Anyone use a clicker, or clicker service?

O

Omega Leather Works

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Jun 13, 2007
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I was cutting out several pouch sheath blanks that are identical and it really made me wish that I could just click some of these. Anyone use clicker services? If not, anyone own a pro (or home made) clicker?

The concept is so simple, it *seems* like it would be easy enough to rig a clicker from a hydraulic (bottle jack style) press from hf. I know that a small hydro press would only be able to click out small items, but even clicking welts would be a huge help. I hate cutting welts more than anything.

I guess the biggest cost after the press would be the dies, but I have no idea what those cost. Wonder how many of one style sheath you'd have to sell to amortize the cost of a service...
 
Anthony, you need to do some research on die cost. Dies are not inexpensive. If you do sufficient volume of the single item that die will produce then your okay. I had a small clicker (Tippman pneumatic) and I used it to click out spur leathers and another tricky little specialized item that I sold hundreds of so in that case it was good for me. The dies, and the clicker were expensive but the volume took care of all that and it was very profitable. When I quit doing those items I sold the clicker and the dies and have never looked back.

Look very hard at your overall volume and then check the amount of work you do that is exact duplicate. I average about 10 to 15 sheaths a week and rarely are two of them alike, although I just shipped an order for ten, all alike, but that is very rare.

In your case, I'd say a sewing machine (or two) should be way ahead of a clicker on the wish list.

Paul
 
Paul, would it benefit you to have a generic shape that you could then trim, or is that as much trouble as just cutting them yourself? I like the idea of buying a double shoulder (or whatever) and having them send a box of sheath bodies, straps and welts. They can punch any holes and do English points and whatnot while their at it.

Whatever happens, you are correct. I need to investigate further. I know Weaver can supply the dies, leather and most of the hardware that I already use. Other vendors that do this I'm not aware of.

The last thing to consider is if it somehow takes away from the artistry in it. I know that some people prefer a hand stitched product over something stitched by hand, I wonder if this would have a negative connotation. I certainly don't see it this way, but I could understand someone that did...
 
Anthony, 99.9 percent of the customers either have no idea how something is cut out or don't care.

If you have to trim something at all then you just as well cut out the whole thing, and have you ever tried to grow leather in a spot where there isn't any???

I do block cut the piece that contains my pattern layout and then do the final precise cut on another bench later, but each of those is far from a single generic shape.

I think clickers are great and I wish I could incorporate one onto my "now" system, but each sheath I make gets it's own individual pattern and that makes nearly everything I do a one off, the rare multiple order for several of the same sheath notwithstanding.

Paul
 
Well Strig about 95 percent of the sheaths I do are of my three standard patterns: the Pancake, the Slotted or the Horizontal. Two dies takes care of all three. My dies were not made by Weaver but they do live with Weaver and Weaver does all the clicking for me. I don't know who made the dies. There is a local guy here that does a lot of leather work for the studios. He is a friend of a friend. He had to make 100 pairs of boots for one of the Marvel flicks. These were all die cut and we did some trading and had my dies made at the same time those dies were made. Now as you know I work in batches (finishing off and sharpening 32 knives today and then will start the sheaths either this afternoon or tomorrow). I have found the die cutting to be an enormous time saver. I just take my precut sheath shape and trim each one to fit each specific knife. Prior to the die cutting, on an average batch of say 50-60 knives I would spend an eight hour day cutting leather. Trimming to fit takes about a minute per sheath. Takes longer to actually fit the knife to the sheath and mark the excess than it does to trim it. I do receive my sheaths in a box from Weaver. I just had them trim the belly off of two sides and die cut each one, one with each die. Total cost for the labor was $18. Its $36 an hour but they charge by the half hour if it doesn't take the whole amount of time. The most I've had them do at once was three sides and that was $18 too. I agree with Paul that 99.9 percent don't know and or don't care how an item is cut. I have seen leather crafters braggin in their advertising that everything is handcut but they were wasting their advertising space. Folks don't care.

I think the volume has to be there to justify it as Paul said. I always have a few knives that won't fit my patterns or I'm making something different. Those I hand cut but for me and how I work clicking is HUGELY beneficial. I don't think I would click em by myself with a press though. Don't see the time savings there. I can not cut up three sides in half an hour with a press.

I would like to get a die made for my welts, that would save me a lot of time. Havn't yet though, the wife keeps threatening that that will be my Christmas present.
 
Yeah, I guess it's all in how your situation dictates the need. I've got a pattern that gets done a lot, but not so much that die cutting would make it more profitable, just less of a pita. If the die were inexpensive I'd definitely pay the price for the actual clicking, especially on the welts (grumble grumble).

