A Word About Titanium Knife Parts

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Pure titanium is not generally used for anything other than bullion. Commecially pure Ti is 99.2%, Ti alloys are known for their high strength to weight ratios, weighing 45% as much as steel, but when properly heat treated, approaching the strength of low-stength steels, such as A2.

95% of all Ti mined and refined is used to manufacture TiO2, Titanium dioxide, one of the most useful materials in existence. It is a powdered pigment that absorbs ultraviolet light, appears white, and therefore is useful in coloring paint, coatings and plastics exposed to the sun, and for making sunscreen. It is nontoxic and environmentally safe

5% of mined and refined Ti is used to make metal alloys of Titanium, which contain between roughly 70% to 95+% Ti. Elements mixed into Ti alloys to make the various grades are manganese, molybdenum, vanadium, aluminum, niobium, copper, nickel, slicon, tin, tantalum, zirconium, cobalt, oxygen, iron, chromium, gallium, carbon, nitrogen and germanium. The most commonly used alloy is called Ti6Al4V, which contains Ti with 6% Al, 4% Va, 0.25% Fe, and 0.2% O simply because it is too expensive, and unnecessary, to remove all the O.

The qualities of these alloys is strength to weight ratio, which drastically cuts fuel costs for aircraft, because of the lighter weight. It is bio-compatible, having about tue same density as bone, it is inert in the human body. It is nonmagnetic, a nonconductor of electricity, has high thermal resistance, is heat treatable, and can be fabricated before hardening,

Pound for pound, bone is the strongest substance on earth. With it's strength to weight ratio, Ti alloys work to make human prostheses requiring immense strength but small size and light weight. There really is no substitute that combines all these features. Ti alloys also resist corrosion. An initial corroded layer forms in response to contact with air, which is itself very reaistant to further corrosion.

It is irreplaceable in building structures due to it's high strength and corrosion resistance. And Ti is an abundant element, composing 0.63% of tue earth's crust. So, it is essentially in unlimited supply. The Ti alloy frame of a large aircraft weighs roughly 70 tons, which is 45% of what it would weight if steel was used. So, you can imagine the fuel saving by shaving 80 tons off the weight of the aircraft!

Very strong, long-lasting storage containers, which must remain sealed for up to 100,000 years, are made of Ti alloy, because of it's immense strength and natural corrosion resistence. I ordered a cylindrical bar of medical Ti alloy, and it is eerie how light weight it is, and you can hit it as hard as you want with a hammer, and not deform it one bit. Well, if you measured before and after with a caliper, there would no doubt be some d8fference.

Ti alloy is a supermetal. It's current cost is about $3.40/lb. It requires a few ounces of the metal to fabricate knife scales, which amounts to a dollar or two of material. The machining of Ti alloy is more difficult than steel, because it has bad features, suchnas tear out and galling, and requires super lubricants in the machining process. The tooling must also run slower, so the process is more time consuming.

But all the material and fabrication of Ti alloy in knifemaking amounts to about $12.00 per knife. The high cost is in the machines and tools, which are being used for low runs (not nearly full capacity), are what drives the cost way beyond what it's worth. But most noteworthy is that Ti alloys have zero properties making them particularly suitable, or even desireable, to the knifemaking industry!

Ti alloy scales are pure hype to fool those who have no idea why Ti alloy is valuable and what its value really is. Aircraft aluminum alloys are a much more sensible choice, as these can be sourced out to any machine shop that can produce hudreds to thousands of them per day. Ti alloy is twice as strong as Al alloy, but what is the purpose for all the extra strength. It's easy to anodize Al, so it is just as corrosion resistant in a knife as Ti.

Ti6Al4V costs about 170x what structural steel does. But that's still only about $3.40/lb.

So, because I know better, I will not pay much of a premium for Ti parts on any knife.
 
Thanks for the long read on titanium being awesome but I'm a little confused by the plot twist at the end.

I hate aluminum as a scale material. Here are two solid reasons why titanium is better as a scale material: (1) titanium has a warmer feel in hand than aluminum, and (2) titanium wears better than aluminum over time. The second will become apparent if you've had both anodized aluminum and titanium items long-term on a key ring, and especially if carried in a pocket with loose change (etc.). Titanium just holds up better.

Your point about corrosion being moot due to anodization is affected by 2. For the rare situations in which it actually matters to anyone: anodized aluminum wears more quickly, wears down to something less resistant, and wears down to something less bio-compatible.

I also inherently trust titanium over aluminum for lock bars. While I haven't heard of serious problems developing with aluminum lock bars, I don't know how common they are. So this one might just be about the feels but it is real to me.
 
Thanks for the long read on titanium being awesome but I'm a little confused by the plot twist at the end.

I hate aluminum as a scale material. Here are two solid reasons why titanium is better as a scale material: (1) titanium has a warmer feel in hand than aluminum, and (2) titanium wears better than aluminum over time. The second will become apparent if you've had both anodized aluminum and titanium items long-term on a key ring, and especially if carried in a pocket with loose change (etc.). Titanium just holds up better.

Your point about corrosion being moot due to anodization is affected by 2. For the rare situations in which it actually matters to anyone: anodized aluminum wears more quickly, wears down to something less resistant, and wears down to something less bio-compatible.

