A very unique Schrade 152!

[Codger_64]

I recently acquired a very unique Schrade knife. I am pretty sure that it was one of the last Schrades to leave the Ellenville factory, even though it was not accompanied by a certificate from Smokey to prove it. As a matter of fact, I would not be surprised to find out that it was one of the very last to be stamped out from the dies. I almost (but not quite!) regret that it is so unique that I may have to collect the more common varieties of this pattern to display with it.

As a former manufacturing process engineer, this knife holds a special allure to me. I can almost write the process sheets from looking at this knife and a regular production knife from my collection. I may very well attempt to do just that as an exercise in historical archeology. Obtaining an original set of production process sheets may well be impossible, but maybe not. If they could be found, it would be very interesting to see how my process design compared to that of the Schrade engineer's design. I will produce a set of blueprints as a required part of the process sheets. That too would be interesting to compare with a set of originals.

Some of you have mentioned that you received blades with a poor, rough final grind. This knife did not receive the final grind. None.

I also have heard of some the last Schrade knives having the scale rivets driven too deeply, and some with poorly fitted scales. I would guess that some, if not all of these knives were shipped out as seconds. Mine has neither rivets nor scales.

I have heard of Schrades with off center primary grinds and poor polishing. This knife is not ground or polished at all. The only process it went through after the blank stamping press was to have the tang stamp applied. It does have the rivet holes and thong hole punched. This may have been a seperate operation from the blank die operation as it looks like the holes were punched from the opposite side as the die operation. It is a rough, tangstamped blank. It did not even go through the flat grinder, as the outer edges are still flanged from the press that stamped it from the flat stock.

It is the most unique 152OT Sharpfinger I have ever seen, and indeed, a pattern collection will be built around this stainless blank!

Codger (anyone have the original process sheets, blueprints and guages for the 152? Grovel # 1 for 2005!)

 

[delander]

From your description I'd tend to call this a 'Schrade" sooner than a knife that was "assembled" post factory close down. Especially a knife that was 'assembled' elsewhere than in the Schrade factory.
The questions may be: "Can a knife be called an Old Timer or Uncle Henry if it has no shield on it?", or, "Can a knife that likely did not pass the final 'Quality Control' or 'Post Production Inspection' be truly called a "Schrade"?"

 

[Bob W]

Based on your description, I'd call that a "knife part." Probably of interest to Schrade collectors, and probably a rare find. But there could have been thousands or tens-of-thousands of knife parts sold along with the Schrade warehouse supplies.

Best Wishes,
-Bob

 

[Codger_64]

Well, it will never be a knife assembled post plant closedown. I'll keep it just the way it is. I am not even sure you could call it a part or component, as it never recieved the operations to make it a usable part for a finished knife. Plenty of Schrades are out there which did not meet the standards for the final QC post production inspection. And I had a 165OT that the OLD TIMER shield fell out of which I sent back to Schrade for repair. They fixed it at no charge. They recognized it as a Schrade Old Timer even without it's shield. But I did identify the object of this thread as "......152OT Sharpfinger....... this stainless blank!", so maybe I can be allowed to slide this once! :footinmou

 

[lt632ret]

Hey Codger, lost your email address however wanted you to know package recieved thankyou . I have so much of the junk you are talking about it is amazing. I have no idea when I will ever do anything with it. However no blueprints and no similar materials. I was told those were to go with the IP ( to Taylor) I gave my word that if I ran into any of that stuff I would advise them. As it was I found one box that might have been construed as something that might have been that, stuff, which is all greek to me anyway. I left it where it was and notified the powers that be where and what I had found. I never saw it again an have no idea what happened to it. Thanks again. LT PS I thought I would add these pics, this is a work in progress ( started today ). These still have to be cleaned ect but I was out in a building today and grabbed these and then I saw this case and threw in a sign. It will take a few days to complete if the weather holds. It is a quick conglomerate of a few of the Schrade pattern blanks in various states of completion from raw pattern to polished finished. I thought someone should preserve some kind of record of these items and since I had finished a couple of other displays and sort of just stumbled on this bunch I started messing with it. When I read this thread I thought someone might find it interesting. As you can see lighting was a bit of a problem on the pics but it should give you an idea. PPS I have not had time to label them but heck I know you people all recognize them anyway, HUMM it would have made for a good test we haven't had one in a while.

