An innocent question from a newby!

B

Balis Edge

Joined
Jan 7, 2002
Messages
614
Hi everyone,

I'm very new to this forum and I am interested in making my own knife... preferably a balisong. Here are my questions:

1. What does it mean to "Tamper" the blade after heating?
2. Is "Annealing" the blade absolutely necessary and what's the best method?
3. Instead of using a forge, can I use a simple propane torch to heat treat a knife? What's the next best way to heat the blade and inexpensive?
4. What size/grit of files are used for file work designs?
5. What size of torx screws are used for the handles and latch, i.e. on the Microtech Tachyon?
6. What's an easy way to press a tang pin into the blade?
7. Like the Tachyon, with two tang pins, how far apart are they?

Okay, that's all... I swear! Sorry to annoy you guys, but I thought that this would be the best place to get some pointers. All advice and e-mails are welcome. Thanks!
 
I'd also appreciate it if someone posted some URL's that I can visit for suggestions on knife making.
 
Wow!

Thanks Dave, the first URL is the best knifemaking website I've ever visited. I've saved it to my favorites and I'll be refering to it as my project comes to life.
 
Balis Edge, one thing these gentlemen forgot to mention, is that we get to see pictures of your knife! :D My seventh knife was a balisong, and I made every part of it at least twice... Those moving parts can be a bear - zowie. Have fun, you're in for a treat!

Keep asking questions as you go, these guys are fantastic and someone always knows what you're talking about and can help. Keep reading here every day, you'll get all kinds of inspiration.

Dave
 
To tamper a blade means to f%&k around with it so much that you end up junking it :)
 
I'll be sure to post my progress as soon as I get my hands on a digital camera. Thanks for the help, any further pointers are appreciated. Why do you tamper, is it necessary?
 
Its actually temper. And yes its necessary. When you heat treat a blade, you heat it to a specific temperature for the given type of steel and then cool it off quickly (how fast also depends on the type of steel). If you do that right, the steel is super hard. And very brittle, which isn't what you want. To temper the blade, you re-heat it following a specific process or set of cycles for the type of steel, and bring it back to a hardness thats useable.
If you want to use a stainless steel for you balisong, your probably better off sending it to a heat treating service somewhere and letting them do it for you. They have the equipment and the experience to do a better job than you could do (without buying all the equipment) and its really pretty cheap.
Simple carbon steels are easier and can be done on your own. But it still takes some practice to get it right.

Annealing, is softening the steel ( by heating it and letting it cool very slowly). You'll want to try and buy annealed steel to make your balde with. If it has hard spots in it it will be very dificult to work with.
 
Thanks Matt,

Now, can I harden the blade by using a propane torch? I will be using high carbon steel. I've been told that I can "temper" the blade in an oven at 480ºF for 15-30 minutes. When I am ready to do file work, do I file before or after annealing the backbone of the blade? Thanks for the help guys, keep 'em coming!
 
I have tried hardening blades with a propane torch. It is difficult. Don't expect to harden anything longer than, say, three or four inches, and that is with a lot of insulating material around it. My most recent attempt was done with a plumber's torch on a bed of burning charcoal, and even then I had difficulty getting it to heat evenly, with only a three inch blade.
You might have better luck with an oxy-acetalyne torch.
For filework, use a set of needle files. My two favorite ones are the knife edge and the half round. With these two you should be able to do almost all of the patterns out there.
Either do filework before hardening and clean it up after with abrasive, or do something like a soft back draw and do it after hardening. here is a little knife I did that has some filework (warning: big file)
my $.02
 
yes you can heat treat carbon steel using a torch. Like Mutant said though, its hard to do a lot with just a torch. If you do a search of this forum on "one brick forge" you should come up with some info on making a small forge out of cheap basic materials and a propane torch thats supposed work pretty well. Benzomatic sells plumbers type torches in a few different gases. The MAPP gas is supposed to be hotter. That might help some.
I would do the filework before heat treating. It will end up discolored, then when you sand the top off of the spine to clean it up, the dark will still be down in the grooves. If you don't like how that looks, you can wrap sandpaper around the same files you used to do the filework and clean it up.
If you can, get in touch with Gollnick, one of the moderators. He's really into balisongs and was writing an article on them. I don't think it was about the actual knifemaking process as much as designing them, and what a quality balisong should have. It would probably be a help though.
 
This is very helpful guys!

What dangers should I be aware of? When I quench the cherry blade in oil, should I hide behind a tarp or run for the nearest trench to avoid splashing? I'd like to know in advance. I am obviously going to wear the proper gear so please worn me of any catastrophic events that might take place.

My Uncle has some experience with knife making, but mostly welding and car repairs. I'll be using his equipment so I'll have him assist me as my guide, however, I really appreciate the replies I'm getting at the forum. If I can sponge as much information possible, I'll likely have more success. I have my design drawn out and I'm in the process of designing a file work pattern. If all goes well, I'll be cutting the shape this weekend.

Hmmm... Now all I need is a digital camera to show off my progress.

Thanks again!:D
 
I've been doing some more research and I got to wondering:

Do I have to beat the S*#@ out of the heated blade on an anvil, or what's that all about? I haven't read anything about that on any knife making sites, but I've come across it on the forum. I'd be greatful if someone could give me a simple answer.
 
Yes, most of us do forge. Some more than others and some much better than others. For my first few blades I would suggest you grind them. Get some scrap steel like you intend to use. I would suggest 5160. Grind it to your hearts content. Also practise heat treating. If you wnat to use a torch, go out and buy or borrow several. It makes even heating easier. I quench my 5160 (and a lot of others) in Crisco (warm). If you quench right a file will skate down the edge. You need to temper then. For small stuff you can use a toaster oven. If you do it inside make sure there is no oil left on it or you will go to bed hungry. Try tempering the 5160 at 325 for 2 hours.

have fun:)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top