am I crazy?

Not crazy at all in my opinion. I don’t use the key ring so I grind or cut them off. I don’t use a bail either.

I think a hollow rivet would be great. I would be there for those who want to use it but could easily be ignored for those who don’t.
 
The old Alox soldier (essentially a pioneer) used to come with a hollow rivet and a bail. It would be nice to have it as an option again as I can see a few uses where it would be better than the split ring for durability.
 
I was thinking of durability in terms of strength and wear resistance when the pin acts as the pivot for the blade. (Sorry if I wasn’t clear about that)
 
jpvjr71 said:
Using the Victorinox Cadet & Pioneer I think instead of a key ring, they should put either a hollow rivet at the base or a bail.
Personally I think the hollow rivet would be better.
Or am I crazy?
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NO, you are NOT crazy!

I dom't know why, but Victorinox puts a different angled keyring on the cadet and pioneer than the cellidor models. The alox keyring nub sticks up at more of an angle an does get in the way in certain grips while using the knife. Much more noticeable than a tinker or recruit or any other plastic scaled SAk.

I took the bail off my old Wenger SI many years ago and just have a thin nylon cord through it. Works much better if want to attach it to something but can be ignored most times. But I would much prefer a bail over the current keyring nub that sticks up in the way.
 
buckthorn said:
Is there any concern about the durability of the hollow rivet?
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Mechanically, a hollow rivet is stronger than a solid rivet.
All the torque is concentrated at the center of the shaft, if your shaft is hollow, their is no torque.
(An engineer explained this to me years ago).
 
jackknife said:
NO, you are NOT crazy!

I dom't know why, but Victorinox puts a different angled keyring on the cadet and pioneer than the cellidor models. The alox keyring nub sticks up at more of an angle an does get in the way in certain grips while using the knife. Much more noticeable than a tinker or recruit or any other plastic scaled SAk.

I took the bail off my old Wenger SI many years ago and just have a thin nylon cord through it. Works much better if want to attach it to something but can be ignored most times. But I would much prefer a bail over the current keyring nub that sticks up in the way.
Click to expand...
I would prefer a hollow rivet for the cord, which won't accidentally damage the blade like a bail, & I can customize the length with a bowline/sheepshank combo.
 
After I bought my Wenger SI in 1983 I carried it daily for several years. I removed the bail because it seemed to make it slightly bulkier in the pocket. (The fact that I accidentally closed the blade on it a couple of times had nothing to do with it. :rolleyes: ) When I started using the SI for canoeing I added a cord to replace the bail, which worked very well (and didn’t endanger the blade.) Then I got a Cadet which I now carry daily, after filing off the key ring nub. (I remove the nub from any SAK I carry often.) I would love to see the hollow rivet on all SAK's.
 
I never use the key ring but there are times when using the victorinox classic, since the key ring is at the knife end of rhe classic (???) If you feed a paracord through it then grab the paracord you create a mega grip on that small knife. Might be overkill for the classix but if you wwre gonna do not classic things or its raining--- how much are your fingers worth anyway??
 
jpvjr71 said:
Mechanically, a hollow rivet is stronger than a solid rivet.
All the torque is concentrated at the center of the shaft, if your shaft is hollow, their is no torque.
(An engineer explained this to me years ago).
Click to expand...

Did he also explain how it takes longer to wear through the wall of a hollow tube than to wear through a solid bar of the same outside diameter? I'd be interested in hearing that explanation. The torque concentration applies to a shaft where torque is being applied to one end and the load is at the other end. For that application, a hollow tube is stronger. That isn't the case for a pivot pin.

I do have a few SAKs with hollow rivets, and none have worn through yet, so it is durable enough to use, but I don't have a million of them out there, and I don't have to warranty them if/when they fail.
 
Jackknife, I think the reason the Pioneer key ring boss is 90 degrees from the backspring is so it doesn't interfere with the punch/awl on the Alox models. The more angled key ring boss on the celidor models seems to be to align with the screwdriver/cap lifter.
 
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