 

[Codger_64]

Thanks LT. SOunds like I need to make a road trip this summer and bring my Wells Lamont mule hide gloves. You are having WAY too much fun!

I hope the article bears a morsel of fruit for you. I found it interesting to say the least, though a lot of it you either knew before the fat lady sang, or have filled us in on since. I can't wait for UHfan to pop back in and give us a progress report on her project. The whole thing plays out like the Tucker car movie in a way. Except all the more tragic because of the company's long success. I'll always think it a shame that some wealthy Texan didn't buy it lock stock and barrel as a going enterprise and do a major investment business plan to put it back on track. But as they say here in Tennessee, "If a frog had wings, he wouldn't bust his butt every time he jumped". And if your aunt had....., nevermind

Codger
Buying Schrade one blade at a time

 

[Codger_64]

Hey Codger,......... When I read this thread I thought someone might find it interesting........ I have not had time to label them but heck I know you people all recognize them anyway, HUMM it would have made for a good test we haven't had one in a while.

You got my attention! I, for one, am very interested. I don't know if I am up to the test, but I am sure willing to try! All it cost me last time was a little bit of hair where I was scratching my head with my 152OT Sharpfinger (thread content). Bring it on!

Codger

 

[lt632ret]

Hey codger none of these young folks will know what I am talking about but in regard to your first posting regarding a persons AUNT. Well all I can say is ( the old Roger Miller song lyric) "my Uncle used to love me but she died". I like a close confused family. Regarding a contest it was only an afterthought to the posting but. It would be interesting to see who could be first to post a list of all of them. I certainly am willing to kick in a hat. Good luck if anyone has an interest. MY pleasure. LT

 

[Codger_64]

LT, as a point of interest, would you say that this 152OT blank, if it's provinence were traced, would likely be one of the very last hundred or so to leave the Ellenville Schrade factory?

Codger

 

[lt632ret]

It would be impossible ( at least for me ) to guess on the provinence of such an example ( the 152OT ) considering what was going on there during the last days. Sort of like saying did Rhemus or Rhomus die first during the Pompeii eruption? How about that for a picturesque analogy. Anyway it was pretty confusing in there.

In regard to the blade blanks I posted. This is the list of the patterns starting from the top and going clockwise. 1, 167, 2, UNKNOWN I Saw this blank all shiny and bright while scrounging through the rubble and like a hungry bass sucked it up, it almost looks familair but if it was used at one time I cannot place it. 3, 156 4, PH2 5, 153UH 6, DBL2 7, 141 OT 8, 160OT. 9, 165OT, 10, 143OT, 11, Bowie ( Buffalo Bill ) original raw pattern blank, 12, 152 OT, 13. XT2B 14, DS15 15, 15OT 16, PH1 17, 158OT.

The response to the semi contest was again underwhelming. Of the few who did email me the winner was Codger ( big surprise ) and Larry ie BIGDOG ( another surprise.) Codger has now won his name which will be BLANK MEISTER or BLANKMAN. ( However Blankman was used in a movie so call him what you want ).

