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Anorak
- Thread starter Ravaillac
- Start date
Sorry, i am not familiar with Conover or his book. By anorak, does he mean a hooded pullover? And by shell layer, does he mean as an outer layer? For what climate/conditions?
I have a 3-layer Gore-Tex anorak that I bought years ago when we had a The North Face outlet store not too far from here. Being a pullover, it is sort of a pain to don, but once it is on, it is pretty nice. The collar on my anorak is taller than those on my other jackets, which I like. The big tunnel front pocket is ok, but it is useless when wearing a pack with a hip belt.
Just trying to help.
I have a 3-layer Gore-Tex anorak that I bought years ago when we had a The North Face outlet store not too far from here. Being a pullover, it is sort of a pain to don, but once it is on, it is pretty nice. The collar on my anorak is taller than those on my other jackets, which I like. The big tunnel front pocket is ok, but it is useless when wearing a pack with a hip belt.
Just trying to help.
Well, about what is an anorak: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anorak
Basically it is:
* "pull over": no front opening
* goes below waist
* generally with a hood
Now the idea about cotton parka as winter outer shell is basically:
* tightly woven it is windproof
* it is supposed to be a lot more breathable then materials like goretex
* it isn't really waterproof, but it is supposed to be used in cold climate, where you should get snow rather then rain, so it is not supposed to be a problem.
That said, all that is theory that's why I'm asking for people with actual experience with the thing.
Basically it is:
* "pull over": no front opening
* goes below waist
* generally with a hood
Now the idea about cotton parka as winter outer shell is basically:
* tightly woven it is windproof
* it is supposed to be a lot more breathable then materials like goretex
* it isn't really waterproof, but it is supposed to be used in cold climate, where you should get snow rather then rain, so it is not supposed to be a problem.
That said, all that is theory that's why I'm asking for people with actual experience with the thing.
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- Jan 17, 2006
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Years ago I used one in the winter in Oregon (Cascade mountains, pre-Gore-tex). Longstaple Egyptian cotton, super-tight weave, etc. After using it awhile, I got rid of it.
It was very poor at any sort of precipitation, including wet snow, and in Oregon there's alot! Just soaks right through, and then the wind turns you into a popsicle.
Since there is no zipper, it's either fully on or fully off - no way to vent any excess heat. But take it off, and you're freezing.
Once it gets wet, either from precipitation or sweat or snow melting from body heat, or some combination, it was a bear to get off.
Got rid of it before then end of the first winter.
It was very poor at any sort of precipitation, including wet snow, and in Oregon there's alot! Just soaks right through, and then the wind turns you into a popsicle.
Since there is no zipper, it's either fully on or fully off - no way to vent any excess heat. But take it off, and you're freezing.
Once it gets wet, either from precipitation or sweat or snow melting from body heat, or some combination, it was a bear to get off.
Got rid of it before then end of the first winter.
Over the years, out here in the Pacific Northwest, I've had a couple, although they were nylon (usually treated for waterrepellancy.) As we get more rain than snow, except at altitude, I found that they don't work for me as they act as a sweat box. So, can't say as that's much help to you, as I don't know what activities you want it for, but for me, hiking being what I mostly do, they don't have the versatility as a full zip w/hood.
As to the cotton variety, well, they act like sponges in the rain, so a mix of snow/rain may not bode well...
pure snow? Anybody from the Rockies got a clue?
As to the cotton variety, well, they act like sponges in the rain, so a mix of snow/rain may not bode well...
pure snow? Anybody from the Rockies got a clue?
For an outer shell garment in winter I like the waxed cotton like Belstaff or Filson. I also have a Dry-z-a-bone duster that is wind and water proof. A waxed cotton coat can be opened for venting, or zipped /snapped up to seal out rain or snow.
If you're on a tight budjet, get a army m-65 field jacket and rub it down with the stuff they use for re-proofing waxed cotton coats.
If you're on a tight budjet, get a army m-65 field jacket and rub it down with the stuff they use for re-proofing waxed cotton coats.
In dry cold....the Conovers know their stuff. The cotton anorak is good because it breathes while being very windproof and is much more resistant to sparks or heat from a fire than synthetics.
