Are top of the line factory folders as good as custom?

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pogo

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Jun 8, 2005
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Looking into buying a couple custom's. I seen that some top of the line factory model's have the same steel like 440c, bg-42, sv30 Etc... What is your opinion? Thanks!:confused:
 
Which "customs" and "factory" models are you looking at. We won't tell anybody.
 
Also define "as good as" and we might, but I kinda really doubt, we'll be able to help.
 
I think it goes either way really. I've seen productions with same materials as customs but better fit\finish than the customs, and vice versa. I think it really depends on the maker, company, etc.
 
I would say that in the majority of cases the high end production (Sebenza, top of the line William Henry, etc.) knives are going to be as well made as most custom knives, and better made than quite a few. Custom knives offer you the opportunity to get a more unique product. Production knives usually come with few or no options, such as different handle materials or blade steels. If you happen to like a particular blade profile and handle shape, you will be able to get a custom knife made that way. This will not be the case with production knives. If the Sebenza blade or handle are not to your liking, CRK aren't going to make you one to your specifiaction.

If they meet your requirements, it is very difficult to beat some of the high end production knives for both value and quality.
 
Absolutely, the only reason to buy a custom is to get a 'custom' knife to your specs or for some non-utility reason. Handmade models generally offer no performance advantage, they use the same materials as production in most cases.
 
hardheart said:
Absolutely, the only reason to buy a custom is to get a 'custom' knife to your specs or for some non-utility reason. Handmade models generally offer no performance advantage, they use the same materials as production in most cases.
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I agree with this statement.
 
I like higher end factory made knives sometimes. My sebenza is one. But a hand made knife is something special. Your choices of scales material, choice of blade steel and shapes. Plus you get a relationship with the builder. All that makes the knife all the more special.

I cant say I'm friends with Chris Reeve, but I am friends with my custom builders. So yes you can sometimes get a great knife without going custom, but going custom is an experience you will cherish forever.
 
hardheart said:
Absolutely, the only reason to buy a custom is to get a 'custom' knife to your specs or for some non-utility reason. Handmade models generally offer no performance advantage, they use the same materials as production in most cases.
Click to expand...

I totally disagree with that statement!!
I do LOVE my Sebenza's!! They are the higher end of productions, almost custom. A custom knife IS extra special, as the maker puts a little bit of himself into each piece. In fact my collecting is going to strickly CR Knives and customs.
 
hardheart said:
Absolutely, the only reason to buy a custom is to get a 'custom' knife to your specs or for some non-utility reason. Handmade models generally offer no performance advantage, they use the same materials as production in most cases.
Click to expand...

I love this discussion! Pogo is traveling the journey that most of us have walked, or will be traveling in the future. At every step of the way, I've grappled with Gerber vs. Benchmade, Benchmade vs. CRK, CRK vs. Bob Lum custom (sorry for any offenses in my attempt to illustrate a gross generalization with specifics -- I like all of these, BTW).

In general, I agree with hardheart. So, why would I buy a custom when I could buy 2 or 3 sebenzas or WH's for the same price? Certainly not for the raw functional performance or reliability. I do, however, see a high level of differentiation in unique characteristics/craftsmanship. Some of the high-precision, interestin locking mechanisms that Warren Osborne implements, the superb fit and finish of a Scott Sawby folder throughout, the precision of a Bill Ankrom inlay -- they just can't be reproduced on a production basis. Having said all of that, I have not yet found a reason to buy a custom on superior user-focused attributes alone.
 
TheKnifeCollector said:
I totally disagree with that statement!!
I do LOVE my Sebenza's!! They are the higher end of productions, almost custom. A custom knife IS extra special, as the maker puts a little bit of himself into each piece. In fact my collecting is going to strickly CR Knives and customs.
Click to expand...

The key words that Hardheart said are "performance advantage".

Nobody is saying that custom knives are not "extra special".
But is there a real performance advantage?

There may be a very select few, but most custom made knives will not actually CUT better than a high-end factory-made knife.
 
I think there is at least the potential for one performance advantage: A custom can always be treated as a single piece. For example it can be heat treated individually with hardness test at each stage. This is something that even the most demanding production knives can not offer. However, how many custom makers really captialize on these possiblilities, I can not say.

When I read about certain "custom knives" that clearly were not even inspected before they left the shop I sometimes wonder how "custom" custom knives, especially by the bigger, better known makers truly are. But disregarding these cases, I would think that a custom knife will be a better product, simply because it got checked and rechecked (and protentially redone, if something was amiss) at each step of the way. Even the very high end production knives can not offer that close a quality control. How much the quality control is affecting cutting performance is, I guess everybody has to judge for themselves, the margines are obiviously not that large since a $40 Delica cuts just fine.
 
Just by the nature of something being custom, a custom folder could certainly be a better knife - from the standpoint of the guy ordering it, however he happens to define "better" - than any production knife.

The problem however IMO is that every knife is a compromise. In one situation a particular knife may be too big, next time a little too small. Sometimes too heavy, other times just not stout enough. One day you think you need the toughness and other qualities of tool steel .... then you decide to go deep sea fishing on your vacation.

So even that better-than-any-production-blade folder winds up staying at home sometimes. Maybe a lot of the time.
 
I think it really comes down to pride in ownership and what characteristics in style, fit/finish and functionality that make you happy. You got to ask yourself what you want....to have a one of a kind custom that's a little spendy....or to have a production that is very solidly built and functional at a decent price. For me it's a value proposition but the problem is my perception of value shifts constantly. For instance, I once thought that Sebenzas weren't a good value due to their price, but now I'm thinking that they are pretty good value given their overall quality. So with that shift in thinking, I took one more step up the ladder. I'm not sure that I'll take another step to an all-custom collection but who knows?
 
I'm not going to say that top of the line factory folders are as good as customs; however, the need for me to run right out and buy an expensive custom folder is not nearly as great as it once was, now that I have 2 of the limited run Spyderco BG42 and textured carbon fiber Militarys. ;) :)
 
allenC said:
There may be a very select few, but most custom made knives will not actually CUT better than a high-end factory-made knife.
Click to expand...

That's true, but then again, most high end production knives won't cut any better than a good middle of the road production knife.
 
dont know bout quality because ive never even handled a custom knife. but the whole idea with customs is: you get to choose. right? so yeah it would probably be better, the HT is probably better on customs too if its done correct, since they can afford to do a real HT.
 
I have just ordered my first custom yesterday. Its a pretty detail oriented process which makes it very rewarding. I ordered from David Prentice, who is currently a commissioned Active Duty officer in the ARMY. Being an officer myself, his profile immediately caught my eye.

If you carry tools that you stake your life in your occupation, then the tool should be damn special and you should know every single part of it intimately. Knowing the maker, the parts he used and the process.

There is nothing cool than getting a weapon/tool of war made by an actual soldier who is also a bladesmith.

Going over handle options, its materials, and its limitations, materials for the guard, double guard or single guard, the heat treat, the profile, false edges, limitations and strength of the blade, the tang, suitable size, sheath options; in terms of making it jumpable, treatment for the sheath, redundent retention systems, finish of the blade. What to expect from it, what not to expect.

He talks about the tests he has done on his blades, how excited he is to complete the knife, his past work.

He goes over options specific for infantry men, and he doesnt speculate, he KNOWS from years of experience.

I dont know any factory produced knife that will go over all these options like that and make one that is made specifically for you alone. For YOUR job, for YOUR needs.

Custom knives are all about you, thats it. You build a special relationship with the maker. Its even better for me because we both "get" each other, we are both professional soldiers. I KNOW everything he tells me is the truth, because he is a soldier and a man of principle. Craftsman who know every piece they produce has to be the best it can be because the product has THEIR NAME and reputation staked on it.

I never understood the hype about customs til I actually ordered one. Its definitely an experience. I'm getting a product and a service for the maker's lifetime. He alone makes knives in his own individual way that is different from every knife in the world, because it is hand made.
 
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