A Thing or Two About My Experience with Brownell's PBC

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Mar 29, 2002
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I, over time and also most recently, have gotten email asking about PBC. I use PBC exclusively on high carbon, or sometimes called simple steels. I love the stuff. I don't like the price because I use so much of it for my larger knives - but I love the stuff for what it does and it does it very well.

What I have learned so far, except the fact that it does what it says it will do, is that just preheating the steel to 500 F. and coating IS NOT ENOUGH. I have learned that the steel should be heated to at least that temperature and allowed to rest in the furnace (oven) at that temperature for a long enough period to get the core of the steel to the same desired temperature. Not doing so permits the steel to cool too quickly before getting the PBC powder melted properly upon the steel surface. What I have learned to do with my outfit (a Even Heat) is heat at about 530 F for 15 minutes, take out and coat (I sprinkle instead of dipping into or laying upon the PBC), I then place back into the oven and redo the same heat (530 F) for 15 minutes and sprinkle again so as to take care of any spots that may have been missed the first time. In this way VERY SELDOM do I end up with any decarburation that might cause me difficulty.

I HAVE ONE BIG WARNING for those of us that do both simple and complex steels within the same furnace. Do not allow your heat treating foil to contact any PBC residue left behind in your furnace (oven) while heat treating complex steels. The high temperatures required to heat treat your complex steels will allow the PBC residue to eat through your foil wrap and allow decarburation to occur into your hard work. When using PBC I always place a sheet of foil wrap on my brick that I place the blade upon and also a larger piece upon the floor of my Even Heat. If this stuff gets on your bricks, and it wants too do that, its in there for good. Getting it out means chippng the brick surface away. Using the foil wrap within your oven for simple steel heat treating WILL NOT damage the foil wrap you use for protecting your oven. Those tempertures are within tolerance. It is the high temperatures that seem to activate the nastiness.

Besides relative ease of application Brownell's PBC is unlike the paint on protectives in that no wire grinding wheel is needed to remove it after quench or temper. I can not tell you how many times I have forgotten to turn on my tempering oven to have ready just when needed. I have actually repeated heat treats because I had to let steel fall below hand warm before tempering was ready. Stupid but stupid happens sometimes. With PBC just let it cool to no less than hand warm and place in your boiling water. Boiling water is what is recommended to remove its residue from the steel after quench and you can hold it there until tomorrow if it takes that long for your tempering oven to stabilize at your desired temperature. Take it out, wipe it off, let cool to hand warm and place in tempering. No problem.

As with about all things we do in knife making, wear breathing protection when working with this dust. It has some nasty stuff in it but great stuff to perform what it is ment for.

Credit: Bruce Bump, a most favorite maker to me, has given me some nice tips over the very few years of my experience in knife making and one of my most valuable is his tip to me to try PBC.

rlinger
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Thanks for the info, I just bought a evenheat and will be using PBC.
 
Thanks rlinger for the information.

I make mainly folders with damascus blades and I've been looking for a method to heat treat without scaling. I've tried the SS foil but unless you can get the blade out of the foil and into the quench very very fast, it doesn't work that well. I have tried Turco without much success as well. PBC looks like it would do the trick and I just may give this stuff a shot. Here is a link to Rose Mill Co. who I beleive is the distributor. They are much cheaper than Brownells but you have to buy larger quantites. They also have a PBC special powder for heat treating higher temp blades.
http://rosemillcom.host-manager.com/product.asp?productid=258463
 
Thanks for the link Cigarman and I would not mind having a good cigar right now either. No problem with PBC on simple carbon. Within those required temps just be sure to heat the steel throughout and do it twice so as to cover any small areas that may have been missed. It comes off in very hot to boiling water and a lot of it will drop off into your quench tank anyhow. All steels will discolor from heat so discoloration is not a concern as to whether atmospher protected or not.

rlinger
 
whats the trick on getting knives out of the foil package to air quench? I will need to figure this one out for sure!
 
blgoode
For air quenching, I just cut the foil packet on one end and accross the top, then open the packet and put the whole thing, foil and all in front of your air flow.

Roger,
You up for a little trade?? I'll send you a few choice cigars and you can send me a sample of PBC. :D

Bill
 
most folx DONT take the blade outta envelopes for quenching,
but insted drop the whole thing, still in envelope, on top of a
largish metal plate and put another one like that on top.

It keeps em nice and flat and also cools em much quicker
than still or forced air. AND you dont have to mess with cutting
that envelope w/o dropping the blade and/or burning a hole
in your overalls/flesh :eek:
 
blgoode said:
whats the trick on getting knives out of the foil package to air quench? I will need to figure this one out for sure!
Brian
if using SS
weather I plate quench or just air quench
when I plate quench I put it in the plates leaving the end out just a little
so I can snip the end off the fold then I blow air in from my air compressor
you need to get it into the plates as fast as you can, sniping the end can wait a few seconds , remember why the foil in the first place,,, if you open it while the blade is to hot You'll undo what your fold is for in the first place..

if I air quench I stick the blade while in foil in to a can and blow air into it circulating it around the blade once the red is gone I'll open the foil still blowing air and either blow the air in the foil or dump the blade out
the main thing is cool cool cool
but still not getting it out of the foil to soon..
I'm like a cat on a hot tin roof when I'm getting ready to quench SS..it's the most nervous time of knife making for me because it counts so much..

Roger
why not temper before you boil the blade??:confused:

temper then boil to clean ??
I haven't even used my PBC yet.:o I'm A/O ing mostly right now...
and concerned I won't be able to see what the steel is doing,,
I will use it the next time I use my E/H oven though..
 
Either way should be fine. I've done it that way too. It gets the tempering oven a little oilier tempering first.

Cigarman, that sounds good but I am so low right now on PBC I wouldn't have enough to help you much. Perhaps after my next order.

rlinger
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my problem lately with my PBC is that some of it is sticking...especially along the bevels.

I can get 95% of it off by boiling...but in my mind, it should all be coming off.

I've done it both ways: heat to just over 500, and heat to well over 500.

Also coat and recoat, etc.

Maybe it's because I'm at the "bottom of my barrel" and all that's left is crud?

Because I remember it working very very well at first.

Hopefully I'm not getting worse at it. :(
 
i just used it for the first time and had the same result. most of it came right off in the quench....blade looks awesome....so i take it to some boiling water to try to get whats still on, but about 1/4" around the beveled edge is still covered with blackend PBC that wouldnt scrub off. did i not put it on thick enough there?
 
As far as health concerns with PBC, I did a search and could not find any serious hazards related to it. Everything I read said no known hazards, except that some people get respiratory irritation that only lasts as long as the exposure, or clears up very soon after. I would advise precautions, but at present there seems to be little problem with the stuff. Does anyone else have more info on this?
 
rashid11 said:
Dan - read my feedback in me post of few days ago.
Execute summary: it works.
sorry
I don't see anything you've said about PBC used on SS?:confused:
I think you may have miss understood me.. staying the topic..haha that's a new one for me..:D staying on topic that is..;)

concerning SS used with SS foil, I've been doing that for years now and plate quenching a few years now....:) did I misunderstand you or you I?:confused:
 
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