As for venting by opening the bottom and top you get a chimney draft effect that keeps you dry unless it is warm and you are really working. I have two activent anorack wind smocks and a Labrador cotton dickey or anorak that are really great.
Here in the NWT the cotton Anorak is great snowshoeing gear especially when using open fires and/or tent stoves.
As for venting by opening the bottom and top you get a chimney draft effect that keeps you dry unless it is warm and you are really working. I have two activent anorack wind smocks and a Labrador cotton dickey or anorak that are really great.
Here in the NWT the cotton Anorak is great snowshoeing gear especially when using open fires and/or tent stoves.
I had owned an Anorak of that description about
20 years before their book; got it from LL Bean.
It was OK for dry cold.
I read Conover's book, 5 years ago; and wanted to
give an Anorak (cotton tight-woven) another try.
Just about that time, Egyptian Cotton and Anorak
made of EC became unavailable. Did something
like thiscome back on the market?
A tight woven cotton blend would not be too bad.
I use mostly cotton or cotton blend wind breaker
hooded jackets and they work. Some are quite
light and some heavy (army field jacket with attached
hood).
In the last 6 years, none of my cold weather gear has
been put to the test, because our cold spells are
less severe and shorter.
North61, explained the trade off for synthetic Vs
cotton (and wool). If you have pure synthetic,
keep it away from fire, the radiant heat alone
can melt dark colored synthetics. OTOH, they do
not need to be near a fire to dry out.
I was intrigued by two other pieces of gear that
the Conovers promoted.
1)small air tight wood stoves
Never run out of fuel. Cook or just generate
lots of heat, for drying things out.
2)sleds and toboggans
Did you ever ski or snowshoe with a heavy
pack? I have. It aint fun.In a pinch, a loaded
toboggan can be pulled across grass, smooth
rocks etc.
It is hard to say these are under-rated, since they
are seldom discussed. These could be primo for
recreation or survival (short or long term).
frank
20 years before their book; got it from LL Bean.
It was OK for dry cold.
I read Conover's book, 5 years ago; and wanted to
give an Anorak (cotton tight-woven) another try.
Just about that time, Egyptian Cotton and Anorak
made of EC became unavailable. Did something
like thiscome back on the market?
A tight woven cotton blend would not be too bad.
I use mostly cotton or cotton blend wind breaker
hooded jackets and they work. Some are quite
light and some heavy (army field jacket with attached
hood).
In the last 6 years, none of my cold weather gear has
been put to the test, because our cold spells are
less severe and shorter.
North61, explained the trade off for synthetic Vs
cotton (and wool). If you have pure synthetic,
keep it away from fire, the radiant heat alone
can melt dark colored synthetics. OTOH, they do
not need to be near a fire to dry out.
I was intrigued by two other pieces of gear that
the Conovers promoted.
1)small air tight wood stoves
Never run out of fuel. Cook or just generate
lots of heat, for drying things out.
2)sleds and toboggans
Did you ever ski or snowshoe with a heavy
pack? I have. It aint fun.In a pinch, a loaded
toboggan can be pulled across grass, smooth
rocks etc.
It is hard to say these are under-rated, since they
are seldom discussed. These could be primo for
recreation or survival (short or long term).
frank
Yep, that what I was suspecting.North61 said:
I guess that it is the kind of stuff that is perfect in really cold environnement (artic, north canada), but isn't the most approriate for less cold environnements. While we can get some really cold weather here, it generally doesn't last long enough to justify getting that sort of stuff.
Both has been used in the old time by people who spent the whole winter outside.fnc said:
Actually,
Toboggans or pulka are nearly always used by those guys who cross the poles (covered with sponsors' stickers
).In cold regions (artic, siberia...) winter is considered to be travel season because snow allow the use of toboggans which allow a man to "carry" a lot more then what he would be able to in a backpack; and cold which freezes rivers and lakes making them giant flat highways... perfect for toboggans.
From that point, any outdoor guy would want a stove he could carry with him during any season (except summer maybe). Snow and pulkas allow that.
Toboggans and artic stuff aren't discussed here and in other forums, mostly because it is complicated (and expensive) for most outdoor enthusiasts (incl myself) to get in an artic region, but I guess those are quite common around there.