Btw, I may be guilty of touting hand-cut at some point (can't recall for sure). Like I said, it doesn't matter to me, but I'll still tell em it's hand cut/stitched. I won't say that makes it better, but it does mean that I spend more time making it, and that's something that needs conveyed for me.

I was joking with my wife the other day. I told her about the clicking service, and mentioned that I'd take it if only they had a service that could also bevel the eages, and stamp them. And stitch them, and apply the dye... And burnish the edges and apply my mark...

Now *that* would be something. :D
 
So you buy pre dyed leather and they can cut em and bevel the edges and crease em too. Thats how you build your tourist wrist bands. you have Weaver cut your strips to the right width, then edge and crease. Total cost $30 to cut, edge and crease a double side. All you do is cut to length, edge your cuts, add your snaps and stamp Pismo on em. Probably get 150 to 200 out of a double shoulder. Am I good or what?
 
Anthony,

If your doing alot of one or two patterns then the cheapest way would be to have the dies made and have someone order the hide and click them for you and send you a box of fun. A mid size pouch sheath you can usually get 25-30 out of a side.
Dies, depending on complexity, holes, slots, etc, generally run 2-5$ per lineal inch. I have just over 50k in dies so I have a fair idea. A standard pouch sheath die would run 100-150. Great thing about dies is they bevel the top edge so less work for you.
Do not waster your funds on the Tippmann clicker, it is an underpowered pile of crap. It does not put out the rated 15 tons of cutting ability and you get the added joy of listening to an air compressor all day.
If you want a batch of stuff cut and split to what you need you can always pm me.
 
Thanks Skyler, I'd hoped you'd see this because you have more experience (and equipment!) in regards to clickers than anyone else I know.

About a buck-fifty for a die? That's actually not bad at all. I didn't know that it bevels the edge in process. Pretty cool.

Just out of curiosity, have you tried ejection rubber? I don't recall seeing any of your dies so equipped, but sounds like a nice feature.
 
Yes, the ejection rubber is on all the small dies, you especially want that on small dies and ones with slots or tube punches built in or they really get wedged in there good. Make sure they weld some round stock to them for a handle. Makes getting the buggers out much easier without slicing yourself to ribbons. Some of my patterns might work for what you are doing.
 
This is the shape I use most often for non-custom fit work.

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Not terribly hard on the round knife, in fact, I don't really even mind, I just hate doing the welts. :o
 
Welts are easy and only take a few minutes to cut, glue and finish on the belt sander. Of the two I usually go for the big die first because cutting the belt loop and getting it straight, edged and finished is tedious and time consuming. Welts in general are about 2/3 the cost of the sheath die because they are usually a little more difficult to make. A Die maker is probably going to charge you around 225-250 for a sheath and welt die set for that pattern. Add another 50-60 if you have a dangler to go with the sheath.
 
I do have a dangler, but it's just a 1" strap with rounded or e-point ends. Couple of crease lines and edging/burnishing and punch 3 holes and dye and it's done. For the 5 that I did to match those sheaths it took about 45 minutes from hide to finished and dyed straps. Initially I was buying 1" belt blanks to make them, then I went to cutting them using a straight edge. I got my strap cutter a few days ago and now realize that it's one of those tools I should have started with. I bought a lace maker years ago (wretched little pos) and it made me suspicious of the cheap strap cutter (the ugly wooden thing), but it's actually pretty good.

I think I'll get a quote from Weaver. Thanks again Sky.
 
If you have a strap cutter, you have super easy welts.
 
How's that? I've noticed that the cutter will follow an irregularity if the edge isn't perfectly straight, but I haven't tried it on the sharp curves of my welt. Is this what you mean, or do you mean something else?
 
Most all my welts are cut with the strap cutter then curved. Layered sheaths the welts are cut in two pieces, angle cut to meet at the tip, and curved. Reduces waste by a huge margin. I used to make one piece welts but when I discovered the two piece method I never looked back.

Now if for some reason I put a few extra points or recurves I then have to cut that half by hand, the added time isnt really worth it. Unless the customer orders it specifically that way.

My situation is a little different than the hobbyist, I need to find ways to save myself time as time is money. :)
 
Hey who you callin a hobbiest?! :p

Actually, I guess I'm somewhere in between.

A two part on a layered sheath is a great idea. I currently cut welts from a side that I don't mind generating waste from, but eventually that'll run out.

Are you saying that you cut a straight strip and curve it afterword to match the curve of the sheath? I'll try that. I can't do that with most of them, but it'll probably work well for some that don't have drastic shape. After sanding both sides of the welt and tapering they are quite pliable.
 
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