Am I the worlds worst sharpener?

HikingIsLife

HikingIsLife

Joined
Apr 9, 2011
Messages
766
Well. I suck at sharpening. I can get my knives to cut paper decently (lucky when I don't get at least a small burr though) but I cannot ever get them hair popping. I have a Bark River leather strop paddle w/ green and grey compounds...as well as a Spyderco Sharpmaker.

I have knives that are both Zero Convex (Busse) and standard V (Chris Reeve & Wilkins). Do I just bite the bullet and try to locate someone who is good at this trade locally? Do I purchase a no-nonsense, good sharpening system? I have read sharpening thread after sharpening thread (as well as vids on youtube) and I still suck. LOL, help!
 
One word. PRACTICE. That's all it takes, twenty years or so should take care of the problem.
 
Some sharpeners work for some and not for others, and along with practice it'll get better. I am in no way shape or form great at sharpening. But I still keep on keeping on! Hang in there and if you feel you need to try something different just start cheap!
 
Yep. Practice.


Might want to get a couple less expensive knives to practice on though, rather than jumping right into a Sebenza. :D
 
Do you make the knives duller than before you started? If not, you're probably not the world's worst.

Have you tried the sharpie trick?
 
I have tried the sharpie trick when I am stropping, problem is I move angles until the sharpie is gone, then I have no more sharpie to guide me! LOL.
 
HikingIsLife said:
I have tried the sharpie trick when I am stropping, problem is I move angles until the sharpie is gone, then I have no more sharpie to guide me! LOL.
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How often do you stop sharpening to look at the edge? It'll kill you if you do it too often. To yablanowitz' one word I would add another, patience.
 
I'm a little confused by your statement that you're lucky when you don't get a small burr. You should be getting a burr as you go through whatever your progression is, from coarser to finer. In the end, you refine the edge to a level where the burr disappears. In your case, by use of the strop, loaded with black then green compound. You should be raising the spine of the knife so that you are touching the edge on each stroke. You should be using no pressure on the knife. Just the weight of the knife itself. Using pressure may explain why you never reach "sharp".

As stated by others, practice is the key.
 
You might also want to consider picking up the diamond Sharpmaker rods. Depending on what sort of shape your bevel is in, it might be helpful to reshape/thin them out.
 
I challenge you for the title of the worst sharpener. Can you use your practice blade to scratch an itch without breaking skin?
 
yablanowitz said:
One word. PRACTICE. That's all it takes, twenty years or so should take care of the problem.
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Exactly. I'm only 25, but have been freehand sharpening for about 17 of those years. I was just okay for quite a while, now hair whittling edges are standard. It really all comes down to understanding the concepts of exactly what you're doing (apexing anan edge and refining it) and getting a feel for exactly how it should feel when you're doing it right.

With that said, the sharpmaker is a very good but limited system. It works excellently if your bevel is at or below 40° inclusive, but extremely frustrating if your edge is greater than 40°. The sharpmaker stones, even the diamond ones, are not nearly aggressive enough for serious reprofiling work.

As mentioned above, the sharpie trick works wonders in terms of finding out just where you're at with your edge. Mark the edge with sharpie and make a few passes on your sharpmaker. If the marker is not removed from the very apex of your edge your edge is greater than the angle of your sharpmaker rods and you will need to reprofile the edge to anything under 40 ° inclusive in order for your sharpmaker to work effectively. You can compensate for a wider bevel by slightly tilting the blade away from the stones as you make your passes trying to keep that angle consistent with each pass. However, a reprofile will definitely make things easier.
 
For the first year and a half of my first Sebenza (BG42) I could not sharpen it with my Sharpmaker. I always took it to a pro. But I kept practicing with a Swiss Army Knife. Now I don't personally know anyone who can put a better or nicer looking edge on a knife than me. I have never stropped a knife, so I can't help there but I've been using a Sharpmaker for over ten years now. Permanent Marker + Sharpmaker. First rule is make LIGHT strokes! (Little more than the weight of the knife) Do 20 strokes at 40degs then check where you are removing the marker/steel. If its not removing marker at the edge, try 30degs. If that doesnt do it you're gonna have to reprofile or try another system. Personally I have/would reprofile as I find 30-40 inclusive degrees ideal. I have the diamonds & they are certainly not miracle workers but work WAY faster than the med stones. But it also takes a lot to remove the coarse marks on the edge.

