Adding a Schrade LB7 Bear Paw to my traditional folder collection

PocketKnifeJimmy

PocketKnifeJimmy

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Aug 4, 2013
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With one Buck knife already having been sent back this past week to the Buck factory to handle a defect... And now a Canal Street knife going back today for three defects... I was almost going to give up on online ordering. But, last night I saw a Schrade LB7 Bear paw that just called out to me... So, I ordered it and it should be here this week. I really like the Buck 110 & 112, and have both in my collection. The design has a big following, and was obviously copied by many. Schrade were no dummies when they put out similar knives, like the LB7. Out of all the American made knives that had a similar knife to the Buck 110, it was probably Shrade that did best with their sales of them... though I doubt they outsold the original 110. Anyhow, the knife I ordered is described as being in factory mint condition (never carried, never sharpened, with original sheath, and with original box and papers). It has a serial number bgining with the letter H and is a 4 pin model. So, hoping for a good online experience, and hopefully restore my faith in online buying... Well, that may be too much to ask, but at least I hope to be liking my purchase... and of course will share here with you that experience when the knife arrives (pics and all) :-)
 
I'm gunna hazard a guess that you will like the LB7....a lot.
What a shame there's no one to send it back to anymore.
Not that it will be necessary.
cheers.
 
I am thinking this particular knife is about 25 to 30 years old... not an antique, but has some years of being born :-) I surely hope no need will arise for it's return... fingers are crossed, as with any online purchase I make :-)
 
Btw, I know Buck made some blade material changes on their 110, until landing their current use of 420hc.... Do any of you have an idea what stainless was used in making LB7 knives? Thanks :-)
 
I think you will find the LB7 to be a burlier cousin to the 110. Much more stout in my opinion, and comparisons.
 
I am excited about adding it to the collection... That one is on it's way to me... and will also be expecting knives from Canal Street and Buck (being that I sent one of each back to those firms)... I will definitely share pics and my impressions of them all as they arrive :-)
 
Hmm.. I've always been told that the 440c (with all heat treating and such being of equal quality) that it is better in most regards over a 440a on user knives. But, I have never read much on 440a vs 420hc (with heat treating being of equal quality)? Any input you guys can share with me? Thanks in advance :-)
 
Actually... if this latest knife coming my way is made of 440a.... then it will add to my collection diversity... there is already 440c, D2, 1095, 420hc, CV, and now this likely 440a... I like representations of different materials in my collection :-)
 
PocketKnifeJimmy said:
Hmm.. I've always been told that the 440c (with all heat treating and such being of equal quality) that it is better in most regards over a 440a on user knives. But, I have never read much on 440a vs 420hc (with heat treating being of equal quality)? Any input you guys can share with me? Thanks in advance :-)
Click to expand...

I'm no steel expert by any stretch. Take what you read here with a grain of salt.

In my simpleton view, one way to distinguish steels is by the size of the carbides in the steel. Fine grained steel can form a very keen edge while large carbides can give a "toothy" edge. Which is best depends on preference and what kind of materials you cut often. My sense is that folks who work with wood or vegetables like keen edges while folks who process meat or cut rope like a "toothy" edge. A good visual of the differences can be seen here:
http://www.smt.sandvik.com/en/products/strip-steel/strip-products/knife-steel/knife-steel-knowledge/

Joe Talmadge, author of this sites's Blade Steel FAQ puts 440A, 420HC and Sandvic 12C27 in the same camp.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/368828-Steel-FAQ

I believe that most folks consider 440C as a large carbide steel.

In my experience, 440C when heat treated to 58Rc is very abrasion resistant and will hold an edge for a long time. But, the large carbides make using a normal (soft) stone difficult when resharpening.

My experience with 440A, 12C27 and 420HC is that the feel of the stuff depends entirely on the heat treatment. If hardened to the 58Rc range, they sharpen up well to a fine edge easily. If not hardened this much, they can form persistent "wire edge" burrs which make honing a challenge. I have to work harder sharpening Case SS (reportedly 420HC at 56Rc) than Buck's 420HC (reportedly 58Rc) and have to work much harder honing Victorinox's Inox.

I have limited experience with Schrade's 440A. Seems to sharpen up well enough. I've read different things about their target Rc and on their consistency. But overall I think the reputation is very good.

Short version... I think you can feel good about Schrade's 440A, especially for EDC types of uses. I would tend to think of it as close to current Buck 420HC, although probably not *quite* as good just on the merits of Buck's heat treatment. (I believe 420HC is favored because it can be stamped, lowering production costs.) I think the comparison of 440A to 440C is more of an apples to oranges thing.

Hope this helps
 
Hmm... thanks! :-) As for 420hc being stamped... would that mean that the others are forged or something?
By my saying "or something".. I mean, forged, laser cut.... or some other method outside of stamped out :-)
 
Last edited:
pinnah said:
If I understand correctly, it will be 440A if it is old. Possibly 420HC if newer.

Lots of great information here.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/378164-Schrade-Blade-Steels?highlight=420HC
Click to expand...

It is said that in the late 90s, Schrade changed to 420HC for "Schrade +" steel.

Prior to that, "Schrade +" was 440A

PocketKnifeJimmy said:
Hmm.. I've always been told that the 440c (with all heat treating and such being of equal quality) that it is better in most regards over a 440a on user knives. But, I have never read much on 440a vs 420hc (with heat treating being of equal quality)? Any input you guys can share with me? Thanks in advance :-)
Click to expand...

If hardened to the same hardness the performance of 440A and 420HC should be pretty similar. I've never done a side by side test on that pair, but that would be my expectation. Both Buck 420HC and Schrade 440A are about a 58HRC.


PocketKnifeJimmy said:
Hmm... thanks! :-) As for 420hc being stamped... would that mean that the others are forged or something?
By my saying "or something".. I mean, forged, laser cut.... or some other method outside of stamped out :-)
Click to expand...

420HC is soft enough in the annealed condition to be fine blanked (stamped). 440 series alloys pretty have to be cut to shape, although I am told that if you have a big enough press you can fine blank 440A. There are a number of methods for cutting sheet steel these days such as EDM, laser, water jet. Prior to those each blade had to be machined from a sheet of steel.

Forging is completely different. "Forging" is pounding into shape. (Think black smith.)
 
I actually almost bought one today, a nice old man at a flea market had an LB7 along with plenty of other old pocket knives. (Schrade, Camillus, Keen Kutter, Opinel, and much more!)

I was in heaven. I ended up buying these:






10 points to whoever can guess the knives! (besides the stilleto)
 
Nice, cjz :-) And as far as forging blades, I guess the firms no longer do such things, but that was the way back in the day... was kinda hoping someone still did it not too long ago... wishful thinking on my part, I guess. Now that (forging a pocket knife blade) is "old school" ...... lol! ;-)
 
Hot stamping has a lot of similarities to machine forging. It's not the same as hammer forging (blacksmith) but there were machines that hammer forge barrels (repeatedly striking them) and I suppose there could have been such machines for knife blades. The advantage of forging is alignment of the steel grains, particularly at the edges of the stamping.
 
I am pretty sure that any pocket knife blades that were being forged, before stamping blades from sheet steel became the norm, were likely done by drop forging. But again... that is probably too old school (read expensive) to be done at all now.
 
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