Appeal of thick hollow grind?

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Oct 4, 2008
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If this already came up and I missed it, sorry...

I am curious- what is the appeal of a thick hollow ground blade? I understand that it removes a lot of weight and allows for a very fine edge. But aside from cutting very thin items (rope, material, shaving wood, etc), what would be a good application? From everything I have read and from my own experiences with hollow grinds, they do tend to bind up if you are cutting into anything that reaches the spine of the blade. I can only imagine how much a .20+ thick blade would bind up.

As far as strength, a deep hollow grind (even if the spine is thick) is going to have a weaker edge by default.

With that being said, isn't a thinner full flat or high saber ground blade better in almost every way?

So basically, I am curious what everyone is going to use the hollow ground blades for.
 
If this already came up and I missed it, sorry...

I am curious- what is the appeal of a thick hollow ground blade? I understand that it removes a lot of weight and allows for a very fine edge. But aside from cutting very thin items (rope, material, shaving wood, etc), what would be a good application? From everything I have read and from my own experiences with hollow grinds, they do tend to bind up if you are cutting into anything that reaches the spine of the blade. I can only imagine how much a .20+ thick blade would bind up.

As far as strength, a deep hollow grind (even if the spine is thick) is going to have a weaker edge by default.

With that being said, isn't a thinner full flat or high saber ground blade better in almost every way?

So basically, I am curious what everyone is going to use the hollow ground blades for.

None for me.

Can I ask which blades recently were hollow ground?

SLUTs.
 
Well, for most of my EDC applications, anything will work, I just like the razor-like fine edge it is possible to get with hollow-grind.
 
None for me.



SLUTs.

Oh... well on a slut isn't the slicing benefit enough to warrant the hollow grind? What are you going to slice with a blade that shallow, that will bind it up anyway? By the time you'd reach the spine on most materials, you're probably most of the way through it anyway, no?
 
Oh... well on a slut isn't the slicing benefit enough to warrant the hollow grind? What are you going to slice with a blade that shallow, that will bind it up anyway? By the time you'd reach the spine on most materials, you're probably most of the way through it anyway, no?

I've never been a fan of the hollow grind. I prefer a thinner blade if I want to slice something that thin.
 
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The new SLUTs have a very sharp convex edge, but the hollow grind yields a thin, fine tip, so it would be a light duty knife. The thicker stock does give it a thicker handle for a nice grip and since it is hollow, it makes it a light knife in the hand. So, I guess there are some pluses and minuses depending on how you want to use it.:confused:

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The new SLUTs have a very sharp convex edge, but the hollow grind yields a thin, fine tip, so it would be a light duty knife. The thicker stock does give it a thicker handle for a nice grip and since it is hollow, it makes it a light knife in the hand. So, I guess there are some pluses and minuses depending on how you want to use it.:confused:

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So its a thicker beefier knife set up to better slice more like a thinner knife than the thick knife it is...
 
Much of the benefit in the case of large hollow ground knives is "classic appeal" in that many of the large fixed blades of the 50s and 60s were thick hollow grinds, and there's just an aesthetic to them that reminds some of us of knives we admired when our interest in slicey things was first piqued.

Now of course, the knives of that era were not hollow ground for performance but because it was a comparatively easy way to grind knives (stone wheels cut steel faster than sanding belts) and cost effective for manufacture. Also, while big knives were popular because--let's face it--they're cool and they always have been, the actual NEED for them had largely gone out of the average person's life with the arrival of the 20th century. Unfortunate though it was, industrialization and urban living had removed most people from having to gather wood for fire or shelter, process bison for meat and fur, or scalp anyone. Lack of use breeds lack of expertise, and the simple fact is that there weren't enough people really using the things for anything more than looking at, wearing on their belts while hiking or watching John Wayne movies to find out that they don't work as well as some other grinds----something that a mountain man could have told them after about fifteen seconds of use. As cutting competitions, "survival" camping and just general user information became more prevalent, you saw a shift back to flat and convex grinds by custom makers, and production almost always follows custom.

Still---maximum efficiency may not stir the soul all on its own. The swoops and curves of a deep hollow grind are just sexy. I remember a gal I dated for a very short amount of time who was childish, largely self-centered, not very bright and in short not "the one" but damn could she fill out a bathing suit! Similar situation here---there are a LOT better fixed blade designs than a Buck General but I still have a couple, and occasionally head out into the woods with one, just because I like 'em.

Now, if you were using a knife as a pure slicing or scraping tool (not a likely fate for the average Busse but just saying) then a deep hollow grind does give longer blade life (not better performance, longer life) because you can sharpen and sharpen and sharpen the edge way up into the height of the blade without significantly changing the geometry of the edge and edge shoulder, but still have a very rigid blade because of the thick spine. This is why almost all straight razors have this type of grind--so that very precise geometry can be maintained for precision work, and yet the blade doesn't flex.

Full flat grinds are next in line in terms of this advantage, then convex grinds and saber-flat or saber-convex bringing up the rear. However, all of these other grinds--if you're maintaining the same edge angle--will eventually create wider and wider edge bevels as material is removed and the edge climbs higher into the primary grinds, which reduces cutting efficiency and also greatly increases the time required to sharpen the knife. This can be corrected via regrinding the primary bevels and gradually reducing the cross section of the blade, but doing so requires either power tools or more patience than most people have. This is an issue that only surfaces after a great deal of use (or a lot of excessive sharpening) but I have several old kitchen knives and even an old Kabar that I've inherited where half or more of the original blade height has been ground away, so it's not entirely a non-issue.

One last thing to bring up is that a hollow grind is not just a hollow grind, any more than a corvette is a crown victoria just because they're both cars. Some hollow grinds are done on wheels so large than you just about can't distinguish them from flat grinds unless you pull out a straight edge and lay it on the blade. With this kind of setup, most of the slicing or shaving advantage that a hollow has over a flat is absent, but then most of the loss in edge strength or the propensity to bind is absent as well. Some makers prefer this type of geometry if doing a saber grind, as it is much easier to hollow grind a perfectly straight primary shoulder than to flat grind it, at least by hand. Again, this comes down to aesthetics, but aesthetics are not an empty consideration for many, especially as the price of the knife goes up.

All of this said, I do have to talk about the SLUTs---they are not large fixed blades, nor "average" Busses. Hollow grinds do slice well, and I actually like to see that kind of geometry on a knife the size of an Active Duty or Mean Street. Their hollows are wide enough in relation to the width of the blade that they're not going to bind severely even if used as splitting tools which is not really their purpose. They will cut extremely well in normal knife use, and can readily be backed up by their beefier Busse brethren if and when nuclear-level destruction is required.

So there...that's my story and I'm sticking to it. :D
 
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...... I remember a gal I dated for a very short amount of time who was childish, largely self-centered, not very bright and in short not "the one" but damn could she fill out a bathing suit! ......

So there...that's my story and I'm sticking to it. :D


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Forget the geometry lesson, we need pictures of the girl!!! :eek:


I beat Tony to it......
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Thanks for the response, that does make quite a bit of sense! I did forget to mention in my original post that they surely do have a sexy factor, can't deny that.
 
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Forget the geometry lesson, we need pictures of the girl!!! :eek:


I beat Tony to it......
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Alas, any pictures I'd have of her are on film, in a box somewhere...and I'm pretty sure a later lady in my life found (and got rid of) the really fun ones... :D
 
Some ancient Busse trivia: The Jungle Defender (green-coated variant of the Public Defender) was hollow-ground.
This was the first hollow-ground Busse of which I am aware.
 
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