A practically foolproof method is to sharpen the sh!t outta it at 40degs (med & fine stones) until you can cut paper. This should be sharp but very weak (burr/wire edge). Now sharpen 20 stokes on the flats of each med
& fine stones at 30degs, removing the burr. You should have a sharp, stout edge! (Sometimes this can take over an hour).
 
archieblue said:
For the first year and a half of my first Sebenza (BG42) I could not sharpen it with my Sharpmaker. I always took it to a pro. But I kept practicing with a Swiss Army Knife. Now I don't personally know anyone who can put a better or nicer looking edge on a knife than me. I have never stropped a knife, so I can't help there but I've been using a Sharpmaker for over ten years now. Permanent Marker + Sharpmaker. First rule is make LIGHT strokes! (Little more than the weight of the knife) Do 20 strokes at 40degs then check where you are removing the marker/steel. If its not removing marker at the edge, try 30degs. If that doesnt do it you're gonna have to reprofile or try another system. Personally I have/would reprofile as I find 30-40 inclusive degrees ideal. I have the diamonds & they are certainly not miracle workers but work WAY faster than the med stones. But it also takes a lot to remove the coarse marks on the edge.

A practically foolproof method is to sharpen the sh!t outta it at 40degs (med & fine stones) until you can cut paper. This should be sharp but very weak (burr/wire edge). Now sharpen 20 stokes on the flats of each med
& fine stones at 30degs, removing the burr. You should have a sharp, stout edge! (Sometimes this can take over an hour).
Click to expand...
You've got your angles backwards. Sharpening at 30° after 40° would only remove material from the shoulders of the bevel and not actually make any contact with the apex of the edge.
 
yablanowitz said:
One word. PRACTICE. That's all it takes, twenty years or so should take care of the problem.
Click to expand...

And experiment. Hit the convex Busse with a couple strokes of the white rods of the Sharpmaker. Try more compound. Try less compound. Try only the black emery, etc etc etc.

One day the mojo will hit. Then, if you are like me, it will go away. Then come back.

If you are getting stuff sharp enough to cut the stuff you need to cut (not arm hair...you don't NEED to cut arm hair), then just relax and play.

By the way, you are doing the Sharpie/stropping trick correct. That is EXACTLY what you want to happen.
 
This super-basic guide might help a little. It's really all about time on task and knowing how to identify problem areas of your edge. If you can hold a consistent angle against an abrasive surface (PRACTICE) and can identify what's going on with your edge then you can sharpen.
 
Persistant, patient practice (practice, practice) propels performance to perfection! :D

Now having said that, in the short-term, a simple angle guide can teach a lot. A guided setup can demonstrate to you, what is possible in terms of good/excellent cutting geometry on a knife edge. The first really good edge I produced from a guided setup was a huge motivator for me to then learn freehand sharpening, because it gave me a concrete goal to strive for. I think it's difficult sometimes, for someone new to sharpening to figure out if they're doing it right, if they don't really understand what 'right' is, in terms of sharpness and what factors influence it. The basics are all still there: maintain constant angle, use minimal pressure, and always make sure the edge is fully apexed (forming the burr is the best indication of that). An angle guide can eliminate the distraction of angle control, while you're working to improve the other aspects. That makes learning a lot easier, in the short-term.
 
It took me a few months of practice to be able to consistently get a sharp edge. I wasn't practicing everyday, only about once a week. Angle control was really hard for me. I came to a point where I thought I'd never be able to sharpen and I should just give up. I didn't and stuck with it. I'm pretty good at it now. For me, It's all about how it feels. If your matching the existing angle correctly, It should feel pretty smooth and rough, if your not. At first, practice sharpening at the existing angle and don't try to re-bevel it. A bright light and a jeweler's loupe are invaluable. You need to see what's happening at the edge to understand what your doing. If you don't get a burr your edge will never be sharp. Also, you can completely blunt your edge on your strop if your not doing it right. If it's sharp off the stone it should get sharper on the strop.
 
Sorry dude...somebody has to be...so maybe it it you.

Everybody thinks that when they start. It is an honest to goodness skill that takes a long time to be good at and once you can consistenty make a dull knife truly sharp, you are still about only 10% there in terms of what you can learn...it's just that your knives are sharper than they used to be.
 
HoosierQ said:
Sorry dude...somebody has to be...so maybe it it you.

Everybody thinks that when they start. It is an honest to goodness skill that takes a long time to be good at and once you can consistenty make a dull knife truly sharp, you are still about only 10% there in terms of what you can learn...it's just that your knives are sharper than they used to be.
Click to expand...

:thumbup:
That's what kept motivating me. No matter how little I thought I knew, if I managed to make my knife a little sharper today than it was yesterday, I saw that as a good thing (and still do). Forward progress, in baby steps most of the time, is all that matters. Once in a while, an 'epiphany' will come, and your edges will make a quantum leap to a whole new level of sharp. That's what keeps it interesting, and why it's most important to just keep at it. :)
 
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