Any thoughts on this Joseph Allen & Son Bowie knife?

J

johnnyha

Joined
Nov 18, 2016
Messages
8
Hello, new member here. I just purchased this late 19th century stag handle bowie knife made by Joseph Allen & Sons of Sheffield, England. It is in very nice solid condition - and includes the original sheath and belt. Here is the info from the ebay ad:

"Hello and thanks for looking, up for sale is a vintage Joseph Allen & Son Sheffield England NON XLL Bowie Knife with Stag Handle. This was used by my grandfather who passed away in 1970's. This listing will also include and old leather sheath and brown leather belt. This knife is in good, but used condition and we hope the photos will add to the overall description. Some of the details of this vintage knife and leather sheath/belt along with the founder, Joseph Allen, are listed below. The 'BUY IT NOW' price is $129.99 and it will be shipped within hours of receiving payment.

Overall Length: 10" (tip of blade to farthest part of pommel)

Blade Length: 6" (tip of blade to finger guard)

The founder of the company was Joseph Allen, the son of a sickle maker, who had been born in Dronfield, England in about 1829. By 1851, Joseph had moved to Sheffield and had been trained as a razor smith, but was working as a servant. He then worked as a razor smith in New Edward Street(1861) and a "razor back forger" in Rockingham Street(1871). By 1881, he was living in Solly Street and employing ten men, with his address by the late 1880s as Oak Works, New Edward Street.


Allen built a reputation for his hollow ground blades. In 1883, Joseph Allen & Sons acquired the "NON-XLL" mark from Unwin & Rodgers, which he stamped on the razors and other cutlery. Many of Allen's knives and razors were often exported to the United States. The US firm Adolph Kastor also paid Allen a royalty for the use of its "NON-XLL" mark, because of the resemblance to Wostenholm's "I*XL".
Joseph Allen died on 22 November 1893, aged 65."

I am somewhat of a novice to knife collecting I'd appreciate any thoughts on this bowie knife from the collective. Thanks in advance y'all!

Johnny

s-l1600-1_zpsnqa2mqfd.jpg
s-l1600-2_zpswlte0yyv.jpg
s-l1600-3_zpsyyum3kst.jpg
s-l1600-6_zpse0toxz1v.jpg
s-l1600-5_zpsq5v6bbqg.jpg
s-l1600-4_zps1zfpzks8.jpg
 
Last edited:
No need to delete thread, someone will be along to talk about the knife, other than it's value.
 
Knives of this pattern like this has been churned out in the thousands by both German, British and other knife making companies.

It was and is a popular pattern. A modern version of this is not overly expensive but due to your status, we cant discuss values, as others mention.

Im not saying, that the knife isnt old but should I be pessimistic, the contours of of the grind stand out with a little too much definition to my liking - for such a supposedly old knife and a user knife too boot, the grind of the knife is usually way more mellow. The edges of the grind would look 'soft,' if that makes any sense.

Further more its easy to make a knife look old.

Slap an old leather strap/belt and a generic old/old looking sheath on top of that along with a story and Bobs your uncle.

Im not saying that it is so, but am a tad pessimistic....

However, others will know more.

Always believe the knife, never the story.

Maybe put this in Bernhards Levine's sub-forum here or a MOD will move this thread.
 
Dunno a thing about op's knife.
But i'll have to agree that it's pretty generic looking
As in the solingen stag "original bowie"s of old.
With the general impression that it is Something
from well before the 70's from the looks of it.
 
Last edited:
I appreciate the input. Hmm… you are correct, it seems like bait "belonged to my relative" type ad, but I was getting it for SASS and I love the looks of it. So, this may not be late 19th century but a more recent vintage passed off as antique? I admit I had not considered the obvious... That appears to be some gnarly stag handle anyway. I can take specific photos if it will help with identification.
 
Last edited:
Someone sent me a link to a similar knife here which I suppose would be authentic for comparison, looks like the same knife and sheath… interestingly the engraving on mine looks identical yet considerably more worn than this example from early 1900s.. The "NON-XLL" on the blade is also identical with mine showing more signs of age/wear. Mine also has the stag on the very end worn just a bit rounder than this example. If this is a forgery it is done *extremely* well everything is identical - http://www.horsesoldier.com/products/edged-weapons/knives/12749.

OK I started a thread in the subforum thanks!
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top