Altoids Kit

J

jawilder

Joined
Jun 27, 2006
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I'm putting together a few survival/fire kits to sell and would like your advice. Here's what I have so far: Small knife made with 1095 carbon steel with kydex sheath, 3/16" ferro rod with 36" of duct tape for a handle, small piece of fatwood, and a ranger band. I'm sure this has been gone over many times before but is there anything that absolutely MUST be in a kit like this?

And I don't know if it I am allowed to ask this question or not, but what would be a fair price for something like this? I don't see them come up for sale very often so perhaps there's not enough market?

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This may or may not be considered heresy on this forum, but I would ditch the small knife. Any cutting blade that would fit in an Altoids tin would be too small to be of any practical use. And besides, most people have a decent knife on them when they head out. Were it me I would lose that and add one or more (even all) of the items below:

  • Button compass
  • Signal mirror
  • Chapstick
  • Tiny flashlight, like the DQG Fairy

Every one of those items would easily fit in an Altoids tin, but those selections are based solely upon the type of things I find useful. YMMV.
 
If you do remove the knife, maybe add a razor blade? it would be smaller but just as slicey, which is what you want in a small blade anyway. I would focus on fire, putting in your ferro rod but also consider adding one of the micro Bic lighters. Thats more than likely what youd want in an emergency, and its two different methods of starting a fire.

Look into the things that can be flattened, like ziplocs for carrying water, aluminum foil for reflecting/cooking, things of that nature that can be flattened therefore adding more space.

Next id say fishing line for sure. you can comfortably fit a good amount of it, or even floss, which becomes invaluable as a cordage.

Fishing hooks, needles, etc that can be used for multiple purposes

Water purifying tabs, and maybe some basic medicine or blood clot powder

WHISTLE...extremely important but often overlooked, you can find flat ones like what TOPS gives with their knives

You can look up how to make mini candles with cotton balls, which burn for like 5 minutes. Or just add cotton balls, either way itll catch a spark

Trick candles, just heard about this...they dont blow out, so thats good to use in weather

Really just anything multi purposed. But just be sure to look at it as a way to make surviving easier. I always see ferro rods and such like that when a simple bic more times than not would work better and last long enough to get rescued. Another thing is that people often overlook the fact that having batteries in a survival kit could prevent you having to "survive" at all. Put a couple AA and AAA batteries in one side, and when someones GPS dies, they can have a backup! Good luck!
 
OK , that knife .. where did you get it ? I have been hunting for something like that for ages .

Im all for having it there .. I know its not as good as a regular knife , but thats not the point
the fire lighting gear isnt as good as ya regular lighting gear either , same with the bandiad ( if there IS one ) not being as good as a regular first aid kit .. but when you have nothing else its a serious help . Its kind of the whole reason for a mini kit in a tin in the first place :)
 
I think he is asking what to ask for pricing on his knife and kit he made. Not if he should ditch the knife.
 
I think your kit is fine as it. Most people like to add their own stuff. By adding more items you are increasing the price and maybe turning off more customers. I like the idea of a knife and small ferro rod sized to the tin. Then I can add my own components to meet me needs. This would make a nice small emergency fire kit as well.

Love it
 
Myal said:
OK , that knife .. where did you get it ? I have been hunting for something like that for ages.
Click to expand...
I made it. Send me a pm, email, or hit me on Facebook (link below).

panzertroop said:
I think your kit is fine as it. Most people like to add their own stuff. By adding more items you are increasing the price and maybe turning off more customers. I like the idea of a knife and small ferro rod sized to the tin. Then I can add my own components to meet me needs. This would make a nice small emergency fire kit as well.
Love it
Click to expand...

This is kind of what I was wondering. Should I keep it bare bones - things that are hard to get (such as fat wood) and then let people customize their own kits as needed. OR should I deck it out to be ready made and then charge more. For right now I'm thinking $50 for the kit as is but don't know if that is a good ballpark figure. I don't know of any other carbon fixed blade knives being sold.
 
Couple of thoughts...

I agree about the small knife. Razor blade is better. X-Acto makes slant edge blades that can be used as arrow heads. Handy. Put a five pack in there.

Would actually ditch the ferro rod. Too heavy. In a tough situation would rather have a lighter and those "trick" candles that you can't blow out. The Dollar store near be sells packs of 5. Really great on a windy day. Could put a peanut lighter in there. People like those. Mini Bic is good too.

Ditch the fatwood. Can find that in the field.

Also, one of those credit card sized magnifying glasses. Weighs nothing, takes up no space and it's a great backup for fire making.

Drill the hole for the tin to be used for char-cloth. Maybe even pre-burn the tin to remove the bright colors and product information.

Have seen a few pieces of duct or electrical tape layered into the inside of the cover.

Could do a micro finishing kit inside using an Altoids Smalls tin.

Those small compasses are great - if you can find accurate ones.

Would pay $20-$25 for a thought out kit.
 
I like the knife so I vote for it to stay.

So what else that hasn't been said? Fish hooks and line, snare wire, purification tabs or a filter straw (if one fits), small plastic bag or two, a length of para/fire cord, whistle, P38 opener?
 
Danke42 said:
I like the knife so I vote for it to stay.

