Alright... please give me SWORDS 101

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FliGuyRyan

Joined
Dec 2, 2005
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I'm totally out of the loop when it comes to swords, but I would like to know what makes a good sword compared to a bad one? What are the different types, and I'm especially interested in Oriental-type swords - I'm guessing Katanas.

The swords that are bought usually, are they actually "usable?" Meaning, would they actually cut something, or are they dull?

Please give me some Swords 101... :)

Thanks,
Cleary
 
Kind of hard to give swords 101... but I'll give it a go by discussing the VERY basics (read, horribly, terribly simplified).

Katana is a shortened name for uchigatana, a blade worn edge up on the left hip shoved between the belt and clothes (various manners of attachment including a hook on the scabbard - think IWB knife sheath clip), versus tachi, a cavalry (typically) sword worn from hangers from the belt (they're actually usually about the same length blade-wise). There was also a short period of the nodachi or field sword, generally considered too heavy and awkward to waste the huge amount of steel needed. Was useful in some applications though.

Useability: there are non-steel swords used solely for practicing forms without any contact whatsoever. They are called iaito and are typically made from aluminum alloys in Japan (anti-weapon law dictates as such). There are some Chinese manufacturers that make iaito out of either carbon or stainless steel. Some actually are "useable", for cutting, like the steel iaito from Swordstore. That said, a great deal of iaito have a dulled edge and a usually somewhat pointy tip. Shinken is the general term for a Japanese-style sword that is designed and made to be used for cutting as well as other martial arts practice (not XMA). However it is debated that shinken should only apply to 'real' swords made in Japan...

Here: http://home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/nihonto.htm
 
Thanks for the insight. It was very helpful, and history is always interesting. I was curious though... could a genuine Katana cut a man in half? This is pure curiousity, and I don't plan on doing it by the way, lol... just asking.

Thanks again,
Cleary
 
Any well-made sword is capable of doing horrific things to human bodies... one of the ways katana were tested was to slice through the bodies of convicts. On some old swords you'll see an inscription on the tang stating that the sword was able to cut through x number of bodies, or body parts. I'm sure European swords could match this feat, given that you used a cutting blade rather than a thrust-optimized piece. I'm just not aware of any equivalent medieval testing routines.

Of course skill matters as much as the weapon for feats like this - give an amateur a Kotetsu and he probably wouldn't make it cleanly through an arm, much less a body. :)
 
Man... where do you guys learn this stuff? That is great info... are there any books about the history of oriental swords, and swords in general?

Thanks to the utmost!
-Cleary
 
Loki said:
I suggest you go over to http://www.swordforum.com/ and do some reading. :D
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Oh come on, that's the easy way out :D.
Nevertheless: regarding the body cutting: it all depends, cutting through flesh is relatively easy, as is the neck or wrists (not the forearm - takes a bit more effort there). However...... the stories of "testing swords" on prisoners is also particularly in recent memory - the Nanking atrocities? Or the many stories never translated into English?
http://forums.swordforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=59851 Fear the cheesecake.
 
Loki said:
I suggest you go over to http://www.swordforum.com/ and do some reading. :D
Click to expand...

This is a good place to go, especially if you are interested in Japanese swords. Read lots of stuff and use the search engine.

There's a lot of modern 'mystique' associated with Japanese swords, much of it derived from movies and anime. A well-made katana is a very good sword, but it's just that, a very good sword. It is neither inately superior, nor inferior, to a very well-made European style sword.

Another extremely good site to visit (my personal favorite for swords) is http://www.myarmoury.com/ . The content on myarmoury is more centered around European weapons, but the content will keep you busy for many days and you will learn a heck of a lot about swords. :) Read lots of stuff and use the search engine.

Good luck,

Mark
 
senoBDEC said:
Oh come on, that's the easy way out :D.
Nevertheless: regarding the body cutting: it all depends, cutting through flesh is relatively easy, as is the neck or wrists (not the forearm - takes a bit more effort there). However...... the stories of "testing swords" on prisoners is also particularly in recent memory - the Nanking atrocities? Or the many stories never translated into English?
http://forums.swordforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=59851 Fear the cheesecake.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the link.

That was an interesting read.



B.
 
www.netsword.com

Emphasis is on medieval-european swords. A some on de-claiming the "inate" superiority of japanese blades (not bad-mouthing, just (mostly) correcting myths and exagerations.

I post there under the same handle--Spend some days going through here, you'll learn a LOT

Also, www.arma.com Strong opinions strongly expressed. Look FIRST under the articles section for Hank Reinhardt's classic essay (published circa 1986) "There is No "Best" Sword"
 
Just to let you know, its difficult to figure out who's BSing and whatnot on any forum, be it knifes, swords, or guns.... so its usually a good idea to take what's said with a grain of salt. Some people I KNOW you should listen to on SFI are the moderators and any SFI Educational Advisers, they're smart, sometimes unctuous, and know quite a bit about swords, whether historically, through study of the martial aspects, or construction and performance (and often a combination of the above). Regarding nihonto, obviously "Rich S" or Dr. Richard Stein is an excellent person to listen to. Guido Schiller (sp?) is also a good resource.
 
Lion of Narnia said:
Here is the direct link to Hank Reinhardt's essay "There is No "Best" Sword":

http://www.thearma.org/essays/nobest.htm

If there ever is a introductory chapter to "Swords 101" this essay will be IT.
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BTW, Hank is registered on www.myarmoury.com. If you still have any questions after reading his article, you should be able to contact him there; he probably has contact info on the ARMA site as well. we've exchanged a couple of PMs; he's a really nice guy and enjoys sharing his knowledge.
 
Although incomplete, these articles are probably also a nice intro to swords: http://forums.swordforum.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=32
Hank Reinhardt's essay is pretty good, though it is from the perspective of a WMA practioner AND as will all such articles is simplified.... still a very good article though. Some ARMA stuff doesn't make sense (such as the physics of cutting) though it somewhat approximates current studies.

Mail wasn't always unhardened, just not hardened to the point of being brittle. Riveted mail is also generally considered best. And yeah, mail works darn well against sword cuts and thrusts. You'd likely get a massive bruise (if you're not wearing padding underneath as you should)... but better than dying.
However, full harness could be unhardened pig iron or hardened steel... it's odd how you cannot tell just by the external fanciness (assuming price = complexity).
 
names and uses

katana: used for cuting and some stabs
broad swords: heavy chopers and some stabing
Chinea swords: stabing mostly
Chines broad swords: heavy chopers
viking swords: same as the broad swords
scimmatar (spell chech): sliceing and choping

hope that helps you (some one corect me if im wrong)
 
Okieforger said:
names and uses

katana: used for cuting and some stabs
broad swords: heavy chopers and some stabing
Chinea swords: stabing mostly
Chines broad swords: heavy chopers
viking swords: same as the broad swords
scimmatar (spell chech): sliceing and choping

hope that helps you (some one corect me if im wrong)
Click to expand...

Where would one begin....... www.dictionary.com ???
 
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