I also inherently trust titanium over aluminum for lock bars. While I haven't heard of serious problems developing with aluminum lock bars, I don't know how common they are. So this one might just be about the feels but it is real to me.
Good points. Aluminum is less durable. So then lets say stainless steel, which is stronger than Ti. I wouldn't want anything aluminum on a knife but scales, and even then I'd prefer G10. I'm not against the use of Ti, it's the 10x markup I have a problem with. If I could get Ti for $20 more than G10, I'd do it. But not for $120 more.

And just so everyone knows, I keep track of the market, and prices are way way up from a month ago. Of course that's not universal, but it's safer to just hold off on purchasing until the amateurs are done Christmas shopping. I've seen markups as much as 33%, for no reason whatsoever but because the amateurs are out now.

All they know is the name of the knife their loved one wants, not what the price should be. There's also a lot of markdowns on massively inflated MSRPs. I'm out of the market on new stuff until February. I have a big enough stock of knives to satisfy my gift-giving requirements this season.
 
Hey Awesome, are you going to ramble on argumentatively and erroneously for pages and pages like you did about Damascus steel?

I sure hope so, so I know to ignore this thread now.

P.S. You are not as smart as you think you are, and this thread is just another example of how ignorant you really are.
 
Hey Awesome, are you going to ramble on argumentatively and erroneously for pages and pages like you did about Damascus steel?

I sure hope so, so I know to ignore this thread now.

P.S. You are not as smart as you think you are, and this thread is just another example of how ignorant you really are.
He lost me when he said titanium is non conductive. My multimeter disagrees.
 
Pure titanium is not generally used for anything other than bullion. Commecially pure Ti is 99.2%, Ti alloys are known for their high strength to weight ratios, weighing 45% as much as steel, but when properly heat treated, approaching the strength of low-stength steels, such as A2.

95% of all Ti mined and refined is used to manufacture TiO2, Titanium dioxide, one of the most useful materials in existence. It is a powdered pigment that absorbs ultraviolet light, appears white, and therefore is useful in coloring paint, coatings and plastics exposed to the sun, and for making sunscreen. It is nontoxic and environmentally safe

5% of mined and refined Ti is used to make metal alloys of Titanium, which contain between roughly 70% to 95+% Ti. Elements mixed into Ti alloys to make the various grades are manganese, molybdenum, vanadium, aluminum, niobium, copper, nickel, slicon, tin, tantalum, zirconium, cobalt, oxygen, iron, chromium, gallium, carbon, nitrogen and germanium. The most commonly used alloy is called Ti6Al4V, which contains Ti with 6% Al, 4% Va, 0.25% Fe, and 0.2% O simply because it is too expensive, and unnecessary, to remove all the O.

The qualities of these alloys is strength to weight ratio, which drastically cuts fuel costs for aircraft, because of the lighter weight. It is bio-compatible, having about tue same density as bone, it is inert in the human body. It is nonmagnetic, a nonconductor of electricity, has high thermal resistance, is heat treatable, and can be fabricated before hardening,

Pound for pound, bone is the strongest substance on earth. With it's strength to weight ratio, Ti alloys work to make human prostheses requiring immense strength but small size and light weight. There really is no substitute that combines all these features. Ti alloys also resist corrosion. An initial corroded layer forms in response to contact with air, which is itself very reaistant to further corrosion.

It is irreplaceable in building structures due to it's high strength and corrosion resistance. And Ti is an abundant element, composing 0.63% of tue earth's crust. So, it is essentially in unlimited supply. The Ti alloy frame of a large aircraft weighs roughly 70 tons, which is 45% of what it would weight if steel was used. So, you can imagine the fuel saving by shaving 80 tons off the weight of the aircraft!

Very strong, long-lasting storage containers, which must remain sealed for up to 100,000 years, are made of Ti alloy, because of it's immense strength and natural corrosion resistence. I ordered a cylindrical bar of medical Ti alloy, and it is eerie how light weight it is, and you can hit it as hard as you want with a hammer, and not deform it one bit. Well, if you measured before and after with a caliper, there would no doubt be some d8fference.

Ti alloy is a supermetal. It's current cost is about $3.40/lb. It requires a few ounces of the metal to fabricate knife scales, which amounts to a dollar or two of material. The machining of Ti alloy is more difficult than steel, because it has bad features, suchnas tear out and galling, and requires super lubricants in the machining process. The tooling must also run slower, so the process is more time consuming.

But all the material and fabrication of Ti alloy in knifemaking amounts to about $12.00 per knife. The high cost is in the machines and tools, which are being used for low runs (not nearly full capacity), are what drives the cost way beyond what it's worth. But most noteworthy is that Ti alloys have zero properties making them particularly suitable, or even desireable, to the knifemaking industry!

Ti alloy scales are pure hype to fool those who have no idea why Ti alloy is valuable and what its value really is. Aircraft aluminum alloys are a much more sensible choice, as these can be sourced out to any machine shop that can produce hudreds to thousands of them per day. Ti alloy is twice as strong as Al alloy, but what is the purpose for all the extra strength. It's easy to anodize Al, so it is just as corrosion resistant in a knife as Ti.

Ti6Al4V costs about 170x what structural steel does. But that's still only about $3.40/lb.

So, because I know better, I will not pay much of a premium for Ti parts on any knife.
So you say you don't know why titanium is so expensive, then you agreed that machining it is a pain and costly which is the exact reason it's so expensive.
 
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