Audio - Banana Plugs?

[averageguy]

Hi - Can someone help me out?
I just purchased some banana plugs and I can't fit them into the spring terminals on my speakers or on my reciever.

Am I missing something? Any info or suggestions greatly apreciated.

 

[rosconey2]

never seen banana plugs used on clip terminals-only binding post's

pretty sure you use bare wire only on spring clip terminals-

 

[Gollnick]

Some speakers have "5-way" binding posts; it's actually pretty common. The fifth way is to plug in a banana plug.

This is a good way to hook speakers up. Properly done, the two posts will be 3/4" apart and then you can get a double-banana plug plug that will make both connections at the same time.

 

[rosconey2]

sounds like he has the push clips not binding posts

 

[Gollnick]

Yeah, if all he has is Fahnestock clips, then there's no way to connect those to banana plugs.

There are even a lot of different styles of binding posts that don't have the integrated banana jack feature.

 

[averageguy]

Thanks guys - so if I have spring / push clip terminals I'm limited for the most part to 18 gauge wire - that's a pity.

edited - this forum is so helpful.

 

[Gollnick]

A lot of speakers use these "push in" type connections which can't be used with banana plugs either.

 

[Gollnick]

Thanks guys - so if I have spring / push clip terminals I'm limited for the most part to 18 gauge wire - that's a pity.

edited - this forum is so helpful.

Depending on the length of your run and how much power you're pushing, that's probably not a problem. For most home stereo applications, runs 18 gauge is fine.

And, no, I don't just play an electrical engineer on the forums, I am one.

 

[digispam]

If indeed you do have the push/spring type, dont fret.

I doubt you're limited to 18 ga though.

Truthfully, I feel that bare wire isnt such a bad thing necessarily. Electrical current will tend to travel along the exterior of a conductor, thus a bare wire may actually provide better conductivity as there is a greater relative surface area for the signal to transfer from wire to terminal.

This is why wires designed for high voltage will tend to have fewer strands, and those designed for high current will tend to have more

If you are worried about corrosion, I recommend putting a small amount of dielectric tune up grease on the bare wire, insert it, and then assist the spring loaded terminal with your finger for a tight fit. You could also cheat it by soldering the ends lightly. Last option is to purchase pin type like this:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-Vr2jaZqo2KE/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=22113&I=119QLGFPH

I only use banana plugs in applications that require repeated plugging / unplugging (Traveling bands, for example)

 

[Gollnick]

Truthfully, I feel that bare wire isnt such a bad thing necessarily. Electrical current will tend to travel along the exterior of a conductor,

At audio frequencies the much-ballyhooed "skin effect" is quite negligible.

This is why wires designed for high voltage will tend to have fewer strands, and those designed for high current will tend to have more

Stranding is done primarily to make the wire more flexible and durable.

You could also cheat it by soldering the ends lightly.

This is actually the best way to prevent oxidation of the copper surface.

 

[averageguy]

I just noticed my current wire is 12 gauge. I thought it was 16 gauge and assumed I needed the next smaller size - 18 gauge.
If I was going to go bare wire. Generally speaking, what is the largest gauge that will fit most standard spring terminals - 16? 14?

 

[digispam]

There is truth in what we have both said. Beyond that, we will agree to disagree then.

 

[Gollnick]

I just noticed my current wire is 12 gauge. I thought it was 16 gauge and assumed I needed the next smaller size - 18 gauge.
If I was going to go bare wire. Generally speaking, what is the largest gauge that will fit most standard spring terminals - 16? 14?

Most are set up for 16. Some for 14. Go to a store that sells such wire by the foot (Home Depot does actually) and ask for a few inches of 14 and a few of 16. They should be happy to give you a few inches of each. Then go home and make a test.

I use AWG 14 for my home speakers not because I think it sounds any better and not because I think there's any electrical reason to, but simply because the heavier wire doesn't tend to get tangled up in the vacuum cleaner when you run over it.

Also, with a stranded wire, you can always just leave some strands out and cut them flush when you come to the terminal.

 

[alphecca]

In my experience, the springs used in such terminals don't have much grip, and the the contacts aren't very "meaty", so I'm not certain how much difference better/heavier cables might make, given that the contacts are probably the "weak link" in the chain. But, there are a few products around that should help you do it:

http://www.diycable.com/main/product_info.php?products_id=433

http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/audioquest.html#bp

I might suggest that replacing the spring clips with binding posts would allow you more cable termination options, and possibly yield audible improvements, for a modest investment...

http://www.diycable.com/main/default.php?cPath=26_136

'Hope this helps...

 

[averageguy]

I am now educated - great tips, thank you Gollnick. Thank you gentlemen.

 

[rifon2]

Most are set up for 16. Some for 14. Go to a store that sells such wire by the foot (Home Depot does actually) and ask for a few inches of 14 and a few of 16. They should be happy to give you a few inches of each. Then go home and make a test.

Right, and in a hardware store like Home Depot I think you'll ask for "lamp cord" or "AC line cord" rather than "speaker wire".

 

[rosconey2]

i use a home depot 12ga extention cord for my speaker wire-
8 grand or more of equipment running on a 10$ extention cord-lol

besides most low cost banana plugs are made in china from unkown metals covered with some gold plate-and destroy the sound-bare wire like bare necked women is the way to go

 

[Gollnick]

i use a home depot 12ga extention cord for my speaker wire-
8 grand or more of equipment running on a 10$ extention cord-lol

There's nothing wrong with that.

besides most low cost banana plugs are made in china from unkown metals covered with some gold plate-and destroy the sound

People should understand this. They think gold plating is the ultimate. And, in theory, it nearly the best (silver is best but it oxidizes and needs constant maintenance). In electrical engineering labs, our most-critical connections are made with silver connectors, but they require constant maintenance. So, our second choice (first choice actually) is gold plated connectors. So, why wouldn't you use them in your stereo? First, the signals in your stereo aren't that critical. This may be something that is difficult for you to face. I know, you like to think of your stereo as critical and brag about how you spent tens of thousands of dollars on it and don't compomise on anything yada yada... In the electronics laboratory, when we say critical signals, we are usually taking about microvolt signals with gigahertz frequencies and we talk about (and gripe about) how many hundreds of thousands of dollars we're paying. For most everything else, we use tin-plated connectors. Tin is good for most purposes.

The problem with gold is that it's very expensive. So, when you can buy this "gold coated" speaker connnector for five bucks, know that there's very little gold there. The coating of gold on these consumer-grade connectors is so very thin -- just a few atoms thick, just enough to get the color -- that it is actually porus. Under a powerful microscope, the surface looks like that of a kitchen sponge. The result is that the surface area that makes contact is reduced and that actually degrades the quality of the resulting electrical connection.

 

[Carl64]

At an old job (don't ask), I would sometimes shock people by showing them the itty bitty 1-foot wire that connects the wire terminals to the coil inside the speaker. It's usually no more than 18 guage, if even that.

When I lose all sense of shame (not too far to go), maybe I will get rich by starting the next home theater profit fountain: cans of compressed acoustically-transparent air. Buy a few cans and release them into your living room each time you play music.

 

[Gollnick]

When I lose all sense of shame (not too far to go), maybe I will get rich by starting the next home theater profit fountain: cans of compressed acoustically-transparent air. Buy a few cans and release them into your living room each time you play music.

I started a company to market that product, but I'm afraid it didn't work out. I figured that if oxygen-free was good for the cables, then it would be good for the air too. Several wrongful deaths later, the company had to declare bankruptcy and fold.