Any problems D2 and scandi zero grind?

Y

Yorkshire Boy

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Sep 27, 2008
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I'm going round the various forums, trying to build some consensus, sorry if you keep reading my posts. :o

I'm looking at possibly buying an Enzo trapper.

Has anyone had any problems with D2 on a scandi zero grind (like chipping very easily while carving wood)? Is a flat grind more suitable for this steel?

Also, does anyone have any experience with AUS 8 in a scandi grind?

Thank you
 
D2 should be just fine as long as the heat treat it right.

AUS-8 is a stainless and would be ok for this application, would not hold the edge as well as D2...what model scandi were you looking at in AUS-8
 
The Enzo Trapper.

Enzo offer the Trapper in 3 steel types, O1, D2 and SS (which I believe is AUS8). They also offer it in 3 grind styles, flat, scandi with micro bevel and scandi zero grind.
 
A few years ago I ordered a scandi ground Cottonmouth from Charlie May. At the time, Charlie said that he had no problem making the knife but warned that I may see some micro chipping on the edge.
 
The thin edge of a zero degree Scandi is a wonderful thing,

…but the large carbides in D2 don’t lend them self well to that type of edge.


If you want D2, go with the secondary bevel.

If you really want the zero degree edge, go with O1.




Big Mike
 
Big Mike said:
The thin edge of a zero degree Scandi is a wonderful thing,

…but the large carbides in D2 don’t lend them self well to that type of edge.


If you want D2, go with the secondary bevel.

If you really want the zero degree edge, go with O1.

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I aggree:thumbup:

However, if you use your scandi knife alot and for every outdoor chore, do not be surprised when you roll or chip your edge slightly. Specially on newer knives. Unless you are very careful you will most likely experience this. It is the nature of a zero edge. Yes you can give it a microbevel, or convex it; but it will not perform as well as it did with a zero edge..

The grind angle also has alot to do with chipping and rolling..
I never really used an Enzo, so I can't tell you if their edge is overly thin or not. I will give my oppinion on the type of steel though. 01 is hands down my favorite steel for a scandi so that is what I recommend you get.
 
I have 3 D2 Scandis

2 are Charlie May and 1 is Brian Andrews.

The one Charlie May I had trouble with slight chipping till the bevel was polished out.

The second Charlie May I've used a LOT and zero problems with chipping, but the grind marks on the bevel were less distinct.

The Brian Andrews I have had no problems with either but Brian also seems to use a fairly fine grit.


Here' are a few of my observations take them or leave them:thumbup:;)


First I think given the same angle to the edge as long as there are grind marks in the bevel you will have less steel behind and on the edge than you will till they are polished out.

Second a lot of times when sharpening I have a tendency to put slightly more force on the part of the scandi bevel that is against the blade. This can make your bevel longer and the edge even more thin. I think you need to be fairly careful to put your pressure evenly over the bevel and your edge will be stronger.

Third if you strop your edge a lot, especially the D2 it seems to me, you can actually put a thin convex bevel on the edge that will cause it to roll from side to side and when you hold it up to the light it looks like chipping OR it can be so thin you can tear it off and actually chip it. You want to make sure when you strop it you don't put too much force down on it and convex it to a thin edge like that. You can actually raise the angle and sort of polish that off but you have to be real careful how you do it or you will end up putting a convex on there. Not bad, but like Tony says won't cut as well and also I think it contributes to edge rolling.
 
HD, I am glad you chimed in as you have about every scandi never made. How much edge rolling or chipping do you think is caused do to the grind angle, if any?

I have yet to roll or chip my Brian Andrews knife, but I have every other..
 
tonym said:
HD, I am glad you chimed in as you have about every scandi never made. How much edge rolling or chipping do you think is caused do to the grind angle, if any?

I have yet to roll or chip my Brian Andrews knife, but I have every other..
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Partly the angle.

I think more how you sharpen them and the tempering.

I have a variety of 01 scandis made by a variety of makers and they all seem to radically vary as far as the chipping rolling and tempering. The only Brian Andrews I have is D2 but the 2 best 01's are Koster and Skookum.

The worst Scandi I have I actually had to put a secondary on. It's an L6 Muskrat Man. It also has a very low bevel so that could affect it but I have 2 L6 knives one scandi and one convex by difft makers and I'm not impressed with the tempering on either.
 
If you are going for a scandi enzo get it in 01 not d2....a certain amoutn of chipping and rolling can be expected in a scandi knife the single bevel which makes it such an great slicer and carver is a compromise when it comes to edge strength...this is not a knock against the scandi grind in my book as it is my favorite type of edge geometry to use, it is just something to know abuot your knife so that you can make an informed decision
everything related to knife selection will be wrought with compromises..figuring out what ones you can make and what ones you cant, is what keep us all searching for the holy grail knife.
D2 is very stong and very stain resistant but can be brittle which is not the best attribute when compared to the fragile edge geometry of a scandi grind.... 01 is going to be a better bet imho
aus8? really? in a scandi? many vikinggs are rolling over in there graves right now LOL
Good luck in whatever you choose if you end up going d2 putting a slight convex secondary bevel on it will go along way towards increasing its durability, and not compromise the efficiancy of the scandi blade too much.
 