So what else that hasn't been said? Fish hooks and line, snare wire, purification tabs or a filter straw (if one fits), small plastic bag or two, a length of para/fire cord, whistle, P38 opener?
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The P38 is a good idea.

I can't understand why anyone would prefer a razor blade over a knife. Can a razor blade baton through wood? Can it do any light prying? About the only thing a razor can do is cut fishing line and dig out splinters. A razor would be a LAST ditch effort but is in no way better than a small knife - my .02 worth.

I like the candle idea but I live in TX and it wouldn't take long for them to be a melted mess in the summer time.

Concerning a small bic, I agree that would be a faster way to start fires, but I feel that a fero rod is less prone to failure. A broken or empty bic isn't very useful.
 
If its going to be a shipped product, that limits some of your fire-starters, trick candles and bics might be out. I'd add a whistle as mentioned. Any sort of water purifier adds complexity, and a shelf life to your product, others can add it if they want. I'd never want to store a knife and chlorine purifier tabs in the same container, one failure of the wrapping, and you have a major corrosion problem.

Focusing on the knife, If it has a 90degree spine for striking the ferro rod, that allows the person to save the edge. Also, would it be possible to use the handle as a "real" flint striker for using flint/chert type rocks? that could be a selling feature of the knife as well.

I'd focus on the knife, there are a few really good altoid tin knives out there, but not many, and if you can hit a very good design where you can profit at the 50$ mark, I think you have something good. While I think the ducttape on the on ferro rod is a neat idea, I can imagine it takes some time to do, which limits you. I'd do something simpler, and easier to produce.

I find kits are always full of too many compromises unless they are very specific, in which case there is no wider appeal. By focusing on a good knife, you can do what you do best, and make a compelling product.
 
gadgetgeek said:
If its going to be a shipped product, that limits some of your fire-starters, trick candles and bics might be out. I'd add a whistle as mentioned. Any sort of water purifier adds complexity, and a shelf life to your product, others can add it if they want. I'd never want to store a knife and chlorine purifier tabs in the same container, one failure of the wrapping, and you have a major corrosion problem.

Focusing on the knife, If it has a 90degree spine for striking the ferro rod, that allows the person to save the edge. Also, would it be possible to use the handle as a "real" flint striker for using flint/chert type rocks? that could be a selling feature of the knife as well.

I'd focus on the knife, there are a few really good altoid tin knives out there, but not many, and if you can hit a very good design where you can profit at the 50$ mark, I think you have something good. While I think the ducttape on the on ferro rod is a neat idea, I can imagine it takes some time to do, which limits you. I'd do something simpler, and easier to produce.

I find kits are always full of too many compromises unless they are very specific, in which case there is no wider appeal. By focusing on a good knife, you can do what you do best, and make a compelling product.
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Thank you for your well thought out comments. The knife does indeed have a square spine and can be used to throw sparks from quartz. Perhaps I'll make a video to show the knife's capabilities.
 
I guess I don't really buy the whole mini kit concept. Yes it is good to be prepared... but if I am going prepared I need at least a small bag.

The main reason being that no matter how short my scout is I'm going to be bringing a water bottle and an extra insulation layer.

The other reason to avoid the altoids kit is that it isn't a very useful container.

If for arguments sake I wanted a mini kit I'd put it in a waterproof container, not an altoids tin. Ideally something I could carry water in or cook in. A little stowaway pot would complement a water bottle.

I'd have the contents wrapped in a plastic bag so I could use the container for other things and still have a way of carrying the waterproofed kit.

I'd throw in a little cash. A variety of large and small denomination bills. Enough for a cab.
aaa headlamp with lithium batteries and a long run time
Laminated emergency numbers (if you don't remember the phone numbers of your emergency contacts by heart)
Small multitool/knife/sak
Bandaids and blister care
Lighter + firestarter
Water purification tablets (maybe diarhhoea tablets and any other relevant meds)
Noodles/tea/coffee
Alcohol stove and stand
Toilet tissue

If you feel the need for fire, saws, fishing hooks and the like you probably need a bigger kit.

Around town few bucks (taxi, bus) and a cellphone (call cavalry) will get me home.
 
The kit might actually make more sense as a "fire kit" with a few core bushcrafty fire things and the rest filled with fatwood.

That way the end user can customize as they like once they've gone through the consumables. The durable stuff is pretty much all personal preference anyway. The main selling point will be how sexy the can is lol. :)
 
Ultimately a "survival" kit must be planned according to your location. For example, money for a bus or cab won't do any good where I live because we don't have those around here. But fire, a way to purify water are necessary if one gets lost. We can easily go for miles without ever seeing another house.
 
sideways said:
The kit might actually make more sense as a "fire kit" with a few core bushcrafty fire things and the rest filled with fatwood.

That way the end user can customize as they like once they've gone through the consumables. The durable stuff is pretty much all personal preference anyway. The main selling point will be how sexy the can is lol. :)
Click to expand...

Ok so then a fire kit. And I don't think anyone has ever told me I have a sexy can!
 
button compass. $30'sh sounds fair...i'd switch duct tape out for gorilla tape. in my experience duct tape peels off rather easily in cold conditions whereas gorilla tape remains sticky...try both on a piece of garbage bag and stick it in the freezer for a few hours.
 
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