I pretty much completed the blank display ( it still needs a couple of screws ) I ran out of the correct size. To confirm my unending ability with tools I managed to drill into the table the board was on when putting in tap holes which is so common in my case that I did not even get upset in fact I can remember my projects by the holes in my antique dining room table. I took a couple of pics of the board with the cleaned up now shiny blanks. since I had the camera downstairs I snapped a couple of shots of other dispalys in that room I only took a couple since I can only post 5. I dubb this group ( Example of the confuusion I live in ). By the way this is a fairly neat room an I am only showing part of two walls and a foyer one corner shot. It is a good thing that you cannot take it with you because if I did there would be no place for me unless they bury me at GIZA. Congrats Codger thanks Larry. I hope you enjoy the pics. LT

 

[Codger_64]

RE: Provinence of the 152 blank: While you are most definately correct in your analygy of the twins at Pompei, would it be safe to say that a pot found there in the 19th or 20th century still on the potter's wheel under the ashes would be of later manufacture than say a similar vessel found in an ancient shipwreck a thousand miles away? By the way, there is some recent speculation that a metalsmith by the name of Schradius formed some knives there from bronze. If an example of such could be found, these would be among the first old timers, though I am sure the patents have expired by now. I wonder who bought all the I.P. from him.

The unknown blank is quite a curiosity. The curved shape of the spine is very sugggestive of the folder Barnett designed for Schrade (SB2LTD), though the blade itself more closely mimics the more traditional Schrade short skinners of the 1980's. Obviously it was destined to be a DU edition judging by the ducks head etch (laser cut?) on the blade. Perhaps it was a collaboration for 2005 that never launched.

Thank you for the laurel and hardy congratulations on my co-winning the contest. I will have my new title BLANKMEISTER embroidered on my Schrade Proud American hat which I promise to not wear backwards unless taking down a perp (with proper authorization). I have seen fit to reward myself for my achievement by Schradebaying myself one of the "what the heck is that" knives, the XT2B Drop Point. My wife was quite thrilled with my purchase since I was able to point out the fact that I paid only $21 for it instead of the MSRP of $64.95. And blaming LT (Schrade fever promoter), Larry (co-conspiritor and partner in crime) and Phil (arm shaving reviewer) helped as well, though he did not realize he would get the blame...er...credit when he posted his reviews. Thanks guys!

LT, the display looks great, even though you still have a few screws loose. I seriously doubt that Schrade's folks could have developed a better display. By what process did you clean and polish the blanks so well? I appreciate your giving us glimpses of your collection.

And by the way, all the king's treasures simply went into storage until such a time as a fitting museum could be arranged. He did not take them with him afterall.

Codger Blankmeister
looking for a XT4 now

 

[lt632ret]

The secret is a medium grade scotchbrite wheel it takes about a minute ( maybe two) a knife even for me. I guess that is why these wheels run 30 to 60 dollars. I like using a buffer and since I am such a tools expert and always rushing I never wear glasses or gloves which would explain why my finger prints must often grow back and I have had to pick cinders from my eyes but my favorite mishap with the buffer is when the blade is yanked from your hands and wings off into the sunset or wall or floor or whoever is unlucky enough to be standing in the wrong spot. Following Murphys law if it is a real good ( especially old high end knife ) it will usually break the blade or the handles. I kind of like it though since I do like to gamble it is kind of like a roulette ( Russian Roulette ) Ah yes thats me mister machine. I guess that is why I have always been in awe of those who create these items or in fact any one who builds things with there hands. It would seem there are those who create and those who destroy my favorite tool is the sledge and my favorite working medium is C4. By the way I hope my congratulations were not misconstrude you did a great job on the blanks and quite frankly named two that I did not know ( I am not real good on Schrades later new production tach knives. ) So I really do take my Schrade hat off to you. Thanks again. As far as missing a few screws it goes without saying there are probably a few loose ones as well.

One of the reasons I do not often show much of my junk is that I often feel that people think I am being a vain showoff. You will notice that only codger has responded to this thread it since I put on the pictures. Which I only did since a couple of people have asked me to and since I was taking a pic of the Blank display I just sort of snapped a couple of shots next to it.

