimum, probably more.

Just this One ? Who knows. A lot....

There a lot more serious rich bayonet collectors out there who havent got one.

So far I am perhaps the only kukri collecter to get one? I know JP tried to find one for many years.

Why do you ask?

Spiral
 
You may have to add yourself to the top khuk/bayonet collector list. ;)

That's a great catch - definitely looks like a well made piece. Thanks for the photos!
 
Tohatchi NM said:
You may have to add yourself to the top khuk/bayonet collector list. ;)

That's a great catch - definitely looks like a well made piece. Thanks for the photos!
Click to expand...

Only ever kept two bayonet this one & an Afghani Mazar al sharrif arsenel Lee metford 1888 one that goes with my Mazar al sharrif kukri as a nice match.

Certanly both are rare, but for me its there kukri connection that makes me find & keep them.

I like the 1888 as a top quality built dagger or bayonet anyway though, but most just pass through my hands, on my hunt fore rarer kukri.

Spiral
 
Many Thanks Spiral!:thumbup: :cool: :D I like the way you do your collecting and I need to start following your example and do the same. I have way too many kukris I can't use and maybe three or four that are too valuable too me to use anyway.
I ordered a boarding axe this evening, head only, because that's all they have but it's one I've been wanting for ages and the first thing I've ordered in months.
I need to sell some in order to get some more. I have a couple of Busse's that I'm gonna put on the market one of these days as well as some kukris, just trying to get in good enough shape to where I can.:( ;) :D :cool:
 
Cheers Yvsa, well if I was rich I would keep nearly evrything in but I am not so I let most things go & just keep my favorites.

But at least I get the chance to learn & look after the other pieces whether I have them for 1 week or 5 years.

Ive had nearly 600 kukri in 7 years, & hundreds of knives,swords, bayonets, axes etc. Today Ive kept 92 kukri , 15 knives, 2 bayonets & 2 swords..... Next week I will probably only have one sword....& 10 knives, All the knives Ive kept for years The wheel of life keeps turning & a kukri bayonet replaces them.

But what I have kept is realy stuff I love... & handling so much is great, I try to learn something from every piece.

There only 4 or 5 I realy wish I had kept that went, but hell when I am bones & dust it wont matter anyway....

I am looking for the next aquisition already.....

Spiral
 
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