I currently have a knife on passaround from Bob Dozier. His bushcraft scandi grind in D2. I have had it for a few days and have really enjoyed it. I am the third person to have the knife and there are no chips in the blade. I have batonned, and carved and cut a lot of wood with it so far, and it is still in the same great shape I got it in and just as sharp. I think D2 is great with a scandi grind. You should also look into Brian Andrews knives, I have not yet purchased one, but they are supposed to be pretty great and he does D2. You wont find another steel that will stay sharper longer...
 
I have chipped the point on a May D2 scandi and the edge on a Koster 3V both due to my own clumsiness. I ran the May point first into the flat of a hoe but I just dropped the point a hair more and it sharpened out. The Koster I dropped edge first onto a metal table and caused two small (less than 1mm each) chip/tiny edge roll. I was/am in the process of polishing the bevels anyway so they are nearly gone.

Oregon Knife Guy said:
I currently have a knife on passaround from Bob Dozier. His bushcraft scandi grind in D2. I have had it for a few days and have really enjoyed it. I am the third person to have the knife and there are no chips in the blade. I have batonned, and carved and cut a lot of wood with it so far, and it is still in the same great shape I got it in and just as sharp. I think D2 is great with a scandi grind. You should also look into Brian Andrews knives, I have not yet purchased one, but they are supposed to be pretty great and he does D2. You wont find another steel that will stay sharper longer...
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I haven't used the 3V seriously yet but if the relative effort required to sharpen is even slightly proportionate 3V should outlast D2 easily.
 
3V is some amazing stuff it holds an edge on par with D2 but is much more chip resistant. I have had no problems with a 3V scandi edge and chipping, 3V is allmost up there with INFI in toughness and strength.
 
If you are getting a scandi, I would also not be getting it in D2 due to the ease of chipping that I have seen from D2. However, if you are getting a different grind, I see no problems with D2.
 
I have been beating on my D2 knives for a lot of years, and have nver once, not even slightly chipped an edge. My primary blades are all D2, my hunting partners all use D2 as well, and none of us have ever chipped out blades.
I use my knives for everything from carving, batonning, gutting, skinning, boning, breaking the brisket, yard work, carpentry and kitchen, I use my any on of my D2 knives every single day. I can only speak from mine and my hunting partners experience, but it is a very tough steel. Perhaps, those who have had pour luck should look for better heat treat?...
http://playground.sun.com/~vasya/Manila-Rope-Results.html
Take a look at the numbers here. 3V didn't do too bad compared to most steels, 070 OZ of pressure to cut through a Manilla rope, after 200 cuts, most steels were in the 70-120 OZ range. By the way--- Dozier D2 was 040, the top steel out of the 31 knives tested. Best edge retention.
 
Dannyboy Leather said:
If you thin that edge out enough (easy to do with a Scandi bevel), you can have some chipping and rolling issues...REGARDLESS of what steel is used in the manufacture of that blade.

Choose your grind, if you will, for the task. There is often a lot of frustration on the part of new or inexperienced Scandi bevel users who fully expect that thin edge to compete with the thicker bevels on the more robust tasks...isn't going to happen.

Most of the performance problems people are experiencing out there have little to do with the properly treated steel they are using, but rather with the geometry they have chosen for what they are doing. All basic stuff. :)
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:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

With that in mind, does anyone know the thickness of a trapper? If it is 1/8" (which I suspect) that looking at the grind, I would guess that it is too thin for my tastes.

B
 
Thank you all for your comments.

I'm hankering for a full tang knife with a micarta handle that's also resistant to rust (I live in Britain and it's almost permanently damp here :) and I also like to fish), hence me considering D2 and AUS 8.

I know carbon blades are the traditional way to go for scandi knives, I have a Kellam Wolverine and it's great (but I don't want to take it sea fishing, nor use it for food prep all the time).

Other Scandinavian knives with stainless steel are quite well regarded so that's why I've been considering the Enzo in AUS 8.

Does anybody have any comments about AUS 8 and different grinds?

Thank you.
 
I've used Cold Steel's AUS 8A, and it's a nice stainless. It takes an absolutely screaming edge, very easy to sharpen, but also burrs easily - you have to have a light touch, at least in the hardness range CS uses. It holds it's edge pretty well, not up with VG 10 or D2, but about on par with 1095 at 57 - 59 or so. I've never seen a spec of rust on any of my AUS 8A blades.

I think it would be fine in this application, from what I've read AUS 8A is a fine grained stainless and pretty tough.
 
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