I've used anorak alot in the winter. When it's really cold it's much better than any gore-tex jacket because it breathes much better. GT clothes can freeze on you if you sweat too much in cold weather.
Anorak is also very comfortable and i can have lot's of clothes under it.
My anorak is made from 35/65 polyester/cotton blend, it dries fast and is fire resistant (atleast so far) it also has limited water repellency.
Downside is that when it's wet and temps are around 0 C (melting point) my anorak will eventually get wet, but waxing helps. And i don't usually use anorak if i'm expecting those temperatures.
I don't know about full cotton versions thou, i don't have experience about those.. My feeling is that full cotton will eventually get wet, even if it's very cold, if you are doing anything else than just walking around..
Anorak is also very comfortable and i can have lot's of clothes under it.
My anorak is made from 35/65 polyester/cotton blend, it dries fast and is fire resistant (atleast so far) it also has limited water repellency.
Downside is that when it's wet and temps are around 0 C (melting point) my anorak will eventually get wet, but waxing helps. And i don't usually use anorak if i'm expecting those temperatures.
I don't know about full cotton versions thou, i don't have experience about those.. My feeling is that full cotton will eventually get wet, even if it's very cold, if you are doing anything else than just walking around..
Climate Control and the anorak: If you have a metis sash or big scarf to use as a belt you can wear the Anorak a number of ways to keep from sweating:
1) Buttoned up top and with the belt on creates a layer of dead air and is very warm
2) Opened up top with belt on.... allows heat to escape moderately well
3) Opened up top belt off and open at bottom.... Chimney effect that dissapates heat and water vapour.
4) Off
Here is my activent anorak in condition two...it was about -25 C and I had a hard time staying cool enough.
1) Buttoned up top and with the belt on creates a layer of dead air and is very warm
2) Opened up top with belt on.... allows heat to escape moderately well
3) Opened up top belt off and open at bottom.... Chimney effect that dissapates heat and water vapour.
4) Off
Here is my activent anorak in condition two...it was about -25 C and I had a hard time staying cool enough.
Rav,
Usually, an Anorak has no insulation; it is a
wind breaker, thus its versatility. A sweater
or fleece garment can feel very cold, if you
are in a cold, stiff wind; put a wind breaker
on the outside and the whole world seems
to change.
Think of the "layering system" you add and
subtract insulation, usually keeping the Anorak
on the outside.
Beware of judging yourself against guys that
play or work in the cold all the time, even
though they have valuable knowledge.
Why?
They have probably acclimated to cold and
know how keep moving, just enough,
and not too much (to sweat). Also, high blood
sugar, and psychology are factors.
Wind is one of the most variable elements
in nature, for two reasons.
1) Wind does change as weather moves through
2) MORE IMPORTANT, even if weather is constant,
wind can can be quite different, from an area
that is a stone's throw from another area:
in and out of forests, around large hills, etc.
frank
Usually, an Anorak has no insulation; it is a
wind breaker, thus its versatility. A sweater
or fleece garment can feel very cold, if you
are in a cold, stiff wind; put a wind breaker
on the outside and the whole world seems
to change.
Think of the "layering system" you add and
subtract insulation, usually keeping the Anorak
on the outside.
Beware of judging yourself against guys that
play or work in the cold all the time, even
though they have valuable knowledge.
Why?
They have probably acclimated to cold and
know how keep moving, just enough,
and not too much (to sweat). Also, high blood
sugar, and psychology are factors.
Wind is one of the most variable elements
in nature, for two reasons.
1) Wind does change as weather moves through
2) MORE IMPORTANT, even if weather is constant,
wind can can be quite different, from an area
that is a stone's throw from another area:
in and out of forests, around large hills, etc.
frank
Nothing to add about what you said. And I've always considered anorak to be a shell layer.
Actually my question was more about risks of getting wet from melting snow, sweat... What would you consider the average "cold enough" temperatures, or in what kind of average conditions would you consider that sort of anorak?
I guess it should be at least freezing, and even colder...
Actually my question was more about risks of getting wet from melting snow, sweat... What would you consider the average "cold enough" temperatures, or in what kind of average conditions would you consider that sort of anorak?
I guess it should be at least freezing, and even colder...