I have been collecting for more years than most of the readers have been alive. Please realize that while it was always an interest at this point in life it now really is my main preoccupation. My family and all my friends have gone ( I have a tontine flask that became mine when the last comrade passed ). I say this not seeking any sollicitude since I have had a good life but rather to explain why I am involved in this study. This stuff and this history fills my time and allows me something to think about other than the ballistics of various handgun cartridges. Frankly while I enjoy this stuff I perhapes more than most understand that the material objects in life are much more permanent than we are and as such we are but caretakers of them for a short time. This is why I have persued the avenue of a museum for so long. That is why I wrote a book and CD . There was a time when I would have donated the entire collection if I knew its safty and history would be preserved for posterity. I will not do that now, at least if it is absorbed by collectors it will be saved. Oh yes and the financal benefits will not hurt either. Some more time in the casinos. I often give away schrades when I do shows to any kid that passes by I really like that part I love how the kids respond and how much it ticks off the parents who often say ok we will keep it till you get older.

All that being said I will only add one ( depressing thought ) more thing having all of this junk in the world is not as good as Thanks giving dinner surrounded by friends and family. LT

 

[Codger_64]

I am a sledge hammer and bench grinder kind of tool guy myself. If you think a flying Schrade is impressive, stand in the shed when I am sharpening my picks and shovels! I bought a dremmel tool. It lets me destroy delecate things faster. I only very recently allowed myself to buy a chainsaw, an electric one. At least when you let go of the trigger it quits inflicting injuries. They should all come with a "Hire the handicapped" bumper sticker.

LT, your congratulations were received as intended. If you look at my join date, you will see that I am still a relative FNG here. While I have used Schrade knives all my life, it was not until long after the closing that I, by chance, found this forum while looking for information on Schrades that I had or needed to replace. Through reading the current and archived posts, asking questions, chasing referenced sources, I have acquired a good bit of knowledge about Schrade the company, Schrade the men, and Schrade their product. ANd a nice small collection to boot. And coincidentally or not, I have met some great people who either were employed at Schrade, or just happen to collect and admire the knives and traditions from which they came. Their willingness to share their knowledge and passion, and sometimes their inventory, has fueled my interest beyond a mere tool user.

IMHO, not sharing photos of your collection and your vast knowledge with us here would be a shame, and more of an act of vanity like the men who collect famous works of art only to squirrel them away in some vault to keep them out of the hands and eyes of others. I regret that I do not have the disc space to archive the pictures you come up with for our reference when questions arise. Hopefully someone will do so as insurance against the possibility that this orphan forum is deleted. Just the last three months worth has enough history and illustrations to fill a small reference volume on a bookshelf. I feel like your sharing with us is a form of selfless philanthropy instead an act of vanity. I am yet to see you make a post here that reflected anything but a man both humble and knowledgable. Rare enough combination.

 

[ISC_RIP]

The unknown blank is for a DUCFTM9, which was an SG8 with a full tang. The duck head was laser cut in. The blade was 1095HC Steel and it was finished to a mirror polish.

 

[Bob W]

One of the reasons I do not often show much of my junk is that I often feel that people think I am being a vain showoff. You will notice that only codger has responded to this thread it since I put on the pictures. Which I only did since a couple of people have asked me to and since I was taking a pic of the Blank display I just sort of snapped a couple of shots next to it.

Kinfe and kife collection pictures are GREAT!

-Bob

 

[Codger_64]

The unknown blank is for a DUCFTM9, which was an SG8 with a full tang. The duck head was laser cut in. The blade was 1095HC Steel and it was finished to a mirror polish.

I don't suppose you would have a picture of a finished DUCFTM9 or the SG8, or could direct me to a pic of one or both? Do you know what year the DUCFTM9 was released?

 

[lt632ret]

Thankyou codger, Thankyou Bob. and Thankyou RIP doggone I knew I had seen that baby but I just could not place it chances are if you know the year it was made I can look it up I have the resources to do that but usually am to lazy to mess with it . It is easy to be lazy when guys like Larry and Phil and a few others ( apologys to all I miss ) who are around who usually will pick up the ball on the technical ( statistic ) end. Sure is a pretty blank I felt like a pickerel grabbing a shiny silver spoon when I gloomed it. But even though it looked familiar I just could not place it I knew eventually I would run across it I just haven't as of yet. Thanks again. LT