Axeheads in the woodstove

M

MacCairnie

Joined
Jul 17, 2011
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33
Hi, folks!

I just broke the 6 lb head off a fiberglass-handled splitting maul. I've never liked the fiberglass myself; I like the more easily-replaced wood hafts, even if they give a bit more vibration. But my dad likes them, and it was his maul. He's suggesting getting the remains of the haft out of the head by putting the head into the coals of the woodstove- he figures the stuff will burn and melt away. He's planning to do the same to a sledgehammer head with the remains of a wooden haft still inside, too. I'm pretty worried that this'll destroy the heads' tempers, though, and I suspect knocking the junk out with a cold chisel would be a much better idea. What are your thoughts? Bear in mind that he won't be putting the heads into a roaring fire, but only onto a bed of red coals. Is there any danger here?

Thanks,
Mac
 
Get the chisel out, probably files too mate, anytime the steel gets too hot to touch you've very likely ruined the temper. Putting them in anykind of fire will require them to be re heat treated completly.
 
Yes, you will ruin the heat treatment. The best way to get those epoxied handles out is to cut the handle flush, lock the head up in a vice and use a drill. Get as close to the edge as you can, make a couple large holes completely through the fiberglass then knock the rest out with a small chisel or screwdriver.
 
The biggest mistake made when removing the remains of a broken haft is trying to take it out by the direction it went in.

Remember how to remove an arrow or a fish-hook from the flesh? Cut everything off the back end that won't fit through the hole and push it on through.

In the case of an axe, saw the haft off a few inches back from the eye and pare the wood back so it's smaller than the eye. A few whacks with a hammer and the remains of the haft will drive through easily.

I absolutly dislike tools with fibre-glass or plastic handles. They have nice rubber parts to give grip when in fact it's 'slip' that is required.

regards...Frank
 
Frank-New Zealand said:
The biggest mistake made when removing the remains of a broken haft is trying to take it out by the direction it went in.

Remember how to remove an arrow or a fish-hook from the flesh? Cut everything off the back end that won't fit through the hole and push it on through.

In the case of an axe, saw the haft off a few inches back from the eye and pare the wood back so it's smaller than the eye. A few whacks with a hammer and the remains of the haft will drive through easily.

I absolutly dislike tools with fibre-glass or plastic handles. They have nice rubber parts to give grip when in fact it's 'slip' that is required.

regards...Frank
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what Frank said. he has it right
buzz
 
A nice big brass rod can work wonders for knocking out the old haft ,or anything kinda soft but harder than wood and big enough to take up most of the space in the eye .I drill a nice size hole then get to beating the plug out.
 
Square_peg said:
No fire. Cut flush. Drill. Punch it out the top of the eye.
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Yep.

My understanding is that an average campfire can reach 1500 degrees Fahrenheit within a short time and even up over 2000 degrees when really blazing. Now if you're doing that to an axe head that was tempered at probably no more than 500 degrees fahrenheit and will begin to change structurally at probably around 350 degrees, there's a snowball's chance in hell that you won't impact the temper...even if you bury the bit. That's my opinion. I would NEVER use that method.

Like Steve said, "in a pinch" maybe. I've removed a haft in the field, it's doable.
 
M3mphis said:
Yep.

My understanding is that an average campfire can reach 1500 degrees Fahrenheit within a short time and even up over 2000 degrees when really blazing. Now if you're doing that to an axe head that was tempered at probably no more than 500 degrees fahrenheit and will begin to change structurally at probably around 350 degrees, there's a snowball's chance in hell that you won't impact the temper...even if you bury the bit. That's my opinion. I would NEVER use that method.

Like Steve said, "in a pinch" maybe. I've removed a haft in the field, it's doable.
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I've never tried the fire method, and hope to never be that desperate. I saw it in a book on axes (I forget which). At this point, I'm not 100% convinced that it would always ruin the temper. It reminds me of the "trick" where you can fold up a piece of paper into a cup shape, fill it with water, then heat it over a fire, and boil the water without burning the paper. (I've tried that before, and it works). Maybe if the soil was kept wet, it would absorb enough heat before the temper was ruined by a very small fire. Mythbusters, where are you?
 
ive read that the 'ol timers would bury the bit and then burn out the eye. i think it might be in 'the axe book'. i'll have to look...
 
When I was about 20 I watched an 'Old Timer' knock a broken haft from his bush axe. He did it in the field on the back of an old truck. The only thing burning was the cigarette hanging from his mouth. I became friends with this old man and learned a lot from him. I doubt he could read or write but he was a very good teacher. Old Heck died a few years later and we buried him in Queensland with a well-worn Plumb.

regards...Frank.
 
Frank-New Zealand said:
When I was about 20 I watched an 'Old Timer' knock a broken haft from his bush axe. He did it in the field on the back of an old truck. The only thing burning was the cigarette hanging from his mouth. I became friends with this old man and learned a lot from him. I doubt he could read or write but he was a very good teacher. Old Heck died a few years later and we buried him in Queensland with a well-worn Plumb.

regards...Frank.
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nice! i love your old stories frank:)
i'll shot you a message tomarrow;)
 
Steve Tall said:
I've never tried the fire method, and hope to never be that desperate. I saw it in a book on axes (I forget which). At this point, I'm not 100% convinced that it would always ruin the temper. It reminds me of the "trick" where you can fold up a piece of paper into a cup shape, fill it with water, then heat it over a fire, and boil the water without burning the paper. (I've tried that before, and it works). Maybe if the soil was kept wet, it would absorb enough heat before the temper was ruined by a very small fire. Mythbusters, where are you?
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That works because water boils long before it gets hot enough for paper to burn (212° F vs 451° F.
Generally speaking, steel thats been tempered starts changing form at the molecular level at around 400° F. Thats when the carbon trapped in the iron matrix during the heat treatment process starts moving around. 400° is also where the steel starts to turn blue. A campfire is going to be much hotter than 400°. There isn't much of a way to keep the steel from getting hot and burn the wood out from the inside at the same time. Most woods will ignite at 530° F and produce flame. Below that it will smolder and produce charcoal down to about 390° F. A good hot bed of coals can be up to 2000° F give or take depending on airflow.
 
Arathol said:
That works because water boils long before it gets hot enough for paper to burn (212° F vs 451° F...
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In my opinion, it's not that simple. A flame with a temperature over twice or three times the burning point of the paper is actually contacting the paper for an extended period of time. And yet there is a way to keep the paper from getting hot and burning. The water is a heat sink.

For an axe with a small fire in the eye, and the cheek and bit embedded in wet ground, the soil (and the water it contains) is the heat sink. There will be a temperature gradient in the steel ranging from, say, 1000 deg F at the eye, decreasing in temperature the further you get from the eye, and the closer you get to the soil/steel contact zone.

Maybe, just maybe, at the bit the temperature will be not much above the boiling point of water (if the ground is kept wet to replace the water that might have turned to steam). And maybe, just maybe, at the beginning of the hardened zone, about an inch back from the edge, the temperature of the steel will not have exceeded 400 degrees or so.
 
yeah, it says in 'the axe book' that in emergencies the 'ol timers would bury their single bits in WET mud or clay and then burn the eye out...
 
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