Arkansas vs. Japanese vs. Diamond Whetstone; which is better

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garytelecastor

Joined
Oct 7, 2010
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So I have been getting to the point in my sharpening where I think I am about ready for sole use of a stone.
I know that the three top are Arkansas, Japanese, and Diamond.
I am wondering which would be the best one to use and will give the sharpest, cleanest, edge?

I use my sharpeners mainly for my EDC and Outdoors knives. Occasionally a hatchet or ax.
 
garytelecastor said:
So I have been getting to the point in my sharpening where I think I am about ready for sole use of a stone.
I know that the three top are Arkansas, Japanese, and Diamond.
I am wondering which would be the best one to use and will give the sharpest, cleanest, edge?

I use my sharpeners mainly for my EDC and Outdoors knives. Occasionally a hatchet or ax.
Click to expand...

I'm still learning a lot about sharpening, but sharpest will depend on the steel (the finer the grain the higher attainable sharpness) and ultimately your ability to apex the steel, not so much upon the stone. Even with a rough grit stone you should be able to get it to easily shave hair, but the edge will still be coarse. You can then refine it further with higher grits, giving it more and more polish up to the point of a mirror if you want. As you move up in grits you reduce the scratch pattern on the edge if that's what you mean by cleanest.

If you're just starting out, I'd get some Norton Silicon Carbide stones. They are cheap and work well on almost all steels from what I understand.
 
My view:
- for traditional slipjoints(mostly carbon steel) I love the edge off the translucent arkansas.
- for working edges on modern steels VG-10 and up, diamond extrafine
- for kitchen knives and to see how damn sharp you can get an edge, japanese water stones up to 8000 grit

Of course all types would work, for example VG-10 with japanese stones is amazing too, etc. This is what I mostly do, because is the better ratio time/results
 
Magnaminous_G said:
I didn't know that.



All of them.
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Well, most of which I have read have promoted these different styles. That is why I said that.
If there is something that you feel is better, please tell me. I really am looking for the best of
the situation, so please help me out and let me know. Thanks.
 
What steels will you be sharpening? That's the most important factor to consider, before deciding on/choosing what's best to sharpen it. Next would be determined by how specifically you'll be using your knives, and what edge finish you'd prefer (very coarse/toothy, all the way up to high polish/mirror).

Diamond would often be overkill for many steels. And many here seem to prefer a simple steel file for things like axes and machetes.


David
 
I think it is partly personal preference.
Perhaps a certain type of stone gives you better feedback and you can achieve a better edge.
I have seen high performing edges from cheap silicon carbide stones.

Diamond stones don't need to be flattened. Waterstones can cut faster because fresh abrasive is constantly being exposed. Ceramics have a good reputation, especially at higher grits.

Each type of abrasive offers slightly different edges. Diamond tends to cut without burnishing so the edge is toothier and a polish is harder to achieve. Waterstone's slurry helps to polish an edge.

There's lots of information about each particular stones attributes if you search this forum and Google.
 
garytelecastor said:
Well, most of which I have read have promoted these different styles. That is why I said that.
If there is something that you feel is better, please tell me. I really am looking for the best of
the situation, so please help me out and let me know. Thanks.
Click to expand...

I think you need to narrow things down a bit. Is convenience/field sharpening an important consideration? Do you need/use a fine edge or a toothy one most often? What price range? Good choices for basic sharpening would be Norton India stone or Norton Crystalon stone, they are tough to beat, even grouped among higher priced alternatives. Can finish with a variety of compounds on a variety of strops.

Overall I agree pretty much with this answer from Lutejones:

My view:
- for traditional slipjoints(mostly carbon steel) I love the edge off the translucent arkansas.
- for working edges on modern steels VG-10 and up, diamond extrafine
- for kitchen knives and to see how damn sharp you can get an edge, japanese water stones up to 8000 grit

Of course all types would work, for example VG-10 with japanese stones is amazing too, etc. This is what I mostly do, because is the better ratio time/results
Click to expand...
 
As a sushi chef obviously ill choose japanese stones.

however just because a stone can be marketed as japanese does not mean its quality.

Natural stones can cost up to $1000 for a small brick, some chefs only touch such stones. Will a synthetic do as well, maybe not as well but for $100-200 its close enough.

Personally I stick eith gesshin because its very good quality and wont kill your wallet (depends).
 
My guess is there is no "best". Anything can work and work well if you know what you're doing.
 
That's a pretty broad question , I actually dislike every single Arkansas I have ever tried.

Synthetics
for speed and mirror bevels it easily goes to shapton
for clad knives the nubatamas are unbeatable

Diamonds
Atoma is the best of the bunch (especially if your on the ege pro) and are the fastest cutting stones on the market , don't have the grit range dmt does though
DMT , excellent stones for the price , wide grit range , still fast cutting

JNats
These can go anywhere from 100$ - 10,000$ , if you know the right people. Some of them can be very difficult to get your hands on , even if you do know the right people.
There are certaintly some nice ones in the 200-300$ range
 
I suggest buy all of them and see what you like.
Unlike Sadden, I love Arkansas stones. (not an attack just an example) They are slow but they can leave a wickedly polishes edge on the right knife.
I love diamonds and crystalons and indians as well. Let's not forget Ceramics.
Have not tried Jnats or synthetics, yet. But i'm sure they'll be great too.
Then you get to play with strops.

You really need to start buying and trying. It's the only way to figure it out. You can look into the 4 inch pocket stones. They come in diamonds, arkansas, ceramic and india and crystalon. They are a bit cheaper than the larger 6 or 8 inch stones but that just lets you buy more to play with. And they are small enough to pack with you where ever you go, so you can always practice with them. The size also helps with sharpening axes. Putting the stone to the axe to sharpen. Also, i think OWE can back me up here, but having the stone and knife both in hand, helps you play with pressure more. You get twice as much feed back.
 
fervens said:
I suggest buy all of them and see what you like.
Unlike Sadden, I love Arkansas stones. (not an attack just an example) They are slow but they can leave a wickedly polishes edge on the right knife.
I love diamonds and crystalons and indians as well. Let's not forget Ceramics.
Have not tried Jnats or synthetics, yet. But i'm sure they'll be great too.
Then you get to play with strops.

You really need to start buying and trying. It's the only way to figure it out. You can look into the 4 inch pocket stones. They come in diamonds, arkansas, ceramic and india and crystalon. They are a bit cheaper than the larger 6 or 8 inch stones but that just lets you buy more to play with. And they are small enough to pack with you where ever you go, so you can always practice with them. The size also helps with sharpening axes. Putting the stone to the axe to sharpen. Also, i think OWE can back me up here, but having the stone and knife both in hand, helps you play with pressure more. You get twice as much feed back.
Click to expand...

Yep , a great post , what you like and what other people like can be totally different.
I have yet to use a good quality arky , probably part of why I haven't had a good experience with them. The thing I disliked the most was using oil. Its only as messy as you make it , but now that I've gone to shaptons and atomas I don't need to try any arkys. Ive got what is working very very well for me.

Try a little bit of everything and see what works for you OP. If your looking for specific results than we can point you in the right direction but I don't feel that there is any end-all-be-all stone or series of stones.
 
me2 said:
Can you elaborate on this, or anyone?
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Hey me2...hopefully you recognize me from a different forum we both frequent. I probably bastardized what I have understood from the other place.

I essentially meant that with a finer grain (like AEBL versus a high carbide steel like Elmax or D2) you could get both thinner and more acute edges (edges with lower inclusive angles), and I also thought with finer grain the edges would be "crisper", ie more uniform and less jagged than something with large carbide aggregates. Taking these two ideas I figured you could get lower force slice and push cuts.

Having said all that, I'm fully aware of the fact that I could have butchered those ideas. I'd really appreciate any clarification or plain old refutation you